Ptychodus Occidentalis

[Tony Eaton]

Other than one post from JohnJ where I cannot get the image to load, I didn't see any Ptychodus occidentalis mentioned on the forum so thought I'd post my favorite more recent find in case it helps someone else with an ID. The 10+ number of fine ridges that bifurcate into the marginal area, with a moderate elevated bulbous crown differentiates this from other Ptychodus.

Notice the labio/lingual median line, the other P. occidentalis I've found do not share this feature. Shawn Hamm helped me identify the species. This is from the KWB/KEF contact, middle or upper middle Cenomanian, Denton County TX. I have a few others from the KEF / Kamp Ranch that I am a little less sure about.

Edited July 16, 2010 by Tony Eaton

[siteseer]

Wow, that's a great tooth. Yeah, I haven't seen many of that species. Welton and Farish (1993) called it rare and I believe it.

Other than one post from JohnJ where I cannot get the image to load, I didn't see any Ptychodus occidentalis mentioned on the forum so thought I'd post my favorite more recent find in case it helps someone else with an ID. The 10+ number of fine ridges that bifurcate into the marginal area, with a moderate elevated bulbous crown differentiates this from other Ptychodus.

Notice the labio/lingual median line, the other P. occidentalis I've found do not share this feature. Shawn Hamm helped me identify the species. This is from the KWB/KEF contact, middle or upper middle Cenomanian, Denton County TX. I have a few others from the KEF / Kamp Ranch that I am a little less sure about.

[alopias]

very nice Ptychodus this species is rare ;congratulation , I like it

[Nandomas]

What a great specimen. :o

How big is?

Thanks

Nando

[Mike Owens]

Very nice!

[Auspex]

Beautiful tooth, and thanks for the lesson too!

[Fossildude19]

Tony,

Thanks for the informative post.

That tooth is a beauty!!

Thanks again for sharing.

Regards,

[Guest N.AL.hunter]

Nice tooth. I wonder... if anyone on the forum has a real good collection of different Ptychodus teeth, could they take one good example of each type they have and place them all next to each other in one photograph. The ones that I really want to see side-by-side are these "fingerprint" ones (that is what I call them). Thanks

[CreekCrawler]

Nice and rare tooth Tony.What a great find and excellent description.

N.AL.Hunter, I have 5 different species of Ptychodus teeth in my collection and will work on getting a group photo of them for you.Maybe Tony will donate a picture of his occidentalis and I can incorporate it into the group photo.

[Roz]

What a good idea...

[Guest N.AL.hunter]

Thanks, I will look forward to it.

[Tony Eaton]

I'd be glad to contribute. Good idea!

Thanks for everyones compliments. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in awhile ;-)

In this link is a good doc, although I Barry's idea of a HTML / Forum based guide.

http://www.texaspaleo.com/psa/papers.html

Dallas Paleo had a great Ptychodus guide years ago.

[CreekCrawler]

I'd be glad to contribute. Good idea!

Thanks for everyones compliments. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in awhile ;-)

In this link is a good doc, although I Barry's idea of a HTML / Forum based guide.

http://www.texaspaleo.com/psa/papers.html

Dallas Paleo had a great Ptychodus guide years ago.

Thanks for the link and it's a great reference,but I see no mention of Occidentalis,,Martini and Mortoni.The latter two of which I have great specimens for reference photo's.I'll get some pictures up by Tuesday at the latest.I have Latissimus,Mortoni,Martini,Anonymous,Whipplei.

[Tony Eaton]

Cool, that list includes many I don't have. I think martini is the rarest of the rare to find in Texas.

If I have the IDs right, I think I have P. mamillaris, marginalis(polygyrus) and decurrens to add. That leaves Ptychodus atcoensis(sp) as the only TX Ptychodus not included so far if I'm not mistaken (another rare one).

[CreekCrawler]

Cool, that list includes many I don't have. I think martini is the rarest of the rare to find in Texas.

If I have the IDs right, I think I have P. mamillaris, marginalis(polygyrus) and decurrens to add. That leaves Ptychodus atcoensis(sp) as the only TX Ptychodus not included so far if I'm not mistaken (another rare one).

Time for a trip to the lower Atco :)

[Tony Eaton]

yes, the atco stuff is fun to search through

after going to bed it occurred to me that there are also Ptychodus latissimus and P. rugosus in TX. I have a tooth or two I think could be latissimus???

I'm have never seen anyone posting finding a rugosus. I know a jaw plate was found under what is currently the Willow Bend mall in west Plano. I've never found a shark tooth in the Austin chalk above the Atco layer where rugosus would be found... but I did find a nice shark vertebrae under what is now the Prestonwood Baptist Church.

[siteseer]

That atcoensis tooth looks like a mortoni.

Yeah, I hope this thread keeps going. It's a good place to talk about the various species. I will try to post some photos as well.

Thanks for the link and it's a great reference,but I see no mention of Occidentalis,,Martini and Mortoni.The latter two of which I have great specimens for reference photo's.I'll get some pictures up by Tuesday at the latest.I have Latissimus,Mortoni,Martini,Anonymous,Whipplei.

[Tony Eaton]

whew, I'm done looking at Ptychodus for while. Here are a few pics of a few species my family and I found years ago from the Kamp Ranch formation in Denton County Texas. Maybe some could be repurposed for a general "Ptychodus" thread as Barry mentions. I have to admit I skipped a few mystery teeth that just don't fit into the categories right. Please help with any IDs. What I am calling "Latisimmus" is a bit of stretch as it is badly weathered and should have been a few miles to the east of where my wife found it.

marginalis (polygyrus)

ridges rounded followed by rounded margin, relatively flat

latisimmus cf.

few ridges with sharp cutting edges, flat, robust margins

mammallaris

crown at steep angle to margin but flatter than whipplei, ridges thicker than anonymous and extend further down than whipplei, concentric (rounded) margin, features which to me makes the crown looked "glued on".

decurrens

ridges split (bifurcate) to end of margins like occidentalis but with a lower crown

Edited July 19, 2010 by Tony Eaton

[CreekCrawler]

Hi Tony,I do believe your suspected Latissimus is correct.Here are a couple of mine for comparison.The weakly inflated crown is a dead give away along with the 5 to 6 transverse ridges.These two are from Post Oak Creek.. Also here is an Anonymous from an Anonomous place :D And a very nice Mortoni from less than a mile away from POC.

[CreekCrawler]

And here is the P.martini that was ID'd by S.Hamm. It's a beast and came from POC as well.

And last ,but not least is a P.whipplei that has fantastic color and is quite robust from POC

[Tony Eaton]

wow, a martini, that is really cool. Those latisimmus are cool too.

this is great, we have a Ptychodus ID guide in the making. if I get some time this week/weekend if you think it is okay Barry I'll try to put it all in one new post, or feel free to do the same.

Maybe we can ask for a donation of an atcoensis/sp from some lucky person. Sigh, I have a few that sort of like sp. but too small to honestly ID.

Edited July 20, 2010 by Tony Eaton

[Guest N.AL.hunter]

Thanks everyone for posting these pictures of ptychodus teeth. They have been one of my favorite finds here in Bama. Just wish we had more variety. Del

[CreekCrawler]

wow, a martini, that is really cool. Those latisimmus are cool too.

this is great, we have a Ptychodus ID guide in the making. if I get some time this week/weekend if you think it is okay Barry I'll try to put it all in one new post, or feel free to do the same.

Tony, I would have put all the ptychodus in a group picture,but my photo editing skills are somewhat lacking I'll contact Shawn and see if he can supply a picture of an atcoensis for us to oogle over.

It would be nice if we could have a group picture of all the different ptychodus species teeth that members have collected pinned somewhere for reference.

[alopias]

Hi all ,

very nice Ptychodus ; the family Ptychodontidae includes :

Ptychodus anonymus, P decurrens, P latissimus, P mammillaris

P mortoni , P occidentalis, P polygyrus , P rugosus, P whipplei

P connellyi and P sp .

[Tony Eaton]

Hi alopias,

Thanks for the listing.

Forgive me in advance, but here are some technical details.

I am considering P marginalis synonymous with P polygyrus based on this paper:

http://www.bioone.org/doi/abs/10.1666/09-154.1

P connellyi is synonymous with P martini if I am not mistaken? (I could be wrong)

P sp. is now named P atcoensis described by Shawn Hamm. Cited in DPS occasional papers volume 8.

http://www.dallaspaleo.org/dpsstorepubs.htm (UTD masters thesis from 2008 = SYSTEMATIC, STRATIGRAPHIC, GEOGRAPHIC AND PALEOECOLOGICAL DISTRIBUTION OF THE LATE CRETACEOUS SHARK GENUS PTYCHODUS WITHIN THE WESTERN INTERIOR SEAWAY)

I have seen some other "species" from Asia and Latin America although I am not sure if they are named.

Edited July 21, 2010 by Tony Eaton