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Scribe Comparison


Ptychodus04

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Ok preppers, specifically @Malcolmt @Ludwigia @jpc @RJB but generally to any professional or semiprofessional prepper lurking around these parts.

 

Is there a scribe on the market comparable to the HW322, possibly one of the Paleo Tools Micro Jacks? There’s roughly a year long waitlist for the 322, and I don’t think I can wait a year for a new scribe.

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2 hours ago, Ptychodus04 said:

Is there a scribe on the market comparable to the HW322, possibly one of the Paleo Tools Micro Jacks?

Hey Kris, I've never used the HW322 so I cant help you.  As for waits, I bought one of those T-Rex from Europe and had to wait several months.

 

RB

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2 hours ago, RJB said:

Hey Kris, I've never used the HW322 so I cant help you.  As for waits, I bought one of those T-Rex from Europe and had to wait several months.

 

RB


I’m not good at waiting. :default_rofl: I had a 6 month wait for my HW70.

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1 hour ago, Ptychodus04 said:


I’m not good at waiting. :default_rofl: I had a 6 month wait for my HW70.

About six months for a pile of pricey tips and specialty-sized O-rings for my Pferd as it has been discontinued, and so have been raiding warehouse supplies. Even when the tips shatter due to some butterfingers evil twin who uses my equipment, I sharpen them. :D 

...How to Philosophize with a Hammer

 

 

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15 minutes ago, Kane said:

About six months for a pile of pricey tips and specialty-sized O-rings for my Pferd as it has been discontinued, and so have been raiding warehouse supplies. Even when the tips shatter due to some butterfingers evil twin who uses my equipment, I sharpen them. :D 


I think we have the same twin! 

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Just now, Ptychodus04 said:


I think we have the same twin! 

:heartylaugh:

 

I think it may be the same twin who forgets to unhook the connectors to the compressor, forgets to turn off the compressor, and the very slow air leak means it comes on full blast at 3 am when everyone is sleeping. :D 

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...How to Philosophize with a Hammer

 

 

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10 hours ago, Kane said:

:heartylaugh:

 

I think it may be the same twin who forgets to unhook the connectors to the compressor, forgets to turn off the compressor, and the very slow air leak means it comes on full blast at 3 am when everyone is sleeping. :D 


That guy is a jerk. I finally broke him from leaving the main valve on the compressed air line on after my wife yelled at me enough times for the compressor turning on at all hours.

 

 I’m actually planning to expand my lab in order to relocate the compressor to the new addition. It will be heavily insulated and a completely separate room from the main lab, so I don’t have to deal with the heat and noise in the work area. I’m also looking at a 240v model that is quieter than my el cheapo harbor freight model.

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I'm jealous! Not enough space here to have more than a corner of the basement. I wish I could bury the compressor underground, but that would likely involve excavating in my own house, which I hear is not recommended. :D 

...How to Philosophize with a Hammer

 

 

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4 hours ago, Kane said:

I'm jealous! Not enough space here to have more than a corner of the basement. I wish I could bury the compressor underground, but that would likely involve excavating in my own house, which I hear is not recommended. :D 

 

Nah, it'll be fine.  A compressor is only a small hole, it shouldnt affect the house.... much.  

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"There is no shortage of fossils. There is only a shortage of paleontologists to study them." - Larry Martin

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15 hours ago, Kane said:

I'm jealous! Not enough space here to have more than a corner of the basement. I wish I could bury the compressor underground, but that would likely involve excavating in my own house, which I hear is not recommended. :D 

 

The offer still stands for you to move to Texas. Imagine all the trouble we could get into. :P

 

Well, the compressor I want is $1,800 and weighs 450 pounds. I wonder if I could get it delivered and installed in the annex (after it is built) before my wife makes me move into the lab permanently?

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For prepping Oligocene White River, I use Microjacks.  Not sure what size range your application is.  I haven't used all of them but here is what I have found

 

MJ-6.  imagine a light ARO/8315 that is very precise.  I can prep oreodonts to rabbits/ischyromys with this.

MJ-3  I prep the larger of the rodent skulls with this, think Eumys size/insectivores.  skull size of thumb nail to 1 inch

MJ-2  For prepping rodent bones and things Heliscomys size/snakes/amphisbaenids.  skull size of pinky nail.  It is so fine the rock chips turn to dust and pile up on the end of the needle.

 

The 4/5 would be appropriate for rabbit size things as well.  I don't think you need to own one of each.

 

 

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4 hours ago, ParkerPaleo said:

For prepping Oligocene White River, I use Microjacks.  Not sure what size range your application is.  I haven't used all of them but here is what I have found

 

MJ-6.  imagine a light ARO/8315 that is very precise.  I can prep oreodonts to rabbits/ischyromys with this.

MJ-3  I prep the larger of the rodent skulls with this, think Eumys size/insectivores.  skull size of thumb nail to 1 inch

MJ-2  For prepping rodent bones and things Heliscomys size/snakes/amphisbaenids.  skull size of pinky nail.  It is so fine the rock chips turn to dust and pile up on the end of the needle.

 

The 4/5 would be appropriate for rabbit size things as well.  I don't think you need to own one of each.

 

 

These are excellent guidelines, although my choices are a bit different.  

I use a chicago to get rid of a lot of matrix far away enough form the bones, an Aro for close to large bones, and MJ 5 to 3 for the details, as well as an air abrader.  I aso have an extended delicate tip for the Aro that I got from Stone Company; it is German but I can't recall its actual German name

 

But back to the original question... I am not familiar with the tool in question.  

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11 hours ago, jpc said:

These are excellent guidelines, although my choices are a bit different.  

I use a chicago to get rid of a lot of matrix far away enough form the bones, an Aro for close to large bones, and MJ 5 to 3 for the details, as well as an air abrader.  I aso have an extended delicate tip for the Aro that I got from Stone Company; it is German but I can't recall its actual German name

 

But back to the original question... I am not familiar with the tool in question.  

I use ARO/CP for removing bulk too.  If I had a MJ4 or MJ5 I'd use them in the process as well.  In general, the smaller the specimen/more delicate the bone, the lower I go on the number scale.  If anyone wants to send me a few extra microjacks, I'd be happy to update with results, hehe.

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Hi mate. I’m not sure about other stuff, but the trex from zoic was a game changer for me. It’s a beast, and if it can get through Whitby pyrite with ease, it can get through anything. They ALSO, have something else coming out in the not too distant future that is completely on another level called the bronto. It’s pre orders as everything is hand made down to the details. I’d suggest giving Kate and mihai who run it an email and they can even provide any alterations to suit your needs. 

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All, thanks for the comments. I currently use multiple scribes for different applications. Super Jack for massive removal, ME9100 for general removal, Aro with the PaleoAro conversion for more detail, HW70 for all around detail work, and a Micro Jack 4 for finer work.

 

My only complaint about the Micro Jacks is that they tend to cut matrix rather than pop it off. That relegated them to the finest of work combined with abrasives. The bird I’m about to dig into is covered in soft tissue, so abrasives are out for the most part.

 

I got a recommendation to check out the Zoic Velociraptor and or the Microraptor. I’ll shoot them an email as @DanJeavs suggested as I would need diffuse exhaust rather than frontal exhaust for most applications. Since they are push plate driven scribes, they need more pressure to operate than the piston driven Harvey Winkler scribes. I did get on the waitlist for the HW322, so I may wind up with 3 new scribes from this exercise! Thankfully, my wife is patient with the immense startup costs from switching to professional preparation from hobby prep. :yay-smiley-1:
 

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 6/12/2022 at 2:11 PM, Ptychodus04 said:

All, thanks for the comments. I currently use multiple scribes for different applications. Super Jack for massive removal, ME9100 for general removal, Aro with the PaleoAro conversion for more detail, HW70 for all around detail work, and a Micro Jack 4 for finer work.

 

My only complaint about the Micro Jacks is that they tend to cut matrix rather than pop it off. That relegated them to the finest of work combined with abrasives. The bird I’m about to dig into is covered in soft tissue, so abrasives are out for the most part.

 

I got a recommendation to check out the Zoic Velociraptor and or the Microraptor. I’ll shoot them an email as @DanJeavs suggested as I would need diffuse exhaust rather than frontal exhaust for most applications. Since they are push plate driven scribes, they need more pressure to operate than the piston driven Harvey Winkler scribes. I did get on the waitlist for the HW322, so I may wind up with 3 new scribes from this exercise! Thankfully, my wife is patient with the immense startup costs from switching to professional preparation from hobby prep. :yay-smiley-1:
 

 

 

 

I'm just going to randomly jump in here and say, Kris, I think I follow you on Instagram! I've been admiring your prep for years. Always nice to make connections on other platforms. 

 

I'm also a professional micro-preparator (I used to work for a museum but decided to try doing this thing independently). Still exploring all the tools out there because boy are those startup costs quite steep! Microscope, compressor and scribes all started to add up VERY quickly. I primarily use ME-9100 for most matrix removal (as I see most people do) and because I live at the bottom of the planet getting things shipped here is not always cost-efficient so my partner, who is great with his hands, decided bugger it let's make our own! So we have our own micro airscribe that is on par with the MJ range. I've honestly never tried an Aro and been fine for the last 6 years without one. Is it worth the investment?  

Tiffany

Uncovering the late Permian one fossil at a time 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, GorgonGal said:

 

I'm just going to randomly jump in here and say, Kris, I think I follow you on Instagram! I've been admiring your prep for years. Always nice to make connections on other platforms. 

 

I'm also a professional micro-preparator (I used to work for a museum but decided to try doing this thing independently). Still exploring all the tools out there because boy are those startup costs quite steep! Microscope, compressor and scribes all started to add up VERY quickly. I primarily use ME-9100 for most matrix removal (as I see most people do) and because I live at the bottom of the planet getting things shipped here is not always cost-efficient so my partner, who is great with his hands, decided bugger it let's make our own! So we have our own micro airscribe that is on par with the MJ range. I've honestly never tried an Aro and been fine for the last 6 years without one. Is it worth the investment?  

 

Awesome. Shoot me a DM on Instagram and I'll follow you back. I try to follow as many preparators as possible. I may already follow you, but would like to be sure. I'm a bit of a troglodyte, so keeping track of social media connections is a bit of a chore. :P It's always cool to hear about people with an entrepreneurial spirit. I really enjoy prepping, so doing it professionally was a logical step. It's unfortunate that the salary for preparators at museums is so low. I think more people would do it if they could actually live off the pay.

 

The startup costs are definitely steep in this industry. I started adding it all up once and decided it was in my best interest to not keep track. Thankfully, most were spread out over several years, but I have spent too much money already this year upgrading equipment. I should be receiving my 2 modified scribes from ZOIC today. Talk about turn around. I only ordered them a week ago and they did the mods requested and shipped them overnight from the UK to Texas when they were finished. I'll post a review of them in a separate thread once I've run them a bit.

 

That's awesome that you guys developed your own scribe. Kudos for the innovation and working around a problem. Shipping to Oz is definitely expensive. I made a knife for a fellow TFF member who used to live there and the shipping was outrageous! Is it a pressure plate style like the Micro Jacks?

 

The ME9100 is a great scribe for bulk work, it's my goto for moderate matrix removal. If I have massive amounts to remove, I fire up the Super Jack. Aro style scribes are great for matrix removal that is somewhere between the MJ and ME9100 range. It's a great compromise between power and precision. I use mine when I have less than 1/2" of matrix to remove from a specimen. I use it less these days since I got my HW70. It has a slightly broader range of capabilities and is far more precise. It also operates at much lower pressures than the Aro. Unfortunately, it is around 5X of the cost.

 

I like to have options of tools, so I tend towards having more scribes. Different specimens and matrices ask for different approaches. If you're happy without one and typically prep similar material, I would say, don't spend the money. If you decide to get one, the Paleo Aro from Paleo Tools is a good scribe. ZOIC also make an Aro style scribe. Another option is a Aro clone from anyone and mod it. The stock stylus for the Aro is too short for any real work. You can mod any pressure plate style scribe to accept the Paleo Aro stylus, you simply change out the bushing on the front end with the Paleo Tools bushing.

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On 6/24/2022 at 3:48 PM, Ptychodus04 said:

I should be receiving my 2 modified scribes from ZOIC today. Talk about turn around. I only ordered them a week ago and they did the mods requested and shipped them overnight from the UK to Texas when they were finished. I'll post a review of them in a separate thread once I've run them a bit.

 

A review would be awesome! I'm always keen to try new toys and reviews are super helpful. And that's an amazing turnaround time! I'm hoping to order from PaleoTools this week for a client and hopefully now that Covid has subsided international deliveries will be a bit quicker. 

 

On 6/24/2022 at 3:48 PM, Ptychodus04 said:

That's awesome that you guys developed your own scribe. Kudos for the innovation and working around a problem. Shipping to Oz is definitely expensive. I made a knife for a fellow TFF member who used to live there and the shipping was outrageous! Is it a pressure plate style like the Micro Jacks?

 

It is a pressure plate style. Initially the micro-scribe was meant for just me, but then we decided we could potentially supply it to museums and institutions nationally (and I suppose internationally too!). This was a fun little project that we were actually gearing towards launching locally in September 2020 at a Palaeontology Conference here in South Africa aaaaand then Covid. But on the plus side, it's given us time to do some fine tuning and thorough testing! And best part is I get to play with it on my micro fossils :Jumping: And this is the sort of detail I can get out of it so I'm super happy! If I could just prep teeth all day I would be in heaven :egypt: 

AM-JKLXYzcAGQItMo2YpU3l88LeCgU7qLQ0S2qqB5KRALhJ286mP3OhQp6bwifGejWhbJlM4Qr_wTWgUEYulwW9qhU1fefyyYF_CdTh1EDuXA5iWhZdCsxmXH4l_Z1-7qOSc-QhnLswkEiFNmReuyACB-URWvg=w527-h702-no?authuser=0

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Tiffany

Uncovering the late Permian one fossil at a time 

 

 

 

 

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Hi @Ptychodus04. I’ve just been given the FBQ pneumatic pen as made by Ken Mannion as a birthday present. It’s a monster pen and removes matrix without breaking a sweat. It even eats into pyrite without even thinking about it. Here’s a picture:

 

05A387FF-6865-449A-890B-680AAD0E6409.thumb.jpeg.92b4bafe282c78f59e6c7848b06e5051.jpeg
 

it runs at about 60 psi and I’m so impressed with the performance.

 

Nick

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14 hours ago, Welsh Wizard said:

I’ve just been given the FBQ pneumatic pen as made by Ken Mannion as a birthday present.


That’s quite a good birthday present. I haven’t had time to run my new Zoic scribes much at all. I’m in the middle of a construction project (expanding my prep lab) that has eaten all my time but hope to have some time this week to get back to prepping.

 

My new and improved lab will give me some room to move around since I’ll have a room for specimen storage and a separate work area now.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Well, after being told there was no idea when a shipment of HW322 scribes would arrive and doubt that the Stone Company would receive enough scribes to fulfill the wait list before I got on it, I ran out and purchased the 2 ZOIC scribes I mentioned in another thread.

 

Much to my surprise, I got an email from Flo that they had an HW322 for me. There’s just some things you can’t pass up as a prepper, this is one of them. So, I’m now the proud papa of a killer detail scribe.

 

9ADF1A8B-ECA1-4CA7-A1F4-744BD29B130B.thumb.jpeg.79498e77c3d1a6f09ab177092e847f31.jpeg

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On 7/27/2022 at 9:47 PM, Ptychodus04 said:

..... So, I’m now the proud papa of a killer detail scribe.

 

 

 

Dang, 5 PSI?!  crazy.  

I'll keep dreaming about owning one of these for a few more years.

"There is no shortage of fossils. There is only a shortage of paleontologists to study them." - Larry Martin

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25 minutes ago, hadrosauridae said:

 

Dang, 5 PSI?!  crazy.  

I'll keep dreaming about owning one of these for a few more years.


Yep, I haven’t fired it up yet but I used one up in Wyoming earlier this year. It was impressive.

 

Start saving now while you dream. The price tag is painful. I have to say, my wife has become numb to prep tool purchases I think. I told her about this one and she said “that’s great”. :default_rofl:

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