petrified wood?

[Hslice]

Hello Fossil Forum!

I love rocks and rock hounding (but very amateur) and I look at the ground wherever I go.  I picked up these rocks from a few locations in Montgomery County, Pennsylvania.  Most collected over the past year, found in hillsides (not streams).  I think that they all look somewhat like petrified wood and was curious if anyone else has found similar samples from this area and/or knows anything at all about them.

Thank you in advance for any thoughts, information, and opinions!

[Hslice]

 

 

[daves64]

To use an often over looked technical term concerning if these might be petrified wood.. Yup. 

[Hslice]

1 hour ago, daves64 said:

To use an often over looked technical term concerning if these might be petrified wood.. Yup. 

Wow! That's exciting.  I don't think my family is going to believe me, but I believe and that's what matters ;-)  Thanks!

 

 

[Rockwood]

Sorry. All I see is nope.

[Hslice]

1 hour ago, Rockwood said:

Sorry. All I see is nope.

 Ah, perhaps I missed some sarcasm from Daves64... 

thanks for sharing your thoughts Rockwood

[Fossildude19]

End views of the larger piece may tell us something. 

Please load photos directly to the Forum. 

Your google drive attempts are not working.  

 

[Rockwood]

35 minutes ago, Hslice said:

 Ah, perhaps I missed some sarcasm from Daves64... 

thanks for sharing your thoughts Rockwood

I doubt that is sarcasm. Wood can be tricky, and I may turn out to be the one who doesn't see so well.

 

[daves64]

No sarcasm intended actually. The larger pieces do look like they may be petrified wood. 

[Hslice]

On 8/11/2020 at 2:33 PM, Fossildude19 said:

End views of the larger piece may tell us something. 

Please load photos directly to the Forum. 

Your google drive attempts are not working.  

 

Thanks so much for the suggestion re the end views -- I'll post some more pictures momentarily.  Also thanks for letting me know that my google drive pics were not working!

[Hslice]

Here are some close ups of the larger pieces:

#1

 

[Hslice]

#2

 

[Fossildude19]

The end views of the items says rocks, to me. Sorry.

 

[Hslice]

#3

 

[Rockwood]

In places there does exist material which has been determined to be fossil wood that looks something like this. There is a fine line between it and plain old rock though. I'm afraid some in depth study would be needed to have any hope of crossing it with these.

[Hslice]

Thank you. So curious.  is there anywhere I can look for more i formation about what distinguishes the two? 

[Rockwood]

Much of my understanding comes from the book ANCIENT FORESTS. It's a combination coffee table/text book that would give an overview of the concepts and appearances. Not a manual for the technique needed here though.  

[EMP]

On 8/11/2020 at 1:53 PM, Hslice said:

Hello Fossil Forum!

I love rocks and rock hounding (but very amateur) and I look at the ground wherever I go.  I picked up these rocks from a few locations in Montgomery County, Pennsylvania.  Most collected over the past year, found in hillsides (not streams).  I think that they all look somewhat like petrified wood and was curious if anyone else has found similar samples from this area and/or knows anything at all about them.

Thank you in advance for any thoughts, information, and opinions!

 

Looking at your close up photos, and from what I'm seeing in these, I think it's safe to say these are rocks. By the looks of it you have foliated mica schist with quartz venation.

 

I've found plenty of similar stuff when looking for fossil wood myself, but the good thing is that PA has a lot of fossil bearing bedrock and even in the metamorphic areas you're not too far away from places that could bear fossils. 

 

As for distinguishing between them; most of my experience is with fossil wood, which looks like modern wood but often has some form of mineralization (like being preserved in iron oxide/hydroxide, pyrite, etc.). It's usually denser than modern wood as well, because of the mineralization. Distinguishing between petrified wood and minerals like quartz can be tricky as petrified wood by definition is usually preserved as microcrystalline silicates, but perhaps the easiest way to tell is to see if your area's bedrock is sedimentary and could thus produce fossils or if it's metamorphic/igneous and cannot. Also, foliated metamorphic rocks like schist will tend to have a variety of minerals in them (like silvery mica, reddish garnets, etc.), whereas petrified wood is usually a single, silicate mineral.    

[Hslice]

On 8/13/2020 at 11:21 AM, Rockwood said:

Much of my understanding comes from the book ANCIENT FORESTS. It's a combination coffee table/text book that would give an overview of the concepts and appearances. Not a manual for the technique needed here though.  

That book looks beautiful.  I put it on my wish list for a future gift...  Can you give me a hint as to the sort of techniques I would need to distinguish fossil wood from plain old rock?

[Hslice]

On 8/15/2020 at 12:10 PM, EMP said:

 

Looking at your close up photos, and from what I'm seeing in these, I think it's safe to say these are rocks. By the looks of it you have foliated mica schist with quartz venation.

 

I've found plenty of similar stuff when looking for fossil wood myself, but the good thing is that PA has a lot of fossil bearing bedrock and even in the metamorphic areas you're not too far away from places that could bear fossils. 

 

As for distinguishing between them; most of my experience is with fossil wood, which looks like modern wood but often has some form of mineralization (like being preserved in iron oxide/hydroxide, pyrite, etc.). It's usually denser than modern wood as well, because of the mineralization. Distinguishing between petrified wood and minerals like quartz can be tricky as petrified wood by definition is usually preserved as microcrystalline silicates, but perhaps the easiest way to tell is to see if your area's bedrock is sedimentary and could thus produce fossils or if it's metamorphic/igneous and cannot. Also, foliated metamorphic rocks like schist will tend to have a variety of minerals in them (like silvery mica, reddish garnets, etc.), whereas petrified wood is usually a single, silicate mineral.    

Thank you so much for this guidance.  I've looked at a bunch of maps and, as best I can tell, my home  is literally on the dividing line between two types of geography.  One has gneiss, granite, marble, etc. and the other has limestone, dolomite, sandstone, shale, quartzite, and phylite.  This checks out as I find all of these types of rocks around my house.  I also find plenty of coal and iron ore, or at least rocks that contain a lot of iron, and some conglomerates as well.  So, there is a lot sift through and I have a lot to learn!  Does this sound like a setting in which I might find any sort of fossil?

 

[Hslice]

I've tried looking all of the place for examples of and information about petrified wood from southeast PA and the same pictures/threads keep coming up (even when I google this query outside of the forum): traveltip1 's posts of his finds from southeast PA. I've looked at those pictures and threads closely and  I keep thinking that I am finding similar looking pieces, but I'm not sure what the ends look like on the comparison specimens.  

I hope y'all dont't mind if I post a few more pics of different rocks (fossils maybe!) that's I've found around my home.  even if they're not anything at all, understanding why will help me focus my search. 

This forum is an incredibly welcome and warm distraction...I have stage 4 cancer (with a new chronic disease added on last week) and really need something else to think about these days.  I'd rather be up learning about fossils at 1am than googling about a medical condition that I don't have any control over.  I really like taking my slow walks outside and picking up, examining, and cleaning the menagerie of rocks around my home.  Any help you can offer to help me hone my rock hounding skills is much appreciated.

[Rockwood]

3 hours ago, Hslice said:

That book looks beautiful.  I put it on my wish list for a future gift...  Can you give me a hint as to the sort of techniques I would need to distinguish fossil wood from plain old rock?

I've been told that some wood can be identified by polishing it well and studying it under high magnification. I've never invested the money or effort to try it myself though.

The best clue I know is , like EMP mentions, it looks like wood. Wood is kind of like rabbits too. You never find just one. It's usually common or absent.

I hope to see more of your fossil finds when my piddling little issues have me up early.

Bless you.

[Hslice]

Thanks so much for all of the advice. I took the simple advice and looked for bits of wood, picked them up, and if they were rocks I brought them home and washed them off!  Here are a few pictures of about half of what I found:

(Some still wet so may Look a bit darker)

I think many of these have a lot of iron or hematite  in them...and some have tiny flecks of mica (schist-y?)...but nothing like some of the mica schist I find nearby...that stuff looks like melted silver and has garnets popping out. I digress. 
anywAy, please let me know if you think any of these might be fossil wood...or at least warrants a closer look. I also have a cabbing machine and can polish an edge on a few if that will help. 

 

[Hslice]

And here are pictures of one of the pieces with the end polished. I haven’t used my cabbing machine in seven years and it started right up!

 

you can see some of the iron in the polished end. But if fear it is too granular... 

 

[Hslice]

1 hour ago, Hslice said:

Thanks so much for all of the advice. I took the simple advice and looked for bits of wood, picked them up, and if they were rocks I brought them home and washed them off!  Here are a few pictures of about half of what I found:

(Some still wet so may Look a bit darker)

I think many of these have a lot of iron or hematite  in them...and some have tiny flecks of mica (schist-y?)...but nothing like some of the mica schist I find nearby...that stuff looks like melted silver and has garnets popping out. I digress. 
anywAy, please let me know if you think any of these might be fossil wood...or at least warrants a closer look. I also have a cabbing machine and can polish an edge on a few if that will help.