Tiny premaxillery tooth - theropod

[MedicineHat]

Hello, my son brought me this sparkling enamel fossil and I recognized it as a possible premaxillery tooth of a tyrannosaur?? I have found much larger ones but not ever this tiny. Any ideas what species it could belong to? Baby Albertosaurus? Raptor?

[MedicineHat]

Compared to my largest premaxillery tooth

[MedicineHat]

 

[MedicineHat]

[MedicineHat]

[PaleoNoel]

I found a similar premax tooth in North Dakota's Hell Creek last year. I've been told that unserrated premax teeth likely belong to tyrannosaurs.

[PaleoNoel]

Some other views

 

[Troodon]

A number of theropods contain very small premaxillary teeth like yours including dromaeosaurids and juvie tyrannosaurids so identification can be problematic.   If you can determine if serrations are present or not that would help.  Poor preservation or wear often removes fine ones so you have to look at the carina under magnification to get the best possible call.   I would like to see another straight in photo of just the face of the tooth showing both carinae.

 

Are you sure you are in the Scollard Fm not the Horseshoe Canyon Fm?  Albertosaurus is found inthe latter,Trex in the former..  Where was this found?

[MedicineHat]

2 hours ago, Troodon said:

A number of theropods contain very small premaxillary teeth like yours including dromaeosaurids and juvie tyrannosaurids so identification can be problematic.   If you can determine if serrations are present or not that would help.  Poor preservation or wear often removes fine ones so you have to look at the carina under magnification to get the best possible call.   I would like to see another straight in photo of just the face of the tooth showing both carinae.

 

Are you sure you are in the Scollard Fm not the Horseshoe Canyon Fm?  Albertosaurus is found inthe latter,Trex in the former..  Where was this found?

 

[MedicineHat]

[MedicineHat]

@Troodon I guess it is horseshoe canyon FM. It was along red deer river in the area near tolman bridge. Not a usual area I get to go. 

[MedicineHat]

9 hours ago, PaleoNoel said:

I found a similar premax tooth in North Dakota's Hell Creek last year. I've been told that unserrated premax teeth likely belong to tyrannosaurs.

Wow that's a pretty small one also. Cool tooth. Perhaps usually not found as they are so tiny. But yours is perfect condition. Did you ever find out which species it belongs to?

[Troodon]

43 minutes ago, MedicineHat said:

@Troodon I guess it is horseshoe canyon FM. It was along red deer river in the area near tolman bridge. Not a usual area I get to go. 

Thats HC F.   Serrations? Think I see them

[MedicineHat]

Yes very challenging to tell but i do see some serrations. What could the presence of serrations mean in terms of species?

[Troodon]

Well it just complicates matters .  No serrations would mean Tyrannosaurid but serrations you bring in Dromaeosaurids and Tyrannosaurids.   Are they present on both edges or just one?

[MedicineHat]

1 hour ago, Troodon said:

Well it just complicates matters .  No serrations would mean Tyrannosaurid but serrations you bring in Dromaeosaurids and Tyrannosaurids.   Are they present on both edges or just one?

I will have to check it out in greater detail after work. Thanks

[Troodon]

I looked at one of my references and the D shape cross-section along with the strong center ridge on the face, points to a juvie Albertosaurus.  A Dromaeosaurid would have more of a flattish face and rounder cross-section. 

[gturner333]

I’ve got a question, Troodon. Above you say that no serrations mean Tyrannosaurid. Then you say that serrations could be (along with Dromaeosaurs) tyrannosaurid. I too have a premaxilary tooth much like this from the Aguja formation and it has no serrations. Any conclusions about mine. 

[MedicineHat]

On 2020-10-05 at 11:16 AM, Troodon said:

I looked at one of my references and the D shape cross-section along with the strong center ridge on the face, points to a juvie Albertosaurus.  A Dromaeosaurid would have more of a flattish face and rounder cross-section. 

Wow, that's great. Thanks for sharing! 

[Troodon]

On 10/5/2020 at 1:52 PM, gturner333 said:

I’ve got a question, Troodon. Above you say that no serrations mean Tyrannosaurid. Then you say that serrations could be (along with Dromaeosaurs) tyrannosaurid. I too have a premaxilary tooth much like this from the Aguja formation and it has no serrations. Any conclusions about mine. 

Sorry missed your post. On both edges are typically Tyrannosaurid and at one time they were called Aublysodon.  Dromaeosaurid usually have at least one edge serrated.  Post a picture and Ill look at it.