Bone Valley Find

[Nimravis]

I’m currently at a pay site, collecting Bone Valley fossils. An individual next to me found this bone fragment, can someone identify what it is? It looks familiar, but what it is is not coming to mind right now.

 

@Shellseeker

 

 

Edited May 14, 2022 by Nimravis

[HuckMucus]

Tip of an antler.  If it's FL, then it's a White Tail or sub thereof.  Probably broke off in a fight?

Edited May 14, 2022 by HuckMucus

[Nimravis]

40 minutes ago, HuckMucus said:

Tip of an antler.  If it's FL, then it's a White Tail or sub thereof.  Probably broke off in a fight?

I am not getting a deer feel on this, I was thinking something fishy, plus this material was just dug out of the ground today, it is not recent.

[HuckMucus]

9 minutes ago, Nimravis said:

I am not getting a deer feel on this, I was thinking something fishy, plus this material was just dug out of the ground today, it is not recent.

The photos could be decieving me but that is not only an antler tip, but it is what we call "a brown."  Meaning it is new.  I stand to be corrected if others know more or better.

Edited May 14, 2022 by HuckMucus

[JohnJ]

17 minutes ago, Nimravis said:

I am not getting a deer feel on this, I was thinking something fishy, plus this material was just dug out of the ground today, it is not recent.

More photos might help, Ralph.  Try to get a good image of the broken area.

 

[Nimravis]

12 minutes ago, HuckMucus said:

The photos could be decieving me but that is not only an antler tip, but it is what we call "a brown."  Meaning it is new.  I stand to be corrected if others know more or better.

Thanks for the info on that, I will pass it on, here are more pics.

 

[Nimravis]

4 minutes ago, JohnJ said:

More photos might help, Ralph.  Try to get a good image of the broken area.

 

Just posted some.

[Randyw]

I'm getting a fish tooth feel off of it myself. But not sure what kind. I almost said enchodus but it doesn't look quite right for that either... And the size is off for that...

Edited May 14, 2022 by Randyw

[Shellseeker]

It is a Rostral tooth from a Sawfish.  Numerous finds from the river bottom of the Peace River. @Nimravis

 

 

Edited May 14, 2022 by Shellseeker

[HuckMucus]

29 minutes ago, Shellseeker said:

It is a Rostral tooth from a Sawfish.  Numerous finds from the river bottom of the Peace River. @Nimravis

 

Good call.  I've got tons of antler tips that I make pegs out of and they look just like that, except the distinction between the outer and inner layers of the antler tips are not as distinct as those Rostal teeth.  I was fooled again and stand corrected.

Edited May 14, 2022 by HuckMucus
clarity

[Shellseeker]

14 minutes ago, HuckMucus said:

Good call.  I've got tons of antler tips that I make pegs out of and they look just like that, except the distinction between the outer and inner layers of the antler tips are not as distinct as those Rostal teeth.  I was fooled again and stand corrected.

It is hardly ever easy.  In this case I see more Rostral teeth than deer tines, so it becomes a more natural identification for me. Many people think of Rostral teeth as curved fish hooks, but I never see/find that type..

[MarcoSr]

37 minutes ago, Shellseeker said:

It is a Rostral tooth from a Sawfish.  Numerous finds from the river bottom of the Peace River. @Nimravis

 

 

 

Sorry, but the specimen posted above is definitely not a sawfish rostral tooth.  Pristis rostral teeth have a groove on one side.  Both Pristis and Anoxypristis rostral teeth are not hollow like that specimen appears in the below picture.  Also, the cross-section is wrong for a sawfish rostral tooth.  Lastly, the texture is wrong for a sawfish rostral tooth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Marco Sr.

 

[Shellseeker]

40 minutes ago, MarcoSr said:

Sorry, but the specimen posted above is definitely not a sawfish rostral tooth.  Pristis rostral teeth have a groove on one side.  Both Pristis and Anoxypristis rostral teeth are not hollow like that specimen appears in the below picture.  Also, the cross-section is wrong for a sawfish rostral tooth.  Lastly, the texture is wrong for a sawfish rostral tooth.

Thank you..

Like my compatriot @HuckMucus above

1 hour ago, HuckMucus said:

I was fooled again and stand corrected.

I kinda imagined the groove on one side...

[Meganeura]

My wife is the individual who found this, it’s definitely a fossil, not at all recent, and I’d be happy to share more pictures if needed!

[HuckMucus]

2 hours ago, MarcoSr said:

 

Sorry, but the specimen posted above is definitely not a sawfish rostral tooth.  Pristis rostral teeth have a groove on one side.  Both Pristis and Anoxypristis rostral teeth are not hollow like that specimen appears in the below picture.  Also, the cross-section is wrong for a sawfish rostral tooth.  Lastly, the texture is wrong for a sawfish rostral tooth.

Marco Sr.

 

I can't find a pic of a cross section of a Rostral tooth but from the link above, they do hint at flatter and less round than the subject.  If it's not Rostral, I'll dive back in the fray and reassert my initial assessment of deer antler tip.  If the man's wife found it and he says it's fossilized, I guess I'd ask for a burn test.  I doubt additional photos would help me, but I'm no expert.  It's a spitting image of an antler tip.  

[Meganeura]

1 hour ago, HuckMucus said:

I can't find a pic of a cross section of a Rostral tooth but from the link above, they do hint at flatter and less round than the subject.  If it's not Rostral, I'll dive back in the fray and reassert my initial assessment of deer antler tip.  If the man's wife found it and he says it's fossilized, I guess I'd ask for a burn test.  I doubt additional photos would help me, but I'm no expert.  It's a spitting image of an antler tip.  

Burn test resulted in no burn, so definitely fossilized.

[HuckMucus]

3 minutes ago, Meganeura said:

Burn test resulted in no burn, so definitely fossilized.

The last picture of the broken end had lots of little distracting pieces of sand on the break face and your (?) hand.  Could you wash it clean and dry and take a good close up perpendicular shot to the break?  I'm curious about the interior.  Thanks for doing the burn test.  I know when I use a Dremel tool on mine, they stink.  The only other suggestion I have is to take it to a biologist or paleontologist.  Maybe a local museum?  Good luck.

[Meganeura]

3 minutes ago, HuckMucus said:

The last picture of the broken end had lots of little distracting pieces of sand on the break face and your (?) hand.  Could you wash it clean and dry and take a good close up perpendicular shot to the break?  I'm curious about the interior.  Thanks for doing the burn test.  I know when I use a Dremel tool on mine, they stink.  The only other suggestion I have is to take it to a biologist or paleontologist.  Maybe a local museum?  Good luck.

Wasn’t entirely sure what you meant by perpendicular to the break in this case - but hopefully these pics suffice!

[HuckMucus]

4 minutes ago, Meganeura said:

Wasn’t entirely sure what you meant by perpendicular to the break in this case - but hopefully these pics suffice.

The last photo is what I was looking for.  But it blurs out when I enlarge it.  Could be on my end.  Anyway, thanks.  I'd take it to a pro.

[Meganeura]

13 minutes ago, HuckMucus said:

The last photo is what I was looking for.  But it blurs out when I enlarge it.  Could be on my end.  Anyway, thanks.  I'd take it to a pro.

I appreciate it regardless! Guess we’ll have to get it checked then!

[Harry Pristis]

I am puzzled by this piece.  I am accustomed to white tail deer antler tines being cone shaped.  There are horned ruminants in the miocene phosphates, but I am not familiar enough with them to make a guess.

[HuckMucus]

1 hour ago, Harry Pristis said:

I am puzzled by this piece.  I am accustomed to white tail deer antler tines being cone shaped.  There are horned ruminants in the miocene phosphates, but I am not familiar enough with them to make a guess.

I don't know about White Tail because I'm from the Rocky Mountains, but Mule Deer antler tips run the gamut from conical to flat to triangular, straight, curved, sharp, blunt and what have you.  Brow tines are even wilder.  If they are on the surface, they turn pretty white in a year, especially in the sun.  They also rot faster than bone underground.  The squeekies also chew them up if they are in the area.  The instant object looks like this spring's shed.  But again, I stand to be corrected.  If it's a fossil, then it would not be that color, I don't think.  Grey on the inside and, well, antler on the outside. 

[Lone Hunter]

I'm in agreement with the colors as far as fossil or recent surface find.  These are from Texas but I would think its the same. Top fossil bottom recent.  I just have to know what are squeekies?

[HuckMucus]

2 minutes ago, Lone Hunter said:

I'm in agreement with the colors as far as fossil or recent surface find.  These are from Texas but I would think its the same. Top fossil bottom recent.  I just have to know what are squeekies?

That fossil is what a recent (in the brown) antler looks like.  The other is what we call "white" (old).  Squeekies are rodents that eat antlers (quill pigs, squirrels, chipmunks, etc.).  I'll take some pics tomorrow and try to replicate the subject above.  Probably won't be able to tell the difference.

[Harry Pristis]

Color is the weakest basis for saying much about a bone.  The color of the find fits the range of colors of things from the Central Florida phosphate.