Any one know what this is?

[grg1109]

Found at the Kashong Member, Finger Lakes, NYS, Middle Devonian.  I've not seen this before...I'm assuming that it is the "inside" of something.  The slab is mostly made up of Bryazoans, a few Crinoid stem pieces.  I've added some others to make it more interesting.

[Fossildude19]

Hey Greg, 

That looks like a cross section of a bryozoan, to me. 

 

[grg1109]

Ok...I kinda figured that because the slab is full of Bryazoa...but, wanted to make sure.

Thanks

Greg

[Rockwood]

Knowing the scale would be helpful. If it's as large as I see it, those would be pores in the walls of a tabulate. Favositid perhaps.

[Myrmica]

What a fantastic plate.

[grg1109]

30 minutes ago, Myrmica said:

What a fantastic plate

Thanks...I really like it!

The size is 1 1/2"L X 3/8"W

Greg

[Rockwood]

2 hours ago, grg1109 said:

The size is 1 1/2"L X 3/8"W

I think that puts it over the bryozoan limit in most cases. I'm still thinking favositid.

@TqB You around ? It's been a little while since I did this to ya. 

[grg1109]

I think it is within Bryozoan size limits.  Shown below are ones that I've come across before.  The height is about the same, but much wider on this one(Atactotoechus fruticosus).  But it has termination points along the sides where the animals fed from.  The apparant lack of these "termiation points"  along the sides is what I don't understand.  It all seems to terminate at the top.

Greg

 

Edited May 15, 2021 by grg1109

[Rockwood]

I think you're threading a coarse nut on a fine bolt.

Can you give us a closer look at it ?

[TqB]

10 hours ago, Rockwood said:

I think that puts it over the bryozoan limit in most cases. I'm still thinking favositid.

@TqB You around ? It's been a little while since I did this to ya. 

Hi Rockwood!  I had looked at this but the photo's not clear enough to tell for sure. It looks as if the tube size is well under 1mm - but 0.5 - 1.0mm is that awkward crossover range…  A photo of the wide end with an accurate measurement or scale at that point might help.

Edited May 15, 2021 by TqB

[grg1109]

11 hours ago, Rockwood said:

I think you're threading a coarse nut on a fine bolt.

Can you describe what you mean?  I do not know what your representing as a coarse nut or a fine bolt.  It would be more helpful.

 

Below are some close ups...starting with the bottom, top (x2) and as much of the end(x2) of the top as I could get.

Greg

Edited May 15, 2021 by grg1109

[grg1109]

5 hours ago, TqB said:

 A photo of the wide end with an accurate measurement or scale at that point might help

Here is are photos with a ruler in mm.

[Rockwood]

Much better. Bryozoan. fine thread 

Fine thread 32 threads/inch.

Coarse example on same scale: 20 threads/inch. These would represent a much larger unit within the structure. They would also have small holes in rows along the long axis.

[Rockwood]

I think this may be one of the tabulates @TqB referred to as in the awkward range.

Using my thread analogy it would be a coarse thread on a smaller bolt.

[grg1109]

Thanks for your help...so far it's been suggested as a Coral, Bryozoan and Crinoid.  A real conundrum!

Greg

[Rockwood]

9 minutes ago, grg1109 said:

  A real conundrum!

At this resolution you can trust Tq when he gets to it.

[Tetradium]

26 minutes ago, grg1109 said:

Thanks for your help...so far it's been suggested as a Coral, Bryozoan and Crinoid.  A real conundrum!

Greg

Its NOT crinoid. The only thing I could tell was that it once was part of a much larger colony which broke apart into smaller pieces. As to whenever its coral or bryozoan I don't know. 

[grg1109]

I don't think I'll ever find out for sure...now plant material and sponges have entered the picture.  I didn't really think too much of Crinoid, and definately not plant material.  I sort of assumed Bryozoan in the beginning, but the problem with a Bryozoan is that the "fibers" don't curve to the sides.  I've seen this in a paper dedicated to Bryozoans and personally, and from what I've found...they all contain "fibers" that curve to the sides.  I would think that coral would have a different texture as well...at least my experiance with horn corals and one colony coral(I know...there are many different corals).   I can't find too much on Sponges(perhaps).  It appears in the larger one that it may have had a depression or been hollow...at least at the top.  But, I think my best bet is a "Witches Broom", which was an off the cuff suggestion.

Greg

Edited May 15, 2021 by grg1109

[Rockwood]

WiKi 

[TqB]

Great photos - it's definitely not a coral anyway. I agree with @grg1109 that the tubes look too long and straight to be bryozoan and I can't see it being any part of a crinoid.

 

I think sponge is looking good, maybe a hexactinellid root mass (often called Hyalostelia though that is actually just one well defined genus that has this sort of structure).

Not sure if @Spongy Joe is around on here at the moment?

 

 

Edited May 16, 2021 by TqB

[DPS Ammonite]

44 minutes ago, TqB said:

I think sponge is looking good, maybe a hexactinellid root mass (often called Hyalostelia though that is actually just one well defined genus that has this sort of structure).

What are you calling part of a sponge? 

[TqB]

1 hour ago, DPS Ammonite said:

What are you calling part of a sponge? 

This (presumably the small one at the top is the same). But I'm not certain.

Edited May 16, 2021 by TqB

[Rockwood]

Just to perhaps clean up my mess. Is this a small tabulate ?

[grg1109]

1 hour ago, Rockwood said:

Just to perhaps clean up my mess. Is this a small tabulate ?

No mess...I assumed it was a Bryozoan as well.   Also, I added this topic to 2 other forums.   Although I got many answers...the concensous was Bryozoan.  The first photo below shows a closer veiw of what you circled(hope it helps as I do not know).  The other two are of the slab...just look at the amount and diverse species of Bryozoa.  The last photo is approx. 1" to 1 1/2" in dia.

Thank You for your help...it is appreciated.

Greg

Edited May 16, 2021 by grg1109

[Rockwood]

30 minutes ago, grg1109 said:

No mess...I assumed it was a Bryozoan as well. 

Thanks. I see. Must be old navy. Battle ship frontal walls with port holes.