Stan the T. rex just sold for 27.5 million!

[Troodon]

5 hours ago, jpc said:

We could build a new building for just a touch more... a nice big modern one.  Where we could display our rex for everyone to see. 

Or like Dave Evans posted on Twitter:

"Stan sale in perspective: I calculated if the 32M was invested at 4% per annum return rate (which is very reasonable over long term for money this big), it could fund over 80 full, six week expeditions PER YEAR, FOREVER. Think of all the amazing specimens that would be found.."

[Dracorex_hogwartsia]

23 minutes ago, Troodon said:

Yes its Pete's brother Neil as part of the settlement of a lawsuit.

 

This is today's  press release by Pete Larsen (BHI)

 

STAN Press release 7OCT2020.pdf

Thank you! All I can say is this is very sad. I had no idea Pete and Neil no longer had a relationship. Very sad to hear.

[jpc]

3 hours ago, Dracorex_hogwartsia said:

Thank you! All I can say is this is very sad. I had no idea Pete and Neil no longer had a relationship. Very sad to hear.

Neal is spelled with an a

[Troodon]

40 minutes ago, jpc said:

Neal is spelled with an a

My bad

[FossilDAWG]

I doubt the calculation of how many expeditions could be funded includes the money land owners will now charge.  If someone has such an inflated notion of what fossils are worth, would they really allow museums to collect without getting "appropriately compensated" for the value of their property?

 

Don

[Troodon]

1 minute ago, FossilDAWG said:

I doubt the calculation of how many expeditions could be funded includes the money land owners will now charge.  If someone has such an inflated notion of what fossils are worth, would they really allow museums to collect without getting "appropriately compensated" for the value of their property?

 

Don

I think that's the dilemma that most museums will encounter when the leases run or they try to obtain access to land they have been previously been collecting.    The reality is most major T rex finds have been with commercial diggers and they should have an easier time gaining access.

[FossilDAWG]

On a slightly different note, the vast majority of paleontologists will not publish on a specimen unless it is deposited in a properly curated museum collection.  I believe several papers involve data from Stan (though I am not familiar enough with the literature to cite specific papers).  If a specimen moves from a research collection to private hands and is no longer available for study, how does that impact what has already been published?

 

Don

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

Hi all,

 

I just read the disturbing news that Tyrannosaurus rex Stan has been sold at auction yesterday. I must say I was very surprised, as I always thought Stan was on public display at the Black Hills Institute. I then read BHI was ordered by court order to put the dinosaur up for sale. I couldn't find any details on this, however. Anybody here know more about it?

[Fossildude19]

Topics merged.  

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

Found my answer here, as well as expression of a lot of my fears... I mean, the situation between Pete and Neal must've really gotten bad for this to have happened

 

I'm also quite offended by Stan being auctioned off on an art auction, which, indeed, just paints this specimen of such high importance as just simply a commodity to be enjoyed individually. I know this is a trend that has been developing over recent years, but I think it's a disconcerting one for both amateurs and academics alike. It completely denies a specimen's scientific merit and condones reducing it to an univectoral aesthetic value.

 

It's a sad, sad day for palaeontology... and for science in general. For, even if Stan will be put on public display again and will be made available for study, the damage to the field has already been done. In fact, it has ever since the courts decided the fossil had to be sold...

[FossilDAWG]

I do not know the Larson brothers, and I know nothing about this event other than what we all now know, which is that the court was charged with arranging a division of the assets of the Black Hills Institute.  So what I am about to say is speculation.  Assuming Stan represents about half the net worth of the Institute and it's collections, how could you divide the total assets while doing the least damage?  Would it have been better to force the liquidation of everything, the building, vehicles, all the collections, prepping tools, etc so the money could be split between the brothers?  Given that the assets had to be divided, it seems to me that giving Stan to one party and leave the remainder of the Institute intact was likely the least destructive path overall.

 

Don

[Troodon]

Heading to Abu Dhabi, a new huge museum

 

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/stan-the-t-rex-found-worlds-most-expensive-fossil-finds-home-in-a-new-museum

 

[jpc]

Thanks for this update.

 

[jpc]

 I thought Stan was in a good home in his/her original home.  I am crying more tears of sadness than joy.   

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

Though I can agree that it's horrible that Stan was sold and left the US in the first place (and I believe his sale and/or Covid definitely influenced fossil prices and availability), I still think things could've been worse. At least he's headed for a museum and should therefore remain available for study, and I'm sure the museum will moreover be outfitted to the latest standards. So while it obviously still hurts and the wound hasn't closed yet, I think we should also acknowledge this as a bit of light in all the darkness surrounding his sale...

 

In the end I don't think it is surprising Stan ended up in Abu Dhabi. With a wealthy city like that, that wishes to portray itself as modern and state of the art, a city of luxury and opulence, one might expect them to want a natural history museum of the same caliber, and international allure, to attract even more visitors to come. As such, it's quite possible that they'll turn Stan into some sort of attraction for the super-wealthy - but at least he'll be in a museum...

[fossilhunter21]

Fossils like that should not leave the country! I understand fossils worth a few thousand dollars. But not scientifically important fossils worth millions! This makes me very upset. 

 

Thank you for the update, @Troodon. 

Edited March 23, 2022 by fossilhunter21

[pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon]

While I fully agree that important pieces of cultural or natural heritage should not be allowed to permanently leave their country of origin, and share the feeling of loss of such an iconic specimen - my native country being the Netherlands, which is probably one of the, if not the, first country in the world to which this happened by way of the Mosasaurus hoffmannii holotype, which is now in Paris and which the Dutch government still keeps trying to repatriate from time to time - I do think the case of Stan should also give us cause for reflection. For it's far from a rare occurrence in the fields of both archaeology and especially palaeontology that significant or even iconic specimens end up abroad, away from the place they originated at. The various pliosaur skeletons on exhibit in southern German museums being a case in point, as are the Elgin Marbles or the Tanzanian Giraffatitan now on display in the Museum für Naturkunde in Berlin. This even happens when the country of origin - such as, for example, Brazil - have long-standing legislation prohibiting such exports, which, of course, makes such theft all the worse.

 

In a way, I think it's a shortcoming from the US federal government that they do not have the necessary legislation in place to prevent the export of iconic specimen, as Stan obviously was. This, in itself, is, of course, a general issue with the commercialisation of American fossils, which is a whole can of worms I don't wish to open. Suffice it to say that other models, such as the Canadian or British one have been more successful, and that other countries, like Germany, have, in recent years, tried to follow suit (in the case of Germany without much success, however, due to overly stringent laws and resistance thereto from individual collectors).

 

It's a sad story, but I believe that, apart from Stan ending up in a museum rather than a private collection, there may be two positive outcomes to what happened. Firstly, lets hope this course of events has either woken up federal government directly or attains significant enough public outcry to bring about legislative changes. And, secondly, lets hope that now Stan's new home is known, the US-federal government will recognise his iconic status and will, with time, start its requests for repatriation. In any case, such issues no longer seem the prerogative of formerly colonial nations...

[Kane]

Although not a popular view, I subscribe to the notion that paleontological specimens belong to the world and scientific community as a whole and not to any particular nation given how -- in the context of history -- nations are fleeting. "Stan" is safely housed in an institution where theoretically further study can be done. With respect to the genuine/original and singular specimen itself, I cannot help but be reminded of Walter Benjamin's discussion of the "aura." 

[fossilhunter21]

10 minutes ago, Kane said:

Although not a popular view, I subscribe to the notion that paleontological specimens belong to the world and scientific community as a whole and not to any particular nation given how -- in the context of history -- nations are fleeting. "Stan" is safely housed in an institution where theoretically further study can be done. With respect to the genuine/original and singular specimen itself, I cannot help but be reminded of Walter Benjamin's discussion of the "aura." 

I actually mostly agree with you, but I think that fossils like that should not be permanently removed from the country of origin. 

[DPS Ammonite]

1 hour ago, Kane said:

With respect to the genuine/original and singular specimen itself, I cannot help but be reminded of Walter Benjamin's discussion of the "aura." 

 

Here is a quote from a paper about Benjamin’s “aura.”

 

“The aura has disappeared in the modern age because art has become reproducible. Think of the way a work of classic literature can be bought cheaply in paperback, or a painting bought as a poster. Think also of newer forms of art, such as TV shows and adverts. Then compare these to the experience of staring at an original work of art in a gallery, or visiting a unique historic building. This is the difference Benjamin is trying to capture.”

 

I think what is being said about an aura is that it is a more profound experience seeing a work of art (fossils too) in person vs. seeing a reproduction. It reminds me of my addition to the old saying. I say that if a picture is worth a thousand words than seeing the article (including a work of art or a fossil) is worth a thousand photos.

So many times I wish that I could see items posted on the Forum in person in microscopic detail with my hand lens and near-sighted eyes to determine what they are: wood, bone, rock, sponge etc.

 

https://ceasefiremagazine.co.uk/walter-benjamin-art-aura-authenticity/