Notidanodon Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 Hi guys weird question here, what is the difference between parotodus benedini and parotodus priemi, i cant find the name of the person who originally described the Priemi variant so i was wondering whether it was just a mistake that got passed along. However, it might be right that it is a different species as i have only heard of P.Priemi coming from the london clay of the UK and Benedini is more widespread. All answers welcome, thanks for your help 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troodon Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 A 2019 publication that reviews the Parotodus genus. P. priemi not mentioned https://www.researchgate.net/publication/337937278_2019-canevet-a-review-of_the-extinct-genus-Parotodus 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 Temporal difference, P. benedeni is late Oligocene to early Pleistocene(?), the London clay is middle Eocene. The ones from the London clay are also much smaller. I have been told Parotodus priemi is invalid, synonymous with Parotodus pavlovi. I’m not sure it was ever properly described. However, I’ve also been told Parotodus pavlovi is a nomen dubium because the original description by Menner was based upon small or juvenile Otodus. So it’s a mess, which given the similarities between Otodus, Parotodus, and even Cretalamna is unsurprising. Considering this is when Parotodus likely arose (presumably from Otodus), there is no doubt there are also transitionals mixed in. 2 “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notidanodon Posted July 1, 2020 Author Share Posted July 1, 2020 11 hours ago, Troodon said: A 2019 publication that reviews the Parotodus genus. P. priemi not mentioned https://www.researchgate.net/publication/337937278_2019-canevet-a-review-of_the-extinct-genus-Parotodus Thanks, yes i thought it might be an invalid name as i couldnt find the person who described it 10 hours ago, WhodamanHD said: Temporal difference, P. benedeni is late Oligocene to early Pleistocene(?), the London clay is middle Eocene. The ones from the London clay are also much smaller. I have been told Parotodus priemi is invalid, synonymous with Parotodus pavlovi. I’m not sure it was ever properly described. However, I’ve also been told Parotodus pavlovi is a nomen dubium because the original description by Menner was based upon small or juvenile Otodus. So it’s a mess, which given the similarities between Otodus, Parotodus, and even Cretalamna is unsurprising. Considering this is when Parotodus likely arose (presumably from Otodus), there is no doubt there are also transitionals mixed in. haha yes it does seem like a mess, Thanks so much for your help so should i name it parotodus aff. pavlovi or leave it as P.priemi as that seems to be what london clay specimens are called( i guess in an informal manner) It's weird that it was never properly described though as the london clay is so well documented having been studied since the 19th century 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 4 hours ago, will stevenson said: haha yes it does seem like a mess, Thanks so much for your help so should i name it parotodus aff. pavlovi or leave it as P.priemi as that seems to be what london clay specimens are called( i guess in an informal manner) It's weird that it was never properly described though as the london clay is so well documented having been studied since the 19th century Yeah, I guess there’s just a limited amount of shark paleontologists with limited funding and bandwidth so this matter got pushed aside till a time when it’s more clear. You could get away with either name, I’d label it Parotodus aff. pavlovi as long as “London Clay FM” is also on the label. 2 “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fossilselachian Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Wish this paper was in English! What wonderful photographs. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siteseer Posted July 3, 2020 Share Posted July 3, 2020 On 7/1/2020 at 3:27 PM, fossilselachian said: Wish this paper was in English! What wonderful photographs. Hi Fossilselachian, It's like the French have a different word for everything (old Steve Martin joke). Google Translate should help. I downloaded it, and will print it out, and then get back to you. In another thread I admitted I didn't know the difference between P. pavlovi and P. mangyshlakensis, names given to Middle Eocene Parotodus teeth from sites in Kazakhstan. I've seen P. priemi used only for apparent early Parotodus teeth from the London Clay. The ones from Morocco have not been named to species. I haven't seen a note referring to the description of the species, P. priemi. I assume the species name honors Fernand Priem, a 19th-20th century French paleontologist perhaps best known for his reviews of fossil fishes of the Paris Basin. Jess 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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