Fossil-study help: Dinosaur tooth enamel,tooth colour, polished ammonites and amber

[KrishnaRao10]

Greetings kind people,

I am a complete novice in the field of fossil collecting. Kindly bear with me.

 

My objective for collecting fossils:

I want to learn paleontology work. I want to observe the fossils under a microscope, understand their body structure, their food habits.... Basically get a *whole story of the fossil* which I own, something that paleontologists do (I also want to explore all the methods that paleontologists use to study fossil and recreate them at home). So any fossil that will enable me to learn more about itself, I'd surely buy that.

And also fossils which are more closer to actuality, rather than rare or good looking fossils. So any fossil that reveals more information is favoured over rare or good-looking fossils

 

So here are my questions:

 

1) I'm trying to buy a spinosaur tooth. The seller is selling one spinosaur tooth which is red in colour for a higher price compared to a spinosaur tooth which looks almost like a rock. So is the red colour tooth more authentic or more valuable etc? Or is it just the same? My objective is to study those fossils under microscope. So if the red spinosaur tooth will provide more information, I'd buy that.

 

2) I see some dinosaur tooth still having some enamel. How is this possible? I mean shouldn't enamel be replaced by minerals too? Or is the enamel the only thing that is intact? If it is intact does it mean I'm holding a tooth which might have bit another dinosaur moments before it died and I can see the traces of that activity when I observe under the microscope? 

 

3) I've seen polished ammonites which were split open. They carried a lot of information within, compared to unpolished ammonite. Which among those two types would reveal more information about the ammonite itself? Or which one should I go for, in general?

 

4)I am also planning to buy amber fossils. Some pointers and what to look for and what to keep away from would be appreciated.

 

5) Lastly, trilobites. How are trilobite fossils so well preserved? I've seen reedops protruding out of the rock like it's actually alive. But I read something about cast fossils and enhancements. So if I buy a reedops trilobite, does it mean it's been remade using plaster etc, or is it just as it is? Please bear in mind that I want to own fossils which closely resembles actuality 

 

Thank you so much for bearing with my silly doubts .I just want to educate myself and be an amateur paleontologist, studying fossils from home.

Have a lovely day!

 

P.s- I can upload some pictures and website links if need be.

Edited January 30, 2020 by KrishnaRao10

[Pterygotus]

Some pictures of the spinosaurus teeth would help . Colour doesn’t really change the value. It depends on the preservation quality and quality of the fossil itself.

 

The reason the trilobites are protruding from the rock is because they have been carefully prepared.

[Fossildude19]

Krishna,

Please do not post any links to sellers. You may post pictures so long as there is nothing identifying the seller. Also, please do not copy any text from the advertisement.

Thanks for your  cooperation and understanding.  

[Troodon]

The enamel you see on dinosaur teeth is the orginal material.  It's a very dense and survives fossiization process easier than bones.   The different colors you see is simply the leaching of adjacent minerals why you see a variety of different colors.  The size and quality of the tooth meaning how well it was preserved with orginal detail usually determines price and collector value.   The richer and more vibrant the color of course makes the tooth more appealing to collectors.  Like it's already been suggested post photos any interests you have on teeth and we can comment on it

[Scylla]

Prepping trilobites means they are cleaned of surrounding rock so the fossil is maximally exposed. Sometimes missing parts are repaired. Sometimes the whole trilobite is missing and then we consider it a fake or a replica. If they tell you it is a replica, that is ok. Replicas are even used by professionals to study some aspects of rare fossils. Sometimes you can get a picture of the prepping process like this one:

[KrishnaRao10]

4 hours ago, Troodon said:

The enamel you see on dinosaur teeth is the orginal material.  It's a very dense and survives fossiization process easier than bones.   The different colors you see is simply the leaching of adjacent minerals why you see a variety of different colors.  The size and quality of the tooth meaning how well it was preserved with orginal detail usually determines price and collector value.   The richer and more vibrant the color of course makes the tooth more appealing to collectors.  Like it's already been suggested post photos any interests you have on teeth and we can comment on it

 

5 hours ago, Pterygotus said:

Some pictures of the spinosaurus teeth would help . Colour doesn’t really change the value. It depends on the preservation quality and quality of the fossil itself.

 

The reason the trilobites are protruding from the rock is because they have been carefully prepared.

Thank you for an early reply!!

All the below ones are spinosaur tooth.

 

I simply cannot see the difference.

Thanks again

[KrishnaRao10]

6 hours ago, Scylla said:

Prepping trilobites means they are cleaned of surrounding rock so the fossil is maximally exposed. Sometimes missing parts are repaired. Sometimes the whole trilobite is missing and then we consider it a fake or a replica. If they tell you it is a replica, that is ok. Replicas are even used by professionals to study some aspects of rare fossils. Sometimes you can get a picture of the prepping process like this one:

Oh I see! In that case I would go ahead and buy the trilobite fossil. Thank you so much for the help

[Pterygotus]

4 hours ago, KrishnaRao10 said:

 

Thank you for an early reply!!

All the below ones are spinosaur tooth.

 

I simply cannot see the difference.

Thanks again

    

I think it’s the size there that creates the pricing difference.

[RuMert]

3) what we see in ammonite fossils is only a part of what they actually had (btw same with trilobites, they had many legs and appendages which made them look more like a modern insect, not the massive legless body we usually have). The ammonites often had stunning sexual dimorphism, limpets, complex jaw apparatus with aptichi and upper jaws, changed shell sculpture in maturity and after injury, etc. So what collectors and scientists look for in ammonites are (from common to rare) 1. visible more or less intact center, 3 body chamber present (happens not very often actually) 3. nacre 4. complete shell mouth, 5.antemortem injuries, 6. sculpture mutations, 7. limpets present, 8. muscle traces, 9. natural shell color, 10. both sexes on the same plate (if the dimorphism is substatial), 11. associated aptichi, 12.ephibionts that forced shell alteration, 13. crustaceans and other shell inhabitants, 14. eggs present, 15. soft body inprints (not yet found AFAIK), etc. That's what IMHO makes you know more of ammonites. As to cut and polished shells, they are usefull for somebody who never heard of them before, afterwards they are used mostly as furniture

[Pterygotus]

Possible areas of restoration.

 

 

[Troodon]

I would avoid the last tooth the preservation appears to be very poor.  Poor quality.

 

The second tooth is much nicer, crown has been broken and reattached.  There is some fill in the root, poorly done.  I dont see any restoration.  Might also be some repair to the tip area, image is out of focus difficult to say.  What about the other side could be different?

 

Need more straight in photos all sides to comment on first tooth.

[Pterygotus]

6 minutes ago, Troodon said:

There is some fill in the root, poorly done.  I dont see any restoration

Sorry, that’s what I meant when I said restoration .

[KrishnaRao10]

34 minutes ago, Pterygotus said:

I think it’s the size there that creates the pricing difference.

Well, it's not the enamel or anything? If that's the case I'd rather buy the 1st one. 10-20mm of difference is not too huge for me. Thank you so much

[Pterygotus]

6 minutes ago, KrishnaRao10 said:

Well, it's not the enamel or anything? If that's the case I'd rather buy the 1st one. 10-20mm of difference is not too huge for me. Thank you so much

Then again the second one looks higher quality but the price difference between the first and second seems too much.

[KrishnaRao10]

1 hour ago, RuMert said:

3) what we see in ammonite fossils is only a part of what they actually had (btw same with trilobites, they had many legs and appendages which made them look more like a modern insect, not the massive legless body we usually have). The ammonites often had stunning sexual dimorphism, limpets, complex jaw apparatus with aptichi and upper jaws, changed shell sculpture in maturity and after injury, etc. So what collectors and scientists look for in ammonites are (from common to rare) 1. visible more or less intact center, 3 body chamber present (happens not very often actually) 3. nacre 4. complete shell mouth, 5.antemortem injuries, 6. sculpture mutations, 7. limpets present, 8. muscle traces, 9. both sexes on the same plate (if the dimorphism is substatial), 10. associated aptichi, 11.ephibionts that forced shell alteration, 12. crustaceans and other shell inhabitsnts, 13. eggs present, 14. soft body inprints (not yet found), etc. That's what IMHO makes you know more of ammointes. As to cut and polished shells, they are usefull for somebody who never heard of them before, afterwards they are used mostly as furniture

Okay really informative! Thank you so much! I'll keep this in mind

I'm thinking of buying this one. 

[KrishnaRao10]

1 minute ago, Pterygotus said:

Then again the second one is probably the one I would go with.

Thank you so much! Since collection is not my sole purpose, and I just want to study the fossil, anything that serves the purpose would do for me! Thank you so much for the input! It was really informative

[Pterygotus]

Just now, KrishnaRao10 said:

Thank you so much! Since collection is not my sole purpose, and I just want to study the fossil, anything that serves the purpose would do for me! Thank you so much for the input! It was really informative

Sorry I just edited my reply .

[KrishnaRao10]

1 hour ago, Troodon said:

I would avoid the last tooth the preservation appears to be very poor.  Poor quality.

 

The second tooth is much nicer, crown has been broken and reattached.  There is some fill in the root, poorly done.  I dont see any restoration.  Might also be some repair to the tip area, image is out of focus difficult to say.  What about the other side could be different?

 

Need more straight in photos all sides to comment on first tooth.

It's uncanny how the last tooth is priced high ... Is it just an unreasonable quote or is there a reason behind it? 

[KrishnaRao10]

1 hour ago, Pterygotus said:

Sorry I just edited my reply .

Yes I noticed. I agree that there is too much price difference although I would generally prefer the 2nd one. In any case 1st one is more economical. Thank you though

[Troodon]

7 minutes ago, KrishnaRao10 said:

... Is it just an unreasonable quote or is there a reason behind it? 

Ask the seller !

[RuMert]

17 minutes ago, KrishnaRao10 said:

Do you think it's worth

Dunno, I've never bought fossils, they lose much of its emotional value this way. Depends on how you feel about this sum, it should be something easy for you with that sort of fossils (depending on the size IMHO)

[JohnJ]

@KrishnaRao10 

Per Forum rules, please do not post or discuss pricing.  Thanks for your help.

[KrishnaRao10]

13 minutes ago, JohnJ said:

@KrishnaRao10 

Per Forum rules, please do not post or discuss pricing.  Thanks for your help.

I see. Apologies

[FrozenFlame]

To help answer your questions, but one comment I would make is that with fossils, take your time. You'll see many fossils for sale, some that are cheap, some that are expensive, some that are super nice to have. And as for what fossils to purchase, have a look, and figure out what you want to collect and study, and run with that. Paleontology after all is the study of life since the beginning until the last 10,000 years, and starting with stromatolites from over a billion years ago, you have a lot to work with!

 

1) A lot of factors determine the price, it's mostly size, but also the overall look of it, whether it has been restored or not, colour, etc. I'm personally not sure how to study it under the microscope, I just find it makes a nice display piece (I am a simple man). 

 

4) Amber is a tricky one, it's quite good to look at under the microscope, and they're generally going to be from two areas, the Baltic region (Baltic amber), and Burma/Myanmar (Burmite). The one thing with amber is separating it out with copal, so learning how to separate the two would be important. You can find many topics on the forum around this. 

 

5) Trilobites are shown like how you described due to extensive preparation, but is quite an industry making fake or composited trilobites, in particular around Moroccan trilobites. 

 

If you're unsure about anything, just post it on the forum asking for help, there are quite a few knowledgeable folks on this forum, and we all have to start from somewhere!