Anders Jonasson Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Found this bone of what I think is a jaw from a fish. Åsen locality Scania Sweden. Upper lower Campanian. Nearshore/deltaic enviroment. Greensand. Bone is 6 cm long and has a row of small "sockets" for teeth? Fish teeth found on the location is Enchodus, Protosphyraena, Pachyrhizodus... other finds include Tylosaurus, Clidastes, sharks, rays, turtles and chimaerids. Happy for any help on ID. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anders Jonasson Posted June 24, 2022 Author Share Posted June 24, 2022 No one? I know its a tricky piece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anders Jonasson Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 @pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon @Troodon I see that You are frequent knowledgeable responders. Any ideas on this tricky piece or do You know whom to tag on the matter? We rarely find bigger pieces of bones here i Sweden so we have to do with working with finds like this. By Swedish standards this is a good find.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troodon Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 It does look like fish but cannot say much more really not into marine specimens Here is paper from that locality to identify what has been found but supports your comments.. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/287799005_Late_Cretaceous_Campanian_actinopterygian_fishes_from_the_Kristianstad_Basin_of_southern_Sweden 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anders Jonasson Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 10 minutes ago, Troodon said: It does look like fish but cannot say much more really not into marine specimens Here is paper from that locality to identify what has been found. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/287799005_Late_Cretaceous_Campanian_actinopterygian_fishes_from_the_Kristianstad_Basin_of_southern_Sweden Thanks. I have read the article. My find is from that location. Most finds are tooth crowns. I have never read about bigger part of the jaws beiing found. So I´m still trembling and since the species are found world wide I posted here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 Maybe Jan Rees has an idea? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) No pycnodontids found,as yet? I am assuming,as a matter of course,you have read the Bazzi thesis? Edited June 25, 2022 by doushantuo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anders Jonasson Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 24 minutes ago, doushantuo said: No pycnodontids found,as yet? I am assuming,as a matter of course,you have read the Bazzi thesis? We have found single pycnodont teeth. But does pycnodonts have these kind of roots for the teeth? And don´t they have several rows of teeth in the jaw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) Yah ,they do. Superdumb question: Have you thought of the possibility of juvenile ichthyodectiform? Would you mind if i sent you an email regarding a certain Swedish ichthyologist(which is tantamount to a "literature request"?) I t might be slightly outside your area of expertise,but... Edited June 25, 2022 by doushantuo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Dente Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 This reminds me of sturgeon pectoral fin spines. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anders Jonasson Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 43 minutes ago, doushantuo said: Yah ,they do. Superdumb question: Have you thought of the possibility of juvenile ichthyodectiform? Would you mind if i sent you an email regarding a certain Swedish ichthyologist(which is tantamount to a "literature request"?) I t might be slightly outside your area of expertise,but... I am just a beginner in this field and fishes is absolutely not my strong subject. You can send me a message. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Dente Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 Here are a couple Acipenser fin spines from my collection. These are either Miocene or Pliocene from the Lee Creek Mine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anders Jonasson Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 26 minutes ago, Al Dente said: This reminds me of sturgeon pectoral fin spines. There is absolutely a resemblance. I have found bits of chimaeroid dorsal spines there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) The Campanian is post-Atlantic breakup. An Acipenser find would be,to say the least,pretty amazing,biogeographically AND stratigraphically speaking edit: for the record: The acipenseroid Chondrosteus is known from the jurassic of the UK. It has one fulcral spine preserved B Edited June 25, 2022 by doushantuo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anders Jonasson Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 We have found some sturgeon dermal plates from the Campanian here i Scania Sweden but I´m not sure about genera/species. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 (edited) I have to come back to an earlier remark: i have looked at some Acipenser literature and i suddenly realized I had envisaged only single migration route ,which would not NECESSARILY have been the case.I know there might have been a transform margin between Cretaceous Sweden and Cretacous polar Russia,but its paleogeography might be poorly constrained. B Edited June 25, 2022 by doushantuo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anders Jonasson Posted June 25, 2022 Author Share Posted June 25, 2022 20 minutes ago, doushantuo said: I have to come back to an earlier remark: i have looked at some Acipenser literature and i suddenly realized I had envisaged only single migration route ,which would not NECESSARILY have been the case.I know there might have been a transform margin between Cretaceous Sweden and Cretacous polar Russia,but its paleogeography might be poorly constrained. B The idea of a Asia - Europe- America migration route for Ceratopsians have been discussed by J Lindgren etc "THE FIRST NEOCERATOPSIAN DINOSAUR REMAINS FROM EUROPE" after the first find of Leptoceratops teeth here i Sweden. Perhaps that also aply on the migration of fishes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted June 25, 2022 Share Posted June 25, 2022 Anders: i find it not inconceivable that,edaphically* speaking, the paleo-swedish Campanian exhibited a variety of environments on a not too large scale * "landscape-wise" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon Posted June 26, 2022 Share Posted June 26, 2022 Sorry for arriving late to the party, but have been occupied with a move the entire day. Anyway, I also don't really have much to add here: the bone looks rather flaky and looks to me to be fish-bone rather than reptile. What kind of fish, though, I can't say, as I've got little experience with fishes (most of what I do have, moreover, is targetted at differentiating them from marine reptiles). 1 'There's nothing like millions of years of really frustrating trial and error to give a species moral fibre and, in some cases, backbone' -- Terry Pratchett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anders Jonasson Posted June 26, 2022 Author Share Posted June 26, 2022 54 minutes ago, pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon said: Sorry for arriving late to the party, but have been occupied with a move the entire day. Anyway, I also don't really have much to add here: the bone looks rather flaky and looks to me to be fish-bone rather than reptile. What kind of fish, though, I can't say, as I've got little experience with fishes (most of what I do have, moreover, is targetted at differentiating them from marine reptiles). Thanks. All help appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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