Another STH unidentified bone/tooth

[JBMugu]

After the forums last successful ID of a desmostylus tooth, I thought I would see if you guys have any ideas on this one. I have had it for a while and still can't figure it out. 3 inches long, one inch thick. Please let me know your ideas! 

@siteseer, @Shellseeker

[M Harvey]

very interesting.  Any idea on the age or formation?

[siteseer]

Hi Jesse,

 

I've seen a similar cross-section.  I think it's a partial whale tooth.  I posted something weird like that a couple of years ago and Bobby said it was a whale tooth.

 

Jess

[siteseer]

2 minutes ago, M Harvey said:

very interesting.  Any idea on the age or formation?

 

He said it was "STH," which is short for Sharktooth Hill [Bonebed.]  It's middle Miocene roughly 15 million years old.

 

Jess

[Shellseeker]

10 hours ago, JBMugu said:

After the forums last successful ID of a desmostylus tooth, I thought I would see if you guys have any ideas on this one. I have had it for a while and still can't figure it out. 3 inches long, one inch thick. Please let me know your ideas! 

 

I am glad that Jess got to this 1st.... I have not seen anything like it, but I can not think of anything beyond  overly worn whale... I think I have seen horizontal lines in the circled valley area... but maybe I imagine it

 

[JBMugu]

Thanks guys, if it was a whale tooth it would have been a monster. Too bad it wasn't whole. Most of the whale teeth I find are relatively small. @Shellseeker it's actually not that worn, there are weird lines on what I am guessing is the root? 

 

@siteseer thanks for adding the formation info, I guess I am getting lazy and assuming everyone knows what STH is. I'll make sure to be more thorough in the future. Your welcome to come down for a dig sometime, I owe you for all the information IDs!

[Shellseeker]

10 hours ago, JBMugu said:

Thanks guys, if it was a whale tooth it would have been a monster. Too bad it wasn't whole. Most of the whale teeth I find are relatively small. @Shellseeker it's actually not that worn, there are weird lines on what I am guessing is the root? 

 

It somewhat resembles Scaldicetus. I have a couple that run over 6 inches in length. The dentine growth rings are horizontal, but the outside cementum has longitudinal striations. So,  If you look at the 1st 2 photos, these are water polished,  looks like enamel but actually dentine, cementum, and enamel.  "Worn" was a poor choice on my part,  I should have said "polished".

If you look at the 3rd photo below, you clearly see longitudinal banding in the cementum, and in the bottom photos,  the rounding of the shape going into the root core.

 

I said it somewhat resembles Scaldicetus. A gallary album (@isurus90064 )references Scaldicetus teeth from STH.  I still think there is low probability that your fossil is Scaldicetus because of those "wierd lines"...

 

This above photo from Harry.

[siteseer]

On 12/1/2020 at 8:51 PM, JBMugu said:

Thanks guys, if it was a whale tooth it would have been a monster. Too bad it wasn't whole. Most of the whale teeth I find are relatively small. @Shellseeker it's actually not that worn, there are weird lines on what I am guessing is the root? 

 

@siteseer thanks for adding the formation info, I guess I am getting lazy and assuming everyone knows what STH is. I'll make sure to be more thorough in the future. Your welcome to come down for a dig sometime, I owe you for all the information IDs!

 

Yeah, it's a widely-known abbreviation but anyone new or relatively new to fossil collecting might not know it especially if they overlook it in the thread title or don't live in the region.

 

Thanks for the invitation.  I haven't been to Bakersfield in years.  I assume it's still hot from May to October and cold December-February.

 

Jess

[siteseer]

Hi Jack,

 

They do find teeth of a type of giant sperm whale like Scaldicetus in the STH Bonebed but they are super-rare.  Longtime collector, Bob Ernst, found maybe just 3-4 essentially-complete teeth and some pieces of them across decades from the 70's to 2007, the year of his passing.  Like the modern sperm whale, it was likely an animal of the open sea rarely entering bays.

 

Jess

[Shellseeker]

On 12/3/2020 at 3:14 AM, siteseer said:

Hi Jack,

 

They do find teeth of a type of giant sperm whale like Scaldicetus in the STH Bonebed but they are super-rare.  Longtime collector, Bob Ernst, found maybe just 3-4 essentially-complete teeth and some pieces of them across decades from the 70's to 2007, the year of his passing.  Like the modern sperm whale, it was likely an animal of the open sea rarely entering bays.

 

Jess

 

Thanks for the response, Jess.  I had been wondering why no larger whale teeth at STH.  Jesse had spoiled me with some of the smaller ones. I have seen numerous 5-7 inch whale teeth come out of Florida,  many from Bone Valley 80 miles inland. Makes me wonder how deep the salt water was over my primary hunting areas if I can find such teeth.

Jack

[siteseer]

20 hours ago, Shellseeker said:

 

Thanks for the response, Jess.  I had been wondering why no larger whale teeth at STH.  Jesse had spoiled me with some of the smaller ones. I have seen numerous 5-7 inch whale teeth come out of Florida,  many from Bone Valley 80 miles inland. Makes me wonder how deep the salt water was over my primary hunting areas if I can find such teeth.

Jack

 

Hi Jack,

 

In the middle Miocene a large whale was one 30 feet long.  By the end of the Miocene there were whales twice that size.  I assume there were 30-60 whales in the middle Miocene but they were rare.

 

I've seen those Scaldicetus-grade teeth from Bone Valley and the South Carolina rivers but the biggest ones I've ever seen came out of Chile when they were legal to export.  I haven't seen one of those for sale in years.

 

Jess