Suchomimus tooth or croc?

[Le Quoc]

Hello everyone! I got this tooth from a seller, he said that it was found in Niger but he don’t know that it suchominus tooth Or Croc tooth. Can you help me to have a look on it? 
thanks guys

[jpc]

the preservation is typical for Niger's Tiouraren Fm.  I don't know if Suchimimus is found in this formation.   Others know better than I do.  

[Troodon]

What formation and locality is it from?  Key in identification.  On the surface looks like croc given where the two carinae are located and cross-section 

 

Suchomimus teeth usually are conical in shape, have braided enamel and small denticles on the carina which is diagnostic.  I cannot determine the last two characteristics from your photos but still believe its croc.

 

Suchomimus is found in the Elrhaz Formation around Gadoufaoua

[Kikokuryu]

So this tooth, I believe was part of the same group I purchased my theropod teeth from. In fact, your specimen is in the group of photos I posted in the thread as reference, the middle tooth in the 3rd row in the group picture. Out of the 24-25 or so specimens, none of them are definitively Cretaceous. But there are Jurassic sauropod teeth in there, so some, if not all of these are possibly Jurassic.

 

If all of these specimens came from the same site, then they are all Jurassic in age, meaning, not Suchomimus. But, they could have been mixed from all over Niger gathered up into one lot before they were sent to America. The only provenance given was outside the city of Agadez, and they came from the same shipment from a single source in Niger.

 

I don't know how common it is for diggers in Niger to pile up specimens from multiple formations into a single lot, but it's a possibility. Similar problem, if not worse with the Atlas Mountain stuff from Morocco. Should we assume specimens from a single lot come from a single site, or should we always assume they are all jumbled up? Probably a case by case.

 

 

[Troodon]

4 hours ago, Kikokuryu said:

don't know how common it is for diggers in Niger to pile up specimens from multiple formations into a single lot, but it's a possibility. Similar problem, if not worse with the Atlas Mountain stuff from Morocco. Should we assume specimens from a single lot come from a single site, or should we always assume they are all jumbled up? Probably a case by case.

 

I've made the same comments several times and since the deposits of the Irhazer Group and Tegama Group are adjacent to one another its very possible that Jurassic and Cretaceous material get mixed up.   Its not a big area.  The good news here is that a lot of the teeth are distinctive so you just have to be careful with lots of good photos and locality.  Its exactly the same problem we see from Argentina and like you mentioned certain areas of  Morocco 

[Le Quoc]

Thanks everyone for give me the best ID. From the tooth I have with my local experience, I’m fossil collector from Vietnam so I have read a lot of documents they have done about Creataceous in Laos and Thailand with the reddish sediment. The bottom of the tooth that I have purchased it have the same reddish sediment still stuck on it (photo bellow). So that I think this tooth maybe from Creataceous time. Do you have any idea about it? 
 

 

On 7/16/2021 at 1:30 PM, Kikokuryu said:

So this tooth, I believe was part of the same group I purchased my theropod teeth from. In fact, your specimen is in the group of photos I posted in the thread as reference, the middle tooth in the 3rd row in the group picture. Out of the 24-25 or so specimens, none of them are definitively Cretaceous. But there are Jurassic sauropod teeth in there, so some, if not all of these are possibly Jurassic.

 

If all of these specimens came from the same site, then they are all Jurassic in age, meaning, not Suchomimus. But, they could have been mixed from all over Niger gathered up into one lot before they were sent to America. The only provenance given was outside the city of Agadez, and they came from the same shipment from a single source in Niger.

 

I don't know how common it is for diggers in Niger to pile up specimens from multiple formations into a single lot, but it's a possibility. Similar problem, if not worse with the Atlas Mountain stuff from Morocco. Should we assume specimens from a single lot come from a single site, or should we always assume they are all jumbled up? Probably a case by case.

 

 

 

[Troodon]

The matrix in the new photos most likely support the tooth being Jurassic in age see excerpt noted below.  Every geographic area can have different color sediments and one cannot assume its the same.

 

Excerpt from paper on Tiourarén Fm, Rauhut et al. (2009)

"The Tiouaren Formation is mainly made up of reddish to purple siltstones"

 

[Le Quoc]

On 7/17/2021 at 8:15 PM, Troodon said:

The matrix in the new photos most likely support the tooth being Jurassic in age see excerpt noted below.  Every geographic area can have different color sediments and one cannot assume its the same.

 

Excerpt from paper on Tiourarén Fm, Rauhut et al. (2009)

"The Tiouaren Formation is mainly made up of reddish to purple siltstones"

 

 Thank you very much! At least I know the tooth is crocodile tooth from Jurassic of Niger. Even it not a suchomimus tooth but it nice to have material from Niger!