Fossil ID from NJ: Chunk of Bone

[Bob-ay]

This piece was found this past weekend near Big Brook in New Jersey(Cretaceous Period). Need help identifying. Was told possible sea turtle or mosasaur piece?? Help and opinions open. Can also take additional pictures if need be! Second group of pics after it dried out a little bit.. Thanks in advance

 

Edited July 14, 2020 by Bob-ay

[Trevor]

These photos are quite small and prevent me from closely looking at the cell structure. If you are correct in that this is bone, then it belongs to a reptile. Whether this bone is mosasaur, turtle, dinosasaur, etc.. I cannot tell because it is not close enough. Also, there are no real diagnostic features of this bone from what I can tell.

[Bob-ay]

34 minutes ago, Trevor said:

These photos are quite small and prevent me from closely looking at the cell structure. If you are correct in that this is bone, then it belongs to a reptile. Whether this bone is mosasaur, turtle, dinosasaur, etc.. I cannot tell because it is not close enough. Also, there are no real diagnostic features of this bone from what I can tell.

Hopefully this may help... the top portion is almost like "folded" 

Edited July 14, 2020 by Bob-ay

[Bob-ay]

[PrehistoricWonders]

I have no clue, cool piece though!

[Bob-ay]

8 minutes ago, Familyroadtrip said:

I have no clue, cool piece though!

thank you!

 

[PrehistoricWonders]

Yup

[The Jersey Devil]

I agree it’s a bone. What are the dimensions?

[Bob-ay]

 

[Bob-ay]

2 hours ago, The Jersey Devil said:

I agree it’s a bone. What are the dimensions?

added more pics with dimensions

[The Jersey Devil]

Interesting bone. I recommend sending the pics to Dave Parris of NJSM for him to look at.

[Bob-ay]

15 hours ago, The Jersey Devil said:

Interesting bone. I recommend sending the pics to Dave Parris of NJSM for him to look at.

Thanks will do!

[njfossilhunter]

It think what you have there is a piece of Archelon Turtle ....possibly a section of a peripheral segment or some other part of the carapaces ....A very rare find.  I found a similar piece a few years back that was ID by Dave Parris and is sitting in the NJ Museum now.  

 

Who knows your piece may match up with mine....Wouldn't that be cool.....

[The Jersey Devil]

2 hours ago, njfossilhunter said:

It think what you have there is a piece of Archelon Turtle ....possibly a section of a peripheral segment or some other part of the carapaces ....A very rare find.  I found a similar piece a few years back that was ID by Dave Parris and is sitting in the NJ Museum now.  

I don’t think it’s IDable to a genus. It also doesn't seem like Archelon was reported from NJ. It also looks more like limb then shell

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

I'd say definitely bone, but if from a mosasaur, then I wouldn't know what part: doesn't match my expectations for paddle bones, and it's certainly not rib. This leaves skull as the only other viable option if mosasaur, and I can't seem to place it there either.

 

I don't think it's turtle carapace either, though (but I don't have a lot of experience with carapace), as it lacks the typical bone textures (both in and out): carapace pieces I've seen - albeit of Cenozoic, not Cretaceous, dates - are much more porous and have surface texture...

 

Cool find, though, and am interested to see what it turns out to be!

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

1 hour ago, The Jersey Devil said:

I don’t think it’s IDable to a genus. It also looks more like limb then shell

I do have to agree, it reminds me much more of some images of turtle limb bone I've seen online. Just much bigger...

[Bob-ay]

2 hours ago, njfossilhunter said:

It think what you have there is a piece of Archelon Turtle ....possibly a section of a peripheral segment or some other part of the carapaces ....A very rare find.  I found a similar piece a few years back that was ID by Dave Parris and is sitting in the NJ Museum now.  

 

Who knows your piece may match up with mine....Wouldn't that be cool.....

sent Dave some pictures, see what he thinks... Do you have pics of your find? Would be interested in seeing them.

[Bob-ay]

4 hours ago, pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon said:

I do have to agree, it reminds me much more of some images of turtle limb bone I've seen online. Just much bigger...

any chance you can send me the images of turtle limb bones you think are similar? 

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

11 hours ago, Bob-ay said:

any chance you can send me the images of turtle limb bones you think are similar? 

Unfortunately, the images I'm talking about were from online vendors of pieces that have long since sold. I therefore don't have access to these images any more. However, from what I remember, these bones struck me as peculiar by being relatively flat, having a waist (narrow point mid-shaft), having something of a twist. A quick Google ("turtle limb bone fossil") got me these images of an "unusual turtle limb bone" from the Pleistocene of Florida, which kind of looks similar to what I remember:

 

What's more, however, I also bumped into an article that describes how a turtle humerus that had broken into two pieces was re-united after having been found 162 years apart. Interestingly, the finds were made in New Jersey and therefore have direct relevance to your own find. To me, I can see a striking resemblance between your piece of bone and the one described in the article, your piece being an edge of the distal end of such a humerus (the slight twist, thickened edge and otherwise flat bone - even size-wise it seems to fit):

Re-united sections of a Atlantochelys mortoni humerus

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

A further illustration (taken from this forum post), comes from Oceans of Kansas:

 

Also, had already intended to do so before, but just wanted to share the below photographs to illustrate why I don't think we're dealing with turtle carapace:

 

 

Unidentified (i.e. unrecorded) turtle species, probably Maastrichtian, in the Museum voor Natuurwetenschappen, Brussels

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Glarichelys gwinneri from the Oligocene of Germany, in the Senckenberg Museum

[Bob-ay]

22 hours ago, pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon said:

Unfortunately, the images I'm talking about were from online vendors of pieces that have long since sold. I therefore don't have access to these images any more. However, from what I remember, these bones struck me as peculiar by being relatively flat, having a waist (narrow point mid-shaft), having something of a twist. A quick Google ("turtle limb bone fossil") got me these images of an "unusual turtle limb bone" from the Pleistocene of Florida, which kind of looks similar to what I remember:

 

What's more, however, I also bumped into an article that describes how a turtle humerus that had broken into two pieces was re-united after having been found 162 years apart. Interestingly, the finds were made in New Jersey and therefore have direct relevance to your own find. To me, I can see a striking resemblance between your piece of bone and the one described in the article, your piece being an edge of the distal end of such a humerus (the slight twist, thickened edge and otherwise flat bone - even size-wise it seems to fit):

Re-united sections of a Atlantochelys mortoni humerus

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

A further illustration (taken from this forum post), comes from Oceans of Kansas:

 

Also, had already intended to do so before, but just wanted to share the below photographs to illustrate why I don't think we're dealing with turtle carapace:

 

 

Unidentified (i.e. unrecorded) turtle species, probably Maastrichtian, in the Museum voor Natuurwetenschappen, Brussels

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Glarichelys gwinneri from the Oligocene of Germany, in the Senckenberg Museum

Very interesting! Thank you for the info! I can also see the resemblance, although I have little background in this field being fairly new to the hobby! Waiting to see if Dave Parris may be able to shed alittle more light in helping to identify!  

[Bob-ay]

I found this page: http://oceansofkansas.com/KS_Crocodiles.html

 

The first bone picture on the right is a pretty close match to my bone frag. Has the "folded top" and other features that are very similar!

 

" RIGHT: Two of the limb bones of FHSM VP-2079. Other remains include vertebrae and possible elements of the pectoral or pelvic girdles."

[jpevahouse]

I've found fossil bone fragments at Big Brook but there are many weathered historic era bones which look older than they are. A Cretaceous era bone will be rock, a modern bone will be bone.

[Bob-ay]

 seems like the best identification we have been able to make so far would be possible: Deinosuchus pelvic and pectoral girdle

Any and all options or clues welcome! 

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

7 hours ago, Bob-ay said:

 seems like the best identification we have been able to make so far is: Deinosuchus pelvic and pectoral girdle

Any and all options or clues welcome! 

Could you explain where this information comes from, as you hinted at croc before, but I don't think there was too much discussion on whether this could be croc otherwise? Was that the suggestion Dave Parris came back to you with?

[Bob-ay]

7 hours ago, pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon said:

Could you explain where this information comes from, as you hinted at croc before, but I don't think there was too much discussion on whether this could be croc otherwise? Was that the suggestion Dave Parris came back to you with?

sent you a message. but correct suggestions from Dave