Keichousaurus Help please

[RobFallen]

Hi guys looking for some professional advice.

Possibly buying this Keichousaurus and wondered if any experts can confirm it is a genuine/real one and not a fake or reproduction?

This is the only pic I took sorry, thank you for any advice.

 

[Top Trilo]

With Keichousaurus you generally look at

Preservation, before anyone even saw this specimen what was its condition

Preparation, many of these are poorly prepped with acid unfortunately

Paint, to cover up problems with the previous two they sometimes use paint.

 

This is for most specimens, some may have other problems but these are most common. I do not believe yours has any paint on it however there are no zoomed in images to make a more accurate assessment. As far as Preservation and Preparation, I will let those who are more skilled and have more experience talk about that.

[Fossildude19]

Welcome to the Forum.

This looks completely real.

It is not complete, and probably has some paint (ribs).

As long as it is not too expensive, I think this is an OK/fair specimen.

 

[Fossildude19]

The bright white on the keich is likely to be ink/paint.

 

 

 

[Top Trilo]

3 minutes ago, Fossildude19 said:

The bright white on the keich is likely to be ink/paint.

 

 

 

Thanks, Tim I see what you mean, however would it be fair to assume that the bright parts on the bottom of the vertebrae and arm bones aren't paint, just shadow. I do see how the base of some of the ribs (not in shadow) are darker.

[Fossildude19]

I believe the vertebral column and a few of the ribs are painted. Bad acid prep or rotary wire wheel prep is responsible for a lot of paint jobs needing to be applied.

 

The positioning is odd as well. This is a dorsal presentation, and the arms are up behind the ribs.  Something seems a bit off about that. 

[RobFallen]

6 minutes ago, Fossildude19 said:

I believe the vertebral column and a few of the ribs are painted. Bad acid prep or rotary wire wheel prep is responsible for a lot of paint jobs needing to be applied.

 

The positioning is odd as well. This is a dorsal presentation, and the arms are up behind the ribs.  Something seems a bit off about that. 

So is it best avoided? been after one for about 4 years, dont trust online and this one has been localish for about a year lol

[Fossildude19]

It really depends on you. 

Most of the keichousaurs out there have some degree of paint added. That really isn't an issue.

As I said, if it is inexpensive, I would consider it. But the kinked neck, odd arm position, and lack of feet/hands makes this specimen a bit less desirable to many collectors.

You might be able to offer the seller less if you can contact  them.

It is totally up to you whether you like this enough to buy it.  A really good one can go up to the high  hundreds of dollars.

It totally depends on your tastes. This looks a bit more natural than some, but not perfect positioning, prep, or preservation.

 

 

[FranzBernhard]

9 minutes ago, RobFallen said:

So is it best avoided?

Yes! Prep isn´t very good and there is some work done to cover this up. "Posing" isn´t very good, lets be honest, its bad. Essentially, legs and "fingers" are not visible.

A few days ago, we had a quite nice unprepped one here for examination:

Franz Bernhard

[RobFallen]

thanks to you all, there is 2 others that is cheaper but I don't think look as good? why is it so hard to find one lol? pics

 

 

Edited September 7, 2021 by RobFallen

[Fossildude19]

The second one looks OK, but is missing the front half of the skull.

[Fossildude19]

The last one looks OK, typical horrible wire brush prep though.   

[FranzBernhard]

Oh well, the last one is really ground to death. This could have been a quite nice specimen. Now its death a second time...

 

These Keichs are usually so lovely and detailed preserved fossils, with such tiny and delicate bones. Yes, they are common, but they really need and deserve a gentle treatment. I think, I have already stated that some time ago: These Keichs are often so well preserved, that, with the right and gentle prep, they can nearly be brought back to life. With such disaster prep jobs as above, well, they are killed a second time...

 

Franz Bernhard

Edited September 7, 2021 by FranzBernhard

[snolly50]

I find the odd posturing of the initial piece to be a positive indicator of authenticity. Regarding paint mischief, in hand with a 10X loupe will provide all the evidence you will need. It would require the most skilled of sure-handed painters to coat those small structures without some straying "out of the lines."

[Bobby Rico]

I quite like the first specimen with the little bit mangled posture but the prize must reflect this. Just my opinion.

[Crazyhen]

All are genuine in my view but very badly prepped. The posture of the first one is weird but I found it more interesting than the typical limbs spreading out ones (if you already got the typical ones).  Look at the specimen of a similar posture below, it's properly prepped.

[RobFallen]

Sorry for my delayed response and thanks to everyone who has helped thus far, so and update....

I decided to go ahead and buy the first one, it was messed up but I had grown to like it, I phoned the place up and paid over the phone, today I received this, not the same one but is it better or should I complain?? I have spoke with them and they apologised and offered me a full refund if I decide I am not happy, the one I wanted that I saw in June had been sold and this one was posted in its place

So my question is is this one better? should I be happier with this one that the other one lol? the back of this one is pretty loose and shining UV on it isn't showing much white patches etc either which I think I read is a good sign?? size of matrix 32cm x 21.5cm x 1 or just under cm thick

Many thanks

Edited September 15, 2021 by RobFallen

[RobFallen]

Sorry guys I forgot to ask another Noob question, is there a way to stabilize the back of the fossil to stop it flaking?? couple of small bits flaked off when I moved it, thanks again

[Randyw]

Im torn. I like the skeleton better on the one you got but i like the skull and neck better on the first one. The big question is are you happy with it….

maybe a compronise? Get a partial refund?

As to the flaking if you want it visible id use some paraloid or similar on the back. If its not visible you could glue a backer on it. Especially if those marks going across it are fractures….

[Crazyhen]

Like the original one, this one is also acid/mechanically prepped so the bones are worn out.  But it's genuine.  As RanyW said, the original one got a better skull and neck but this one got a better looking skeleton.  I would say both are of comparable quality and it really depends on whether you like it or not.  I am however not happy that the seller made such a "mistake" and didn't inform you before you placed the order.

 

If you want to stabilize the back, you can use paraloid as suggested.  I use Acrysol WS24 to coat a transparent coating on the back of the matrix with good result too.  If you can't acquire these, you could also made a back support with a plastic sheet and glued the plate with glass sealant.  I would suggest you either cover the back with a coating of paraloid/Acrysol or make a back support as the matrix looks quite fragile and prone to be breaking apart to me.

[RobFallen]

6 hours ago, Randyw said:

Im torn. I like the skeleton better on the one you got but i like the skull and neck better on the first one. The big question is are you happy with it….

maybe a compronise? Get a partial refund?

As to the flaking if you want it visible id use some paraloid or similar on the back. If its not visible you could glue a backer on it. Especially if those marks going across it are fractures….

I like parts of it better than the first one but other parts of the first better lol the broken corner of the matrix annoys me a little bit but otherwise im pretty happy with it, probably just more happy to have finally got one after looking for a few years

Thanks for the advice re coating the back, total noob to this so I shall have a look into that, it is for sure flaky at the back

[RobFallen]

6 hours ago, Crazyhen said:

Like the original one, this one is also acid/mechanically prepped so the bones are worn out.  But it's genuine.  As RanyW said, the original one got a better skull and neck but this one got a better looking skeleton.  I would say both are of comparable quality and it really depends on whether you like it or not.  I am however not happy that the seller made such a "mistake" and didn't inform you before you placed the order.

 

If you want to stabilize the back, you can use paraloid as suggested.  I use Acrysol WS24 to coat a transparent coating on the back of the matrix with good result too.  If you can't acquire these, you could also made a back support with a plastic sheet and glued the plate with glass sealant.  I would suggest you either cover the back with a coating of paraloid/Acrysol or make a back support as the matrix looks quite fragile and prone to be breaking apart to me.

Wasn't happy myself to be honest but it is what it is as they say, I can return it but its kinda grew on me now its here plus how long I have wanted one for, the body like you say does look better for sure, I think I will keep it and perhaps look for another, its a good excuse to have two lol

[Bobby Rico]

I painted  the back of mine with a heavy tar like varnish and clear resin other the top about  12 years ago , I have had no problems it is very stable . I will email a friend who gave me the stuff to see if he can remember what it is call, 

 

I prefer the first one sadly. If that was me I would push to get quite a bit of money off. It is in their best interest to keep you happy and posting  it back to them there Is alway a danger of it getting broken.  
 

cheers Bobby 

Edited September 16, 2021 by Bobby Rico

[RobFallen]

1 hour ago, Bobby Rico said:

I painted  the back of mine with a heavy tar like varnish and clear resin other the top about  12 years ago , I have had no problems it is very stable . I will email a friend who gave me the stuff to see if he can remember what it is call, 

 

I prefer the first one sadly. If that was me I would push to get quite a bit of money off. It is in their best interest to keep you happy and posting  it back to them there Is alway a danger of it getting broken.  
 

cheers Bobby 

Cheers pal that could be a way also, I guess its best to break off carefully most of the loose stuff first and then seal it

[RobFallen]

So I finally get one when I couldn't find one for years and now a 2nd is available at an ok price elsewhere lol what is your thoughts on this one guys? I have space for two of them no problem feel free to tell me to shut up about these fossils if required lol however they are current favourites along with my mammoth teeth