AranHao Posted August 26, 2022 Share Posted August 26, 2022 hello This tooth is from Two Medicine fm Montana.I bought it in Tucson.This tooth needs a lot of repair. CH:9.1cm CBL:3.3cm CBW:2.3cm Mesial serration density(mid-line): 10/5mm Distal serration density(mid-line): 10/5mm enamel texture:Braided or Irregular thanks!!! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Troodon Posted August 26, 2022 Share Posted August 26, 2022 Definitely a Tyrannosaurid and big enough to be a Daspeletosaurus not Gorgosaurus. Do you have a location where it's from ? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted August 26, 2022 Author Share Posted August 26, 2022 19 minutes ago, Troodon said: Do you have a location where it's from ? Unfortunately, I lost the label when I moved. I only remember it was the Two Medicine fm, Montana Link to post Share on other sites
Troodon Posted August 26, 2022 Share Posted August 26, 2022 Without a locality you cannot be positive its from the TMF especially if its from Montana. Size does say its a Daspletosaurus sp. but will not give it a species name because of the lack of a complete provenance. Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted August 30, 2022 Author Share Posted August 30, 2022 @TroodonThanks for your help.and Is this a lateral dentary？ Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted August 31, 2022 Author Share Posted August 31, 2022 @Troodon I'm sorry for my interruption, 1, Is this a lateral dentary？ 2, And I'm sorry for my poor English. I don't know the relationship between the anterior teeth and the mesial teeth. Does the mesial teeth include the anterior teeth Link to post Share on other sites
Troodon Posted August 31, 2022 Share Posted August 31, 2022 The oval shape typically suggest an anterior dentary tooth. Here is a paper on tooth terminology. Terminology .pdf When it comes to jaw position the teeth in the front of the jaw are mesial but some like use anterior. Similarly those toward the back are distal or posterior. So both anterior or mesial tell you its in front of the jaw. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted August 31, 2022 Author Share Posted August 31, 2022 21 minutes ago, Troodon said: The oval shape typically suggest an anterior dentary tooth. Here is a paper on tooth terminology. Terminology .pdf 7.3 MB · 1 download When it comes to jaw position the teeth in the front of the jaw are mesial but some like use anterior. Similarly those toward the back are distal or posterior. So both anterior or mesial tell you its in front of the jaw. I am very excited about this. Thank you. I will continue to study！！ Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted September 1, 2022 Author Share Posted September 1, 2022 @TroodonMy DSDI is 1 not >1.2, so is it because of the size that it is described as Daspletosaurus sp?http://www.thefossilforum.com/index.php?/topic/57316-identification-tyrannosaurid-teeth-from-north-america/&tab=comments#comment-609599 Link to post Share on other sites
Troodon Posted September 1, 2022 Share Posted September 1, 2022 Yes size is key I don't think you will see Gorgosaurus teeth that large, but I might be wrong . Not sure how effective Hendrickx identification technique is on all teeth, especially large ones and I have not had much experience using it. My concern initially and still is that I see quite a bit of variation in the density of tyrannosaurid teeth so it may effect the results. Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted September 1, 2022 Author Share Posted September 1, 2022 17 minutes ago, Troodon said: Yes size is key I don't think you will see Gorgosaurus teeth that large, but I might be wrong . Not sure how effective Hendrickx identification technique is on all teeth, especially large ones and I have not had much experience using it. My concern initially and still is that I see quite a bit of variation in the density of tyrannosaurid teeth so it may effect the results. but, I saw a 3.47 inches Gorgosaurus teeth in the Dallas auction , which is very close to my tooth in size https://fineart.ha.com/itm/natural-history/dinosaur-tooth-gorgosaurus-sp-cretaceous-judith-river-formation-mont/a/29151-48203.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515 Link to post Share on other sites
Troodon Posted September 1, 2022 Share Posted September 1, 2022 Identification of isolated teeth is not easy and Hendrickx technique may be valid with says your tooth is "cf Gorgosaurus". If it is it would be an extremely large one, not sure what to tell you. I have not seen one that large, they may exist. I will say that because you saw one sold in an auction does not guarantee it was identified correctly and there are no Tyrannosaurids described from the JRF. However most believe both Gorgosaurus and Daspeletosaurus exist. Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted September 1, 2022 Author Share Posted September 1, 2022 9 minutes ago, Troodon said: Identification of isolated teeth is not easy and Hendrickx technique may be valid with says your tooth is "cf Gorgosaurus". If it is it would be an extremely large one, not sure what to tell you. I have not seen one that large, they may exist. I will say that because you saw one sold in an auction does not guarantee it was identified correctly and there are no Tyrannosaurids described from the JRF. However most believe both Gorgosaurus and Daspeletosaurus exist. You're right. I know. I think this tooth is Daspletosaurus more Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted September 25, 2022 Author Share Posted September 25, 2022 is it root? if is, the crown is 3inch. Will this affect the conclusion that it is Daspletosaurus sp？ @Troodon Link to post Share on other sites
Troodon Posted September 25, 2022 Share Posted September 25, 2022 Yes at this point its an indeterminate Tyrannosaurid from two points: size at 3" is a concern, not sure on mesial dentary teeth and no locality. Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted September 26, 2022 Author Share Posted September 26, 2022 17 hours ago, Troodon said: Yes at this point its an indeterminate Tyrannosaurid from two points: size at 3" is a concern, not sure on mesial dentary teeth and no locality. Is this topic still work? well, it was six years ago..... A crown over 3 inches is the only positive method. Unfortunately, the tooth tag was lost following the replacement of the display box. http://www.thefossilforum.com/index.php?/topic/60636-dont-get-fooled-buying-daspletosaurus-dino-teeth/&tab=comments#comment-646091 Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted September 26, 2022 Author Share Posted September 26, 2022 wow,I found the picture of my teeth, in this topic @Troodon and it's Glacier County Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted September 26, 2022 Author Share Posted September 26, 2022 (edited) I remeasured the denticle density (forgive my ruler), DC is 9/5 mm and MC is 8.5 (9)/5 mm . From this topic（Your discussion with Andy，its amazing !）, may it be proved that is Daspletosaurus (D. horneri)? Edited September 26, 2022 by AranHao replenish Link to post Share on other sites
Troodon Posted September 26, 2022 Share Posted September 26, 2022 Ha ha what luck. Thats definitely two Medicine. Look all I can go by is Hendrickx analysis on to POSSIBLY identify Daspletosaurus teeth and your tooth fails that test. So.. its your tooth call it whatever you are comfortable with. . Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted September 27, 2022 Author Share Posted September 27, 2022 @TroodonI don't think Hendrickx analysis has any effect on D. horneri，You can see that most of the DSDI of MOR590 in the chart range from 1.09 to 1.13, and only one is 1.28, which can overturn Hendrickx analysis. After all, its data only refer to the samples of Dinosaur Park FM Link to post Share on other sites
Troodon Posted September 27, 2022 Share Posted September 27, 2022 They have skull that describes those teeth makes it a bit easier. Isolated teeth can have lots of variation as you can see with those numbers. In Currie's et al. paper it shows, these charts. Not important what the components are but that these tyrannosaurid features can occupy the same Morphological space. Why its so hard to ID campanian tyrannosaurid isolated teeth. Link to post Share on other sites
AranHao Posted September 28, 2022 Author Share Posted September 28, 2022 9 hours ago, Troodon said: They have skull that describes those teeth makes it a bit easier. Isolated teeth can have lots of variation as you can see with those numbers. In Currie's et al. paper it shows, these charts. Not important what the components are but that these tyrannosaurid features can occupy the same Morphological space. Why its so hard to ID campanian tyrannosaurid isolated teeth. Yes , we can only say similar , so I remeasured the teeth ( CH : 7.7cm CHR : 2.43 CBR : 0.727 ) . According to the chart , it can only be said that the data may be D. horneri Link to post Share on other sites
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