More fossil help

[Quitter]

Unknown origin on Fern like specimen. Found the other 2 in Central Iowa US.

[Tidgy's Dad]

Well, the last one is a brachiopod, probably an orthid. 

[Quitter]

Ah, thank you. can check it off the list

[Rockwood]

 Fern ? In concretion. Somehow it just doesn't quite have the expected texture.

I wouldn't rule out the bryozoan archamedies.

[R0b]

Maybe

 

 

[Rockwood]

Yep. See what I mean ? 

[Quitter]

Looked up bryozoan archamedes. This doesn’t seem cork screwy looks more like a leaf?

[Quitter]

Looks leafy. Sorry trying to learn forum use.

[Fossildude19]

I am firmly in the fern camp on this.

Looks like a worn Alethopteris sp. in a concretion.

 

Cropped, brightened, and rotated:

 

   

 

 

[Top Trilo]

I agree that, the plant appears to be from Mazon Creek Illinois. Lots of experts on the Mazon Creek flora and one may ID it soon

Edit: Sooner than I thought 

Edited October 27, 2021 by Top Trilo

[Rockwood]

[Quitter]

Wow! Impressive bunch. Can’t wait to make a label

[Rockwood]

1 hour ago, Top Trilo said:

Edit: Sooner than I thought 

No offense intended, but how do you figure ?

[Fossildude19]

@Nimravis  @stats  @connorp  @paleoflor  @RCFossils  @deutscheben  @Mark Kmiecik

[connorp]

Looks like Alethopteris serlii. Probably, but not necessarily, from the Mazon Creek area.

[Rockwood]

36 minutes ago, Fossildude19 said:

@Nimravis  @stats  @connorp  @paleoflor  @RCFossils  @deutscheben  @Mark Kmiecik

 The Powel Doctrine of paleontology. 

[Fossildude19]

Never hurts to have multiple opinions. 

[Nimravis]

2 hours ago, connorp said:

Looks like Alethopteris serlii. Probably, but not necessarily, from the Mazon Creek area.

I agree.

[Top Trilo]

7 hours ago, Rockwood said:

No offense intended, but how do you figure ?

As I was writing, Tim had not posted his informative comment, when I posted, I realized he had just identified it.

[Rockwood]

I think he has gotten used to me giving him a little ribbing now and then. Notice the response. 

[Mark Kmiecik]

8 hours ago, connorp said:

Looks like Alethopteris serlii. Probably, but not necessarily, from the Mazon Creek area.

This would be my best guess also, but a better detailed photo may prove it to be something else. Definitely appears like MC material.

[stats]

18 hours ago, Quitter said:

Unknown origin on Fern like specimen. Found the other 2 in Central Iowa US.

Awesome Alethopteris serlii!  Looks Mazon Creek... maybe Pit 1.  But, known from other localities.  Could also be a different fossil deposit like the ones near Terre Haute, IN.  Knob Noster, MO has a different, very distinctive look.

 

Cheers,

Rich

Edited October 28, 2021 by stats

[paleoflor]

Certainly alethopterid foliage. Most likely Alethopteris too, though the venation is not visible on the photo, which leaves some room for alternatives like Lonchopteridium and Lonchopteris (similar pinnule shapes, but with pseudo-anastomosing and anastomosing venation, respectively). Regarding the specific identification, though, I'm quite unsure... I'm therefore also intrigued by the seemingly clear consensus among some experienced Mazon Creek collectors here on the TFF (way more familiar with the locality and its flora than I am, for sure). How are you all so confident this is an A. serlii on the basis of the photo provided? While I can see some resemblance with A. serlii in terms of overall pinnule shape and attachment to the rachis, I wouldn't be able to rule out alternatives based on what I can see in the photo... Honestly, though, I generally have quite a bit of trouble with identifying Alethopteris specimens to the species level. They tend to display a lot of variability within "species" (e.g., pinnule shape and dimensions change markedly with position on the frond - Laveine, 1986) and -even worse- are notorious for forming morphological continua between "species". Schiehing and Pfefferkorn (1980), for example, recognized a large group of intergrading forms encompassing different species like A. densinervosa, A. ingertensis, A. lonchitifolia, A. missouriensis and A. westphalens (see also Wagner and Alvarez-Vasquez, 2008; Raymond et al., 2020). Schiehing and Pfefferkorn (1980) originally included A. serlii in this grouping as well, but Zodrow and Cleal Zodrow (1998, p. 73) point out this species can be separated by its "characteristic and distinctive flexuous venation" (features not visible on the photo here, though). While there seems to be disagreement among researchers on the boundaries of such "species complexes", their existence definitely blurred (my grasp of) delineations between the classical species. Moreover, Wagner (1968) already showed that the widespread reporting of A. serlii was partly due to frequent misidentification. These issues generally dissuade me from identifying Alethopteris to species level, unless the specimen displays features characteristic for one particular species. Is there something I missed, which makes the photographed specimen an unmistakable A. serlii? Or do you make use of locality-specific information to arrive at your IDs?

Edited October 28, 2021 by paleoflor