Lucid_Bot Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 Hi. The geological info for this find is: Pennsylvanian (Carboniferous), Conemaugh Group, Glenshaw Formation. I've been digging at an outcrop near a local stream and finding a lot of pecopteroids, neuropteroids, calamites, some sphenopteroids and possibly lepidodendron/stigmaria, sigillaria and cordaites. Recently the rain washed away the dirt at the base of this outcrop. Cutting away the rock at the base I found at least a dozen instances of these somewhat cylindrical and flat-topped and flat-bottomed rocks sitting one on top of the other. The first picture shows a cavity from which I removed some of these rocks. I don't know if it helps, but there's a lot of iron in this area. Any ideas would be appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 Welcome to the Forum. Could they be infilled burrows, or root casts? Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucid_Bot Posted September 8, 2021 Author Share Posted September 8, 2021 (edited) Thanks. I really don't know what an infilled burrow is. Although I was thinking root casts when I saw them. Should've mentioned this, but all over the base was a pattern that sort of reminded me of stigmaria (a little like a honey comb), but also vertical groves like calamites. Certainly anyone's guess is better than mine here. They couldn't be bones could they? Edited September 8, 2021 by Lucid_Bot addition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 Due to the lack of a 'pith-cast', I do not think these are Stigmaria. If you see a 'diamond pattern', they could be Lepidodendron. 1 "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucid_Bot Posted September 8, 2021 Author Share Posted September 8, 2021 8 minutes ago, Auspex said: Due to the lack of a 'pith-cast', I do not think these are Stigmaria. If you see a 'diamond pattern', they could be Lepidodendron. If you don't mind me asking: why would such branches be separated into discreet units and not just one long piece? Thanks btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, Lucid_Bot said: If you don't mind me asking: why would such branches be separated into discreet units and not just one long piece? Thanks btw. Decomposition and/or breakage from storm damage. Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 34 minutes ago, Lucid_Bot said: Thanks. I really don't know what an infilled burrow is. They couldn't be bones could they? Infilled burrows would be burrows made by crustaceans or other invertebrates, that become filled with mud, then turn to stone. A cast of a burrow, if you will. There is no way these are bones - no bone texture or morphology. Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucid_Bot Posted September 8, 2021 Author Share Posted September 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, Fossildude19 said: Infilled burrows would be burrows made by crustaceans or other invertebrates, that become filled with mud, then turn to stone. A cast of a burrow, if you will. There is no way these are bones - no bone texture or morphology. I've been doing this by myself since I started. Very nice to just get answers from someone, so thanks again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 Happy to help out. Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 That's a calamites forcing it's way up through overburden like a horsetail through blacktop. I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 30 minutes ago, Rockwood said: That's a calamites forcing it's way up through overburden like a horsetail through blacktop. I think. I don't see enough structure in them to say it's Calamites. Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 22 minutes ago, Fossildude19 said: I don't see enough structure in them to say it's Calamites. Step back and look at the fuzzy picture, then note the folding in the very plant like surface texture in the cleanly separated sections. If that ain't structure .. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted September 8, 2021 Share Posted September 8, 2021 1 hour ago, Rockwood said: That's a calamites forcing it's way up through overburden like a horsetail through blacktop. I think. I know what you're saying, but I can't rule it in, or out. The things are bordering on nondescript. @Lucid_Bot Sometimes wetting things of this nature will bring out hidden details. 1 "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucid_Bot Posted September 9, 2021 Author Share Posted September 9, 2021 I think you can see the pattern better on this. It has ridges running vertically and bumps. I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 Humm . . . Rows of circles lined up in columns = sigillaria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucid_Bot Posted September 9, 2021 Author Share Posted September 9, 2021 6 hours ago, Rockwood said: Humm . . . Rows of circles lined up in columns = sigillaria. I don't know if this helps, but on closer examination it seems to have this pattern: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petalodus12 Posted September 9, 2021 Share Posted September 9, 2021 19 hours ago, Lucid_Bot said: Hi. The geological info for this find is: Pennsylvanian (Carboniferous), Conemaugh Group, Glenshaw Formation. I've been digging at an outcrop near a local stream and finding a lot of pecopteroids, neuropteroids, calamites, some sphenopteroids and possibly lepidodendron/stigmaria, sigillaria and cordaites. Recently the rain washed away the dirt at the base of this outcrop. Cutting away the rock at the base I found at least a dozen instances of these somewhat cylindrical and flat-topped and flat-bottomed rocks sitting one on top of the other. The first picture shows a cavity from which I removed some of these rocks. I don't know if it helps, but there's a lot of iron in this area. Any ideas would be appreciated. These are root casts. I know this outcrop, and these are extremely abundant there. The ones that I have found do not retain enough of the plant material to make a confident ID. Stratigraphically, this zone is located in the Mason Shales, below the Brush Creek Limestone. I can PM you with more information about this outcrop, including a complete floral list if you would be interested. I would also suggest that you are extremely careful when digging here. For one, this outcrop is quite unstable. Also, the surrounding environment retains one of the most biodiverse plant ecosystems in Allegheny County, so attempting not to damage this ecosystem should be a top priority. I hike there often, so I hope to see you there! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucid_Bot Posted September 9, 2021 Author Share Posted September 9, 2021 29 minutes ago, Petalodus12 said: These are root casts. I know this outcrop, and these are extremely abundant there. The ones that I have found do not retain enough of the plant material to make a confident ID. Stratigraphically, this zone is located in the Mason Shales, below the Brush Creek Limestone. I can PM you with more information about this outcrop, including a complete floral list if you would be interested. I would also suggest that you are extremely careful when digging here. For one, this outcrop is quite unstable. Also, the surrounding environment retains one of the most biodiverse plant ecosystems in Allegheny County, so attempting not to damage this ecosystem should be a top priority. I hike there often, so I hope to see you there! That outcrop has yielded some great finds for me. I'm very interested in whatever information you can provide. And thanks for the warning, I've noticed its instability. Hopefully see you around and thanks for the response. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cngodles Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 This looks familiar. I found something similar in the Glenshaw: https://fossil.15656.com/2021/03/23/fossilized-carboniferous-taproot/ 1 Fossils of Parks Township - Research | Catalog | How-to Make High-Contrast Photos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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