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Hey guys, 

Around 2.5 years ago I found this tooth in the Santa Fe River in Florida, which is Pleistocene. I previously IDed it as a bison premolar (Bison antiquus), but looking back I am now less convinced by that ID.  The chewing surface seems off, and seen from the top it seems a little too 'rectangular'. Due to its relatively small size, if it is indeed bison, could it possibly be a juvenile (hence explaining why it looks a bit different from normal bison teeth)?

What do you guys think? I can provide more angles if necessary.

Thanks in advance,

Max

 

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Max Derème

 

"I feel an echo of the lightning each time I find a fossil. [...] That is why I am a hunter: to feel that bolt of lightning every day."

   - Mary Anning >< Remarkable Creatures, Tracy Chevalier

 

Instagram: @world_of_fossils

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IMG_0045.JPG

Max Derème

 

"I feel an echo of the lightning each time I find a fossil. [...] That is why I am a hunter: to feel that bolt of lightning every day."

   - Mary Anning >< Remarkable Creatures, Tracy Chevalier

 

Instagram: @world_of_fossils

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I think this is a camelid lower p4.  These teeth are quite variable, but this is probably from Hemiauchenia sp. rather than Palaeolama mirifica.

 

 

camel_lower_p4.JPG

camelpremolars.JPG

  • I found this Informative 1

http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page

 

What seest thou else

In the dark backward and abysm of time?

---Shakespeare, The Tempest

 

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@Harry Pristis Ah I hadn't considered camelid, that definitely does appear to be a better fit than bison. Thanks!

However I do see quite some differences between the two teeth:

InkedInkedcamelpremolars.JPG.9a6bfc96d732e2b34d6222a92fa479d6_LI.jpg.f42f0983067dbe720979724e8b1a7ece.jpgInkedInkedIMG_0045_LI.thumb.jpg.0ed950b610bd02c23ad1de05271ec7f5.jpg

I highlighted the differences with colors to make it clearer. 

Red: the big dent in your teeth appears to be much more pronounced than on mine

Yellow: mine has a pretty clear small 'pointy' dent there that yours seem to lack

Blue: my tooth's chewing surface on the right side seems a lot larger (as a consequence of red)

Green: my tooth has got these 2 little holes in the chewing surface, that yours seem to lack completely.

 

These 3-4 differences seem, added together, a bit more than intraspecies variability could realistically produce. However as you said, your tooth is a Palaeolama mirifica, while mine is probably Hemiauchenia. So do you think that that variation is acceptable in between two different genera? It definitely seems plausible to me, but you're the expert here, so I'd love to hear your opinion on this :) 

 

Also, to my understanding, the Hemiauchenia species in this part of the Santa Fe is H. macrocephala, however I could be completely wrong. Do you think I should leave them as Hemiauchenia sp.?

Max Derème

 

"I feel an echo of the lightning each time I find a fossil. [...] That is why I am a hunter: to feel that bolt of lightning every day."

   - Mary Anning >< Remarkable Creatures, Tracy Chevalier

 

Instagram: @world_of_fossils

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16 hours ago, Harry Pristis said:

I've already told you what I think, Max.

 

 

Right. Well I just wanted to ensure that my extra 'insight' was already part of the elements you've considered.

I'm a bit newer to identifying this type of material, and while I trust your more experienced judgement, I think it's good to critically assess the answers I get rather than immediately consider it as the correct answer. Seeing that there were quite some differences in between the teeth, I wanted to make sure that these are normal differences in between the two rather closely related genera. But it's good to have a confirmation that this is a normal degree of variability.

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Max Derème

 

"I feel an echo of the lightning each time I find a fossil. [...] That is why I am a hunter: to feel that bolt of lightning every day."

   - Mary Anning >< Remarkable Creatures, Tracy Chevalier

 

Instagram: @world_of_fossils

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