Yunnan Fossil Bone

[Crazyhen]

This fossil was from Yunnan, China.  Of Triassic formation, same layer as Keichousaurus.  It’s 55cm in length.  Any idea what it is? 

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

With Triassic material the world over being generally rare, I think it might be hard to come across anybody to ID this here. On the other hand, a lot of preserved Triassic fauna is relatively small, so the big size might be a significant clue. Of course, this may also be something completely new, as I guess the layers from which Keichousaurus-fossils are derived are quite well-known (if not well-studied).

 

Overall, though, this bone strikes me as odd and not particularly reptilian, with these "wings" near the base. The overall flat shape of the bone and one clear articulation surface seem to suggest some kind of vertebral process (dorsal?). But, again, I'm not familiar with any Triassic reptile that would have a sail-like projection on it's back...

[Crazyhen]

7 hours ago, pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon said:

With Triassic material the world over being generally rare, I think it might be hard to come across anybody to ID this here. On the other hand, a lot of preserved Triassic fauna is relatively small, so the big size might be a significant clue. Of course, this may also be something completely new, as I guess the layers from which Keichousaurus-fossils are derived are quite well-known (if not well-studied).

 

Overall, though, this bone strikes me as odd and not particularly reptilian, with these "wings" near the base. The overall flat shape of the bone and one clear articulation surface seem to suggest some kind of vertebral process (dorsal?). But, again, I'm not familiar with any Triassic reptile that would have a sail-like projection on it's back...

Yes, this piece of fossil is very strange.  The local has never seen anything like this.  The locality is rich in fish fauna, and it was thought that this piece might belong to fish instead of reptile.  Does it look like a dorso-ventrally compressed lower jaw of saurichthys?

[Welsh Wizard]

17 hours ago, Crazyhen said:

This fossil was from Yunnan, China.  Of Triassic formation, same layer as Keichousaurus.  It’s 55cm in length.  Any idea what it is? 

It looks like a fish jaw to me. Whilst being a slightly odd shape it looks more jaw like than process like and the bone does look like fish bone. It’s always interesting to see Triassic stuff.

[Crazyhen]

26 minutes ago, Welsh Wizard said:

It looks like a fish jaw to me. Whilst being a slightly odd shape it looks more jaw like than process like and the bone does look like fish bone. It’s always interesting to see Triassic stuff.

It looks like that the upper (left) half of the "process" is missing or still partly embedded in the matrix.  If that's the case, it does look like a lower jaw of fish, probably a large saurichthys (?).

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

4 hours ago, Crazyhen said:

Yes, this piece of fossil is very strange.  The local has never seen anything like this.  The locality is rich in fish fauna, and it was thought that this piece might belong to fish instead of reptile.  Does it look like a dorso-ventrally compressed lower jaw of saurichthys?

Although I agree that this is most likely fish - my first inclination after having ruled out reptile - I just don't have enough experience with fish to know what part of a fish this could be, let alone the genus. Based on suggestions here, I'll have a look at the Saurichthys sp. mandible from Holzmaden I have at home and come back to you then.

[M Harvey]

Shape reminds me of an early  turtle pleural.  There are some found in china but they are very rare.   

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

I had a look at my Saurichthys sp. jaw, but as I expected, there's little semblance.

 

 

2 hours ago, M Harvey said:

Shape reminds me of an early  turtle pleural.  There are some found in china but they are very rare.   

I like the suggestion of a turtle pleural, though, as the bone does look kind of rib-like to me. And it being a pleural would explain the "wings" on the side...

[Planko]

Wow. You guys see fish? I have so much to learn.

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

5 minutes ago, Planko said:

Wow. You guys see fish? I have so much to learn.

 

Nah, I wouldn't say fish any more. I wasn't aware of the pleural bones of turtles, thus did not consider this as an option. However, @M Harvey's suggestion has me convinced, especially when comparing with the images in this thread:

 

 

 

 

I'd say there's little doubt about it: turtle pleural bone. Though what species, I wouldn't be able to tell...

 

[oilshale]

There are not so many Triassic turtles from China - the only turtle I know from the Keichousaurus sites of Guizhou is Odontochelys semitestacea. This looks like a dorsal rib - the only problem I have is: The known specimens of Odontochelys are only 10 cm wide and about 30 to 40 cm long. With 55cm rib length, this specimen (when complete) would be over one meter wide (and then 3m long???)- that would be a monster! 

 

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/23501107_Ancestral_turtle_from_the_Late_Triassic_of_Southwestern_China

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

32 minutes ago, oilshale said:

The known specimens of Odontochelys are only 10 cm wide and about 30 to 40 cm long. With 55cm rib length, this specimen (when complete) would be over one meter wide (and then 3m long???)- that would be a monster! 

 

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/23501107_Ancestral_turtle_from_the_Late_Triassic_of_Southwestern_China

Well, reptiles (and turtles) keep growing throughout all of their lives, right?

 

More likely, though, in that case, we might be dealing with an, as of yet, undiscribed species...

[Crazyhen]

9 hours ago, oilshale said:

There are not so many Triassic turtles from China - the only turtle I know from the Keichousaurus sites of Guizhou is Odontochelys semitestacea. This looks like a dorsal rib - the only problem I have is: The known specimens of Odontochelys are only 10 cm wide and about 30 to 40 cm long. With 55cm rib length, this specimen (when complete) would be over one meter wide (and then 3m long???)- that would be a monster! 

 

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/23501107_Ancestral_turtle_from_the_Late_Triassic_of_Southwestern_China

There is another Triassic turtle Eorhynchochelys sinensis from Guanling, Guizhou.  It is said to be over 2m in length.

 

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/327161828_A_Triassic_stem_turtle_with_an_edentulous_beak

[oilshale]

3 hours ago, Crazyhen said:

There is another Triassic turtle Eorhynchochelys sinensis from Guanling, Guizhou.  It is said to be over 2m in length.

 

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/327161828_A_Triassic_stem_turtle_with_an_edentulous_beak

 

Great, I have missed this one. I had not yet heard of it.

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

4 hours ago, Crazyhen said:

There is another Triassic turtle Eorhynchochelys sinensis from Guanling, Guizhou.  It is said to be over 2m in length.

 

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/327161828_A_Triassic_stem_turtle_with_an_edentulous_beak

If I look at the images provided with the publication (especially figure 1, reproduced below), it doesn't look like the pleurals would match that of the fossil in question here. Still, it does at least show the presence of other large species of early turtles in the area, so wouldn't exclude this being an older individual or simply another giant species.

 

[Planko]

I know it is not but does anyone else see a parrot here. 

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

2 minutes ago, Planko said:

I know it is not but does anyone else see a parrot here. 

Once seen, it cannot be unseen

[Brianp]

i am no expert, but when I first saw this post, i thought it was a bird as well.  the right side sure looks like tail feathers.

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

10 minutes ago, Brianp said:

i am no expert, but when I first saw this post, i thought it was a bird as well.  the right side sure looks like tail feathers.

Birds, however, did not develop until millions of years after, in the Jurassic. At the time we're talking about now even the theropod-lineage, the dinosaur-lineage from which birds sprang, was still in its infancy...

[RobFallen]

I have no idea sadly but I can also picture tail feathers and the parrot now it was mentioned lol, very cool and hopefully you can find out what it is from, most likely a turtle as others have suggested