59 replies to this topic

[Bear]

Yes, we all must use our own good sense and powers of observation to judge other personnas here and elsewhere on this Internet thingie. It is quite possible to get in deep doo - doo if you are not careful.

Quote

..My position is that all members should respect the huge efforts of the forum ownership and administration and try to support the forum being the way THEY want it to be, rather than constantly telling them how it should be different. Particularly if you don't contribute much on-topic fossil-related content, or if you're relatively new here. I mean, come on, these guys have spent several years and thousands of hours of effort building this place and you're gonna waltz in and tell them how it oughta be? It's a good forum.

I love my 1 year old car (the first new car I have ever owned), but I need to try and buff out the plastic on the front bumper from my fence where my teenage new driver hit it while pulling in the driveway. This does not mean that I do not love my car any more or that I do not love my son any more, this is just things that happened and the facts involved. The fact that this happened recently does not change anything.

"Science" is constantly cited here, often with reverence. Science is about facts and discovery. If you disallow me to present you with facts that I am aware of, than you deny the science of the discussion. This would seem counterproductive to me. It ceases to be a discussion and becomes a dictation.

Life is change. A public forum must either grow and change in a dynamic manner or it will stagnate and die, just like a biologic organism. I have participated in many online forums and am a passing fair scientific observer. I note what I observe, just as I would note the locale where I found a choice specimen. I have watched forums go down due to poor policy choices. It seems logical to share that stuff, because that is part of what I do under the umbrella of my "science". I do not attach emotionally to the results and I enjoy the discussion.

This is an open debate, there seems no need to characterize any of the participants. There are things that folks should not do, and dealing with that is part of running a public site. As a member, I appreciate the staff and its efforts. That is not the same as having an identical perspective, education or life experience though, nor should it take away from the fact of the contributions that the membership makes. Where it seems that I may be able to assist in some way, like here, now, I put in my thoughts and observations.

[pleecan]

Bear, on 22 December 2009 - 10:23 AM, said:

As a champion of moderation (philosophic), the 50 post rule seems very reasonable.

I am in agreement with Bear...
As a newbie 50 post is very reasonable... within 2 months I got my 50 post .... was able to find and purchase some cretaceous New Jersey amber from a member on forum. The Trade and Sell thread does serve a useful function and the rules that are in place will help guard it's integrity. PL

Edited by pleecan, 24 December 2009 - 09:31 AM.

[Carlos]

Hi there.

I returned to visit the forum after few months and not trades a sales section for me..., guys you are going to make me pracice my english for arriving to those 50 posts. Anyway I think that is a good idea to force the members to be active to use it ^.-.
Cheers.

[siteseer]

Quote

My position is that all members should respect the huge efforts of the forum ownership and administration and try to support the forum being the way THEY want it to be, rather than constantly telling them how it should be different. Particularly if you don't contribute much on-topic fossil-related content, or if you're relatively new here. I mean, come on, these guys have spent several years and thousands of hours of effort building this place and you're gonna waltz in and tell them how it oughta be? It's a good forum.

Well, you do have a "Help and Suggestions" category though people are going to offer suggestions whether there's a category. That's human nature. I did not perceive any of the suggestions being phrased as a demand.

I'm not sure what goes into building a forum but do understand the amount of work that goes into just monitoring all the categories. It's something like a group of referees watching a regular season Sunday's worth of NFL games except that it happens every day including holidays with every play under review. Over time members notice a well-moderated forum. I have witnessed a couple of personality conflicts among the threads but things seemed to smooth over in each case (perhaps with the aid of an unseen moderator note).

It is a reasonable rule that new members should contribute to the forum before they benefit from it directly and 50 posts sounds about right. The average person is probably not be patient enough to offer 50 comments before being able to even see his competition and even a relative go-getter would think twice about it.

Bear does make at least one important point and one is that forums live and die on member content and member promotion - how they characterize the forum to other people. I would not have even looked at the site if it weren't for a friend (and member) highly recommending it. Now, I make an effort to see what's going on here at least every other day even when I'm away on business and my free time is short. I like this forum too and hope it continues to grow.

[mross]

Ah, so that's what happened to it. I thought I was losing my mind looking for it. Looks like it will be awhile for me.

[therieldeal]

i was wondering the same thing as everyone above... i just joined today but i was doing some lurking a while ago and enjoyed checking out the for sale forum.

on all the automotive forums i frequent there are often similar rules, although 50 posts is at the high end of the scale. my "main forum" (that i help moderate) has a 10 post rule.

[hssain]

HOW ARE YOU ALL PP?
how can i get members trade and sale?

[Taxman56]

One more post towards that 50.

If you engage in some fossil banter its not hard to meet that goal.

And theres some interesting people in here and the fossils. I driven across the US several times and while finding a little here and there, I am amazed at what people find in their own back yards.

[therieldeal]

i cant wait to hit 50, i'd much rather buy here than on ebay

[hssain]

thanks for details

[Frank Menser]

Louie, on 22 December 2009 - 10:54 PM, said:

I didn't think taking away the viewership of trade & sale would hinder membership numbers. I was merely guessing that 90% of the membership have less than 50 posts. If true, it affects the vast majority of members. T & S was very interesting & educational to me (even though I couldn't post in it) because I could see what people had for sale or trade & what the approximate market prices were.

Frankly Louie, not being a moderator I can say this...I am kind of sick of the whinning from people who come here just to sell. I buy, sell and trade with members here, but if you notice my post count, I mainly am here to enjoy sharing my interests with my fellow members. If someone is complaining about 50 posts then IMHO they are not here for the forum - but for the market. Personally, I was for at least 100 SUBSTANTIVE posts. Fifty is too easy to do.

So to be blunt, if buying or selling is all you are here for, then I will not miss you when you leave. If you are sincere in your interest then glad to have you.

Edited by Frank Menser, 31 January 2010 - 02:16 PM.

[Seldom]

Very well said Frank.

I agree with the 100 SUBSTANTIVE posts but would add plus 6 months membership.

I have had several great deals with members, but if the trade topic was deleted I would still come for the knowledge.

[therieldeal]

those are some pretty strict rules... its a free web forum not a fancy exclusive clubhouse. not trying to downplay the quality of the forum, because it is excellent.. but, really? what would the forum gain by locking out members from the buy/sell forum for 6 months? if anything you'd be even further limiting the resources of people like myself who are interested in the hobby yet cannot go out and find their own fossils.

that is, unless you can give me a good place to go fossil hunting when there's several inches of ice and snow on the ground, 12* F ambient temps, and... oh wait the whole region consists of igneous rocks anyway.

[JohnJ]

Here's the deal. It is the very "quality" of this "free" Forum that attracts members here. The indirect result is a highly distilled target market for any member with fossils to sell. For a seller (member) to be tapped into this kind of market for the cost of contributing some quality content is a small price to pay for access to that market. It is an opportunitiy to establish, or further, a good business reputation by adding to and not subtracting from why most people become members. Since it is practically "free", it's an opportunity that I would think most would use wisely. Also, a lot "great find" type posts, just to get access to the sales forum, comes off as exploitative and inconsiderate of fellow members.

For buyers and traders, your participation in the Forum gives you the possibility to check out other members in a manner worth the price of admission.

Enjoy the Forum.

[Louie]

Frank Menser, on 31 January 2010 - 01:54 PM, said:

Frankly Louie, not being a moderator I can say this...I am kind of sick of the whinning from people who come here just to sell. I buy, sell and trade with members here, but if you notice my post count, I mainly am here to enjoy sharing my interests with my fellow members. If someone is complaining about 50 posts then IMHO they are not here for the forum - but for the market. Personally, I was for at least 100 SUBSTANTIVE posts. Fifty is too easy to do.

So to be blunt, if buying or selling is all you are here for, then I will not miss you when you leave. If you are sincere in your interest then glad to have you.

Frank, not that it matters, but I have never sold a fossil in my 49 yrs. of life. Who knows, maybe I will someday. But for the last 12 mos. since I've been interested in fossils, I've been on a major aquisition spree. Some of the purchases were from members/dealers here through their ebay auctions...but not directly from the T&S area. As I'm sure you know, it's very exciting hunting for, as well as buying fossils on the market. My family & I are totally enthralled with the fossil bug.

Sorry you interpreted my previous posts as whinning.

Edited by Louie, 01 February 2010 - 10:02 PM.

[Frank Menser]

Louie, on 01 February 2010 - 10:01 PM, said:

Frank, not that it matters, but I have never sold a fossil in my 49 yrs. of life. Who knows, maybe I will someday. But for the last 12 mos. since I've been interested in fossils, I've been on a major aquisition spree. Some of the purchases were from members/dealers here through their ebay auctions...but not directly from the T&S area. As I'm sure you know, it's very exciting hunting for, as well as buying fossils on the market. My family & I are totally enthralled with the fossil bug.

Sorry you interpreted my previous posts as whinning.

Then to be honest Louie, it makes it harder for me to understand why this should be such an issue with you. I am not the most gabby person in the world and I can manage to respond to-or post at least 10 posts a day; which means in 5 days I would make the quota-no sweat. All it takes is enough interest to ask questions. Shoot...you could easily kill 20 or more posts so just saying hi to the newbies and another dozen or so just complimenting in the members collection forum. 50 posts ain't hard at all!

If you were caught in the crossfire I apologise, but if you had been here before, you would understand why I said whinning. This is a great place to hang out and the degree of static our moderators go through to keep this user friendly should be appreciated a lot more than it is. So yeah, when some 1,2,3, or how many mini post person comes in and starts to complain about something they just walked into, I advise, that the rule is there for a good reason-so how about just respecting it till you've been here long enough to understand why.

As for your desire to obtain new specimens, use the 50 posts to communicate with those you recognise here as having interests in your area. Even this forum is not totally free from scam artists, so it is prudent to get to know who you might be dealing with. On that basis, 50 a post buffer might be considered as for your own protection.

[JohnJ]

Frank Menser, on 01 February 2010 - 10:28 PM, said:

.... Shoot...you could easily kill 20 or more posts so just saying hi to the newbies....

Frank, I think your point about it not being hard to demonstrate membership is a good one. But, if someone rattles off 20 posts saying "hi", then I'm not going to be happy about that as a member.

[Frank Menser]

Neither would I John. Which is why I mentioned my preference for substantive posts. Or, maybe I'm just getting cranky in my old age...

[maxfossil]

Hello everyone, I apologize in advance for my English.
My opinion is, that to protect all, to take advantage of trade and sales section, users should have at least 100 posts.
I joined the forum to meet new people and different realities from the Italian one, to share a passion that I have since I was a child in an atmosphere of friendship, things that usually, at least in my country, do not get on with business.
Is precisely for this reason that the forum members should be motivated by the discussions before anything else. For any purchases there are more appropriate places and protected.
Regards.

[Frank Menser]

maxfossil, on 07 February 2010 - 04:28 PM, said:

Hello everyone, I apologize in advance for my English.
My opinion is, that to protect all, to take advantage of trade and sales section, users should have at least 100 posts.
I joined the forum to meet new people and different realities from the Italian one, to share a passion that I have since I was a child in an atmosphere of friendship, things that usually, at least in my country, do not get on with business.
Is precisely for this reason that the forum members should be motivated by the discussions before anything else. For any purchases there are more appropriate places and protected.
Regards.

well spoken...