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A weekend of rarity


Jared C

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This last weekend produced probably the best results I've ever experienced while fossil hunting - these last two days will be hard to beat.

 

Before I get to that though, I do want to include a find from the weekend before (since this is the topic of rarity). It was a local find and a first for the species for me. Not only that, but my first real "heartbreaker". It was bound to happen at some point!

 

Sticking halfway out of the gravel, I instantly recognized a large Ptychodus tooth, of either P. marginalis or P. polygyrus - I couldn't remember at the time which of the two was the younger, but regardless both are rare and would be a first for me. (spoiler - it's P. polygyrus)(EDIT: I forgot you don't find polygyrus in Texas - this is probably a P. martini then (also rare, woohoo!). With great anticipation I pulled it out - only to realize that it wasn't half buried - just broken in half!

IMG-2440.thumb.jpg.b86fd67f8bc81332751bb00432ab1827.jpg

 

Despite the realization, I was still ecstatic, heightened by the fact that this was on a scout to a new spot as well.

 

But, that't not what y'all are here for, so without further adieu, let's fast forward to my time last weekend. 

 

 

I at first met up with Kris ( @Ptychodus04 ) up in north texas to take a look at a woodbine site where he discovered the holotype of Flexomornis. That's right, our own forum member discovered north america's oldest definitive bird! It was an estuary-esque deposit, and I was curious about what potential the site had for dinosaur fauna ( a newly inspired interest ever since my time romping around in the hell creek formation). We found some powdery bits and pieces of chunkasaur, as well as some tiny amounts of croc, fish, and bird materiel, so the excursion was quite informative for me. Kris brought his old friend and hunting partner Joe, and the three of us were chatting it up the whole time - it was a morning well spent.

 

Before the day became too hot, we turned back and Kris offered to take me to a cenomanian Eagle Ford site in the area. I have a very hard time running into the lower Eagle Ford, so I was happy to accept, and we hit the creek with the sun high above. Now, you won't catch him tooting his own horn, so I'll do it for him - Kris is an insanely skilled collector. He and Joe have made some bonkers discoveries that I had no clue about - new things, completely articulated things... his 40 years of collecting experience has a track record that shines.

 

In our first ten minutes into the creek, something coming out of the weathered bank caught my eye:

IMG-2356.thumb.jpg.cb5e933de791c2fd6130681cc695fd90.jpg

 

10 minutes prior, as we were walking in, I joked to Kris about finding a fully articulated Coniasaurus here. Coniasaurs have been bouncing in my head for a couple months now, ever since having an energizing discussion about them with Mike at SMU (the first time I found out they even exist). They and Pseudomegachasma were why I was so bent on finding cenomanian Eagle Ford, and this being my first time In cenomanian eagle ford strata, I had my fingers crossed.... and it seemed to work! I didn't want to be the boy who cried coniasaur... but I was fairly positive that that's what I was seeing. 

 

Kris was right behind me and seemed to agree - so, I drove a pick in below the vert to pry it out... and out came another vert locked into attachment with it, freshly broken in half. Silence. I looked at Kris, Kris looked at the vert, and we both went "oh!"

 

From this alone, I was starting to get very excited, though I had to remind my self that odds were low that it would be all I was imagining. Kris (thank god he was there and could take over the digging, literally the best person for the job) began exploring deeper, and the vertebrae continued. Joe continued a little further up as we dug.

 

Soon, we had a line of them exposed. Keep in mind, this is without 1.5 verts that broke off with the initial discovery:

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If you look to the left of the closest to the screen vert, you can see a tiny rib piece (which I originally assumed to be a process)

 

The verts continued still, and then my phone overheated, so the pictures had to stop. Here's one that Joe nabbed of the scene:

IMG-7252.thumb.jpg.79029325c6d0cb57e2ab44d1eee18cb6.jpg

 

Paraloid was slapped on and Kris removed the first major block. A spot of bone on the other end looked to be on the side, so we moved in further and revealed another block where the bone seemed to finally stop. 

 

Covered in sweat we then continued our hunt. While looking at a pyrite inclusion, I practically stepped on a Xiphactinus tooth. Kris spotted it as I walked away, I was shocked I missed it! This sort of find is almost casual for these two (yeah, they're good), so he offered I keep it. I was happy to accept - it's the best Xiphactinus tooth I've personally seen. IMG-2441.thumb.jpg.9e7b571b0efe7fb0aafbe8776cc66646.jpg

 

Our walk was mostly uneventful from there, right until we got to our turn around point. Kris and I realized at some point that we left Joe where we had turned around, and I went back to check on him. He was under a large overhang, where he had pulled out few plates of shale containing bone. Since both of them have found many large fish on this creek, they didn't bat an eye, but I was amazed! It seemed there were some skull elements of a large fish on them.

 

"Are there more? " I asked

"a little", said Joe, and he showed me where he spotted them. After a few seconds of moving materiel, we revealed another large piece of bone, and I about died. However, not too keen to excavate, considering it's fairly insignificant materiel for them (and the heat was oppressive at this point), we left for Kris's place. I told them I planned to get right back as soon as I got in my car, and they wished me luck and told me to send updates.

 

Back at the site, I revealed the bone quickly, and in doing so, more bone that was previously buried revealed itself 10 inches to the left. I began on that, and soon realized I was working on a HUGE vert. "Xiphactinus it is then", I said, as nothing else from this portion of the cenomanian (except perhaps plesiosaurs) could produce something this big. 

 

As I continued work though, I started losing faith in my ID. The bone itself was nothing like fish. The day was drawing to a close, and I drove back home with a renewed interest in the mystery vert. I arrived home late.

 

Then, early the next morning, I woke to do it all again, but first on the list was to drop off the coniasaur at SMU. I mentally prepared myself to spend another $90 on gas and then set out loaded with energy. I stayed at SMU for several hours - it's always a pleasure to spend time there so I didn't mind getting out to the dig site later than expected. 

 

It didn't take long for me to finally remove the vert... and revealed behind it was another...yes!!

 

Happy to finally be out from under that overhang, I looked hard at what was in my hands. Both sides were revealed now, and I caught my breath. This was certainly reptile.

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I showed some photos to Mike at SMU, wondering about Plesiosaur, and he decided that while it would need some prep first, he doesn't think so. 

This leaves Archosaur origin, if I dare suggest.

 

Some more field photos are below:

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(During the dig)

 

Once removed:

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Unbelievable two days, to say the least. I'll have to return this weekend, and I'll update this thread as necessary. The site though is in the worst possible place it could be - at the back of an overhang held together by only the roots of a cedar, whose exposed roots hang like a curtain behind you as you work. It's going to take some work to make that safe, and more work to dive in from there, but I'm rearing to go. What a weekend - if I wasn't typing this at midnight I'd probably write much more, but that's the jist of it for now. Stay tuned!

 

Edited by Jared C
ID correction on the ptychodus
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“Not only is the universe stranger than we think, it is stranger than we can think” -Werner Heisenberg 

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I still have a giant smile on my face.  :D Stay hydrated and work safely.  :popcorn:

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The human mind has the ability to believe anything is true.  -  JJ

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Wow! I could feel your excitement and enthusiasm the whole time I read this. My heart is racing and I’m 800 miles away. 
 

Congrats on making memories with friends, and the EPIC finds! 
 

P.S. Stay safe in the heat and under that overhang! 

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The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.  -Neil deGrasse Tyson

 

Everyone you will ever meet knows something you don't. -Bill Nye (The Science Guy)

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Wow these are some incredible finds! Your trip reports are always a pleasure to read, Jared!

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Fossils? I dig it. :meg:

 

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@Jared C I showed the pics of your vert to Ron Tykoski at the Perot and he mentioned that there’s a very large croc (20+ feet) known from the Cenomanian (late Woodbine to Early Britton Formations) called Terminoaris. He said that the vert you collected could fit that ID. He also said that it looks like a caudal vert but he would need to see it prepped to confirm. If that winds up being the case and there’s another vert behind the one you see in the wall, you could potentially have a lot of croc awaiting excavation.

 

You have quite a knack for finding fossils my friend! For someone with only 18 months under his belt, you have a natural eye. I’m glad the weekend was so profitable. I really didn’t expect to find much with the total lack of rain for several months.

 

The spot where you found the presumed croc vert is definitely a mixed bag. Several Xiphactinus verts came from there a few months ago and the bone material is definitely fishy.

 

Thankfully, the top of overhang isn’t very tall so there’s not multiple tons of rock above you. That being said, you definitely don’t want to be down there swinging a hammer. It only takes a few cubic feet of rock to crush you to death.

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1 hour ago, Ptychodus04 said:

I showed the pics of your vert to Ron Tykoski at the Perot and he mentioned that there’s a very large croc (20+ feet) known from the Cenomanian (late Woodbine to Early Britton Formations) called Terminoaris. He said that the vert you collected could fit that ID. He also said that it looks like a caudal vert but he would need to see it prepped to confirm. If that winds up being the case and there’s another vert behind the one you see in the wall, you could potentially have a lot of croc awaiting excavation.

 

Thanks for sending them over! I'm excited to hear about the possibility of croc

 

1 hour ago, Ptychodus04 said:

Thankfully, the top of overhang isn’t very tall so there’s not multiple tons of rock above you. That being said, you definitely don’t want to be down there swinging a hammer. It only takes a few cubic feet of rock to crush you to death.

Agreed. It's going to take a lot of  digging to remove that overburden:default_faint:

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“Not only is the universe stranger than we think, it is stranger than we can think” -Werner Heisenberg 

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Sorry to involve, but it is not possible to identify the name only by having a single vert. Do you go on with digging to search for more?

Terminoaris is known by around a dozen specimens from northern america and Europe. Size could fit, but it´s only a vertebrae, not 100% sure if croc or not. The processes are not to identify, so...

go to dig the skull :rolleyes::rolleyes:

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12 minutes ago, rocket said:

Sorry to involve, but it is not possible to identify the name only by having a single vert. Do you go on with digging to search for more?

Terminoaris is known by around a dozen specimens from northern america and Europe. Size could fit, but it´s only a vertebrae, not 100% sure if croc or not. The processes are not to identify, so...

go to dig the skull :rolleyes::rolleyes:

 

This is a tentative ID until further material is recovered. I agree that we can't hang our hat on the ID based on one vert but the process starts somewhere and that is typically forming a hypothesis on possible matches. It could be something else or it might not be, but it is a starting point.

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Hi Kris

yes, I agree, always necessary to start with a hypothesis :zzzzscratchchin:, so it´s good to identify what kind of animal this vertebrae belongs to.

But, as a long-time researcher my opinion is, that it is only good to give it a name when you are sure what genus it belongs too. So, when we write "could belong to Terminoaris", this could be a solution. The vertebrae is cool, let´s hope Jared finds more. We had several vertebraes in this shape without processes, not easy or possible to identify clear if its croc or plio...

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that´s one of these we do not know, croc, small plio, elasmo.... Last decision was elasmo, but this is 15 years ago, never thought about it since then. Now with this wonderfun find from Jared it´s time to have a closer look on these unidentified vertebraes...

same size, upper cenomanian

Elasmosaurier wirbel mulders S 103.jpg

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Jared, this is insane! As I understand it coniasaur-remains are super-rare, and here you find a whole string of vertebrae, just in your very first couple of minutes at that location. I mean, the stories you keep writing on here seem so unimaginable from where I stand, as I hardly ever find anything more than shell myself...! :blink: And then you've found two associated giant vertebrae as well... :o Not in my wildest dreams, man, not in my wildest dreams...! Lady Luck is most definitely on your side :D

 

The large vertebra you found looks rather like a crushed plesiosaurian/polycotylid vertebra to me, based on the heart-shape face of the centrum's most intact face and the fact that it's not amphicoelous but rather seems platicoelous. But, then again, I've got little experience with crocodile vertebrae outside thalattosuchian ones from the Jurassic and some reference alligator and Eocene crocodile vertebrae, the latter two of which, however, have procoelous vertebrae. Whatever the case may be, it's an awesome find...! :default_clap2:

 

As others have said, however, please do be careful when you go back for the rest. It takes but a little bit of rock to seriously injure a man...

 

3 hours ago, rocket said:

that´s one of these we do not know, croc, small plio, elasmo.... Last decision was elasmo, but this is 15 years ago, never thought about it since then. Now with this wonderfun find from Jared it´s time to have a closer look on these unidentified vertebraes...

same size, upper cenomanian

Elasmosaurier wirbel mulders S 103.jpg

 

That's an interesting specimen. We'd need to see both faces and photographs from each side to get a better impression of the overall shape of it. But my first feeling with the rather dense bone and amphiplatian nature of the centrum would be that this is plesiosaurian. And since the vertebral face is round rather than heart-shaped, very likely pliosaur.

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'There's nothing like millions of years of really frustrating trial and error to give a species moral fibre and, in some cases, backbone' -- Terry Pratchett

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16 minutes ago, pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon said:

Lady Luck is most definitely on your side

Sometimes indeed! I still get skunked a lot while exploring but that's just part of the process - you guys only hear about the successful trips ;)

 

16 minutes ago, pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon said:

The large vertebra you found looks rather like a crushed plesiosaurian/polycotylid vertebra to me, based on the heart-shape face of the centrum's most intact face and the fact that it's not amphicoelous but rather seems platicoelous. But, then again, I've got little experience with crocodile vertebrae outside thalattosuchian ones from the Jurassic and some reference alligator and Eocene crocodile vertebrae, the latter two of which, however, have procoelous vertebrae. Whatever the case may be, it's an awesome find...! :default_clap2:

 

I personally have  a hard time differentiating between the two for this vert, and I've relied completely on paleontologists and knowledgeable forum members here so far. While I cut my teeth with mosasaurs and coniasaurs, I know very little when it comes to crocs and plesiosaurs.... and those are my only two options left it seems :P

Edited by Jared C
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“Not only is the universe stranger than we think, it is stranger than we can think” -Werner Heisenberg 

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1 hour ago, Jared C said:

and those are my only two options left it seems

 

Let's not forget about the possibility of a dinosaur washed into the water. This area was not far from the shoreline at the time. :fingerscrossed:

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10 minutes ago, Ptychodus04 said:

Let's not forget about the possibility of a dinosaur washed into the water. This area was not far from the shoreline at the time. :fingerscrossed:

 

I agree, it's one of the possibilities that crossed my mind as well. Such vertebra can look deceptively similar :)

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'There's nothing like millions of years of really frustrating trial and error to give a species moral fibre and, in some cases, backbone' -- Terry Pratchett

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Congrats!  Be careful.  I was hunting solo last month, made 2 passes at the foot of a bluff, not even digging, and a dump truck sized load let go without warning and missed me by seconds.  This was an area where I've never seen human footprints.  (Stories you don't tell the wife!)

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Grüße,

Daniel A. Wöhr aus Südtexas

"To the motivated go the spoils."

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1 hour ago, Uncle Siphuncle said:

Congrats!  Be careful.  I was hunting solo last month, made 2 passes at the foot of a bluff, not even digging, and a dump truck sized load let go without warning and missed me by seconds.  This was an area where I've never seen human footprints.  (Stories you don't tell the wife!)

 

That’s scary!

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7 hours ago, Ptychodus04 said:

That’s scary!

 

Certainly is... I've also heard a story about someone actuality dying this way while on a lone hunt in a quarry. Definitely not something to take lightly!

'There's nothing like millions of years of really frustrating trial and error to give a species moral fibre and, in some cases, backbone' -- Terry Pratchett

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Our esteemed member, CalDigger, died in 2020.

 

 

Edited by DPS Ammonite

My goal is to leave no stone or fossil unturned.   

See my Arizona Paleontology Guide    link  The best single resource for Arizona paleontology anywhere.       

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I'd like to make an ID correction on the Ptychodus - as @LSCHNELLE reminded me, P. polygyrus isn't found in Texas - so this is probably a P. martini !

“Not only is the universe stranger than we think, it is stranger than we can think” -Werner Heisenberg 

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