Fossil Expert in Southern California

[Exoticminerallennial]

Greetings, is there anyone that could recommend a fossil expert located in Southern California that could come on site to certify a series of dinosaur fossils that have been uncovered. Specifically, petrified/opalized dinosaur fossils. Thanks in advance!

[Ludwigia]

I'm not an expert, but I have my sincere doubts that you have found dinosaur fossils in California, since they are exceedingly rare in that state, let alone opalized fossils, which are only found in Australia as far as I know. But hopefully someone will come along here who is more familiar with Californian exposures.

[DPS Ammonite]

Reach out to the San Diego Natural History Museum and the geology/paleontology departments of the local universities. Have good pictures of your finds with some stratigraphic information.

 

Show them to us too.

Edited November 26, 2022 by DPS Ammonite

[jpc]

you can post pictures here, we have possibly more expertise than the SD Museum.  Nothing personal against them, but they may be too busy to answer every call they get like this.  We, on the other hand, love to see what people are finding and often can tell you all about the finds.

[Exoticminerallennial]

Okay here is one of the specimens I have that I think is a petrified reptilian dinosaur. The rest are too big for me to transport anywhere. I’ve determined it to be a hydrophane opal because of specific gravity changes and transparency after being placed in water.

Edited November 27, 2022 by Exoticminerallennial

[Tidgy's Dad]

This looks suspiciously like one rock balanced on top of another rock to me. 

Can't see any bone texture or structure or any symmetry. 

[Ludwigia]

I agree with Tidgy's Dad. Not seeing any opal either.

[jpc]

17 minutes ago, Tidgy's Dad said:

This looks suspiciously like one rock balanced on top of another rock to me. 

Can't see any bone texture or structure or any symmetry. 

I agree.  Dinosaur bone has a very distinctive boney texture which I don't see here.  This is especially visible on broken edges.  (And yes, I have been working with dinosaur bones for 30 years).   

[Exoticminerallennial]

What if soft tissue was petrified thereby not exposing bone at its surface. So what you see instead is opalized ‘mineralized from silicification’ 3d cast of the animal preserved in extremely rare well conditions and replaced by the mineraloid. Also opal isn’t defined by its color or shape but rather its properties. To date, opal especially hydrophane opal has been recorded to produce and consist of every color in the rainbow. As far as symmetry, the specimen has two upper limbs with two set of hands with two set of claws of three. Likewise two long legs one bent, the other straight out that are each met with a foot and set of three claws. It really is impossible to capture a 3d image into a 2d picture. I really think adding video content would really promote this website entirely. In terms of lack of symmetry, are fossils ever really 100% perfect when they are found? Natural environmental conditions set the positions of which animals die in the ground and then erosion and weathering elements prob do a number them as well. For those who’ve been studying fossils for many years, I ask you to open your view of the possibilities of what else could be considered ‘fossils’. We certainty haven’t figured out everything there is to ‘know’. I’ve come to realize that the fossil community/paleontologist  have become very closed minded to the potential and possibility of something actually being able to exist outside of their realm of knowledge and/experience. We as a whole have a lot more to learn and uncover on and outside of this earth. Fossils shouldn’t be defined under any standard but rather should be used merely as reference. It shouldn’t be used as a standard that reject the idea that fossilized remains can be of a different makeup? More often than not specimens are just paced under categories like igneous or metamorphic due to the ambiguity of its mineral makeup it’s just easier to categorize it in that sense. Sorry rant over, just bothered with how closed minded people have become to the possibility of something going against what they know to be true. Logic should be at the forefront of this discussion and if organic matter can be fossilized into petrified trees and petrified tree are in fact found in Southern California. And if animal remains are made up of organic matter and the soil conditions warrant well preservation at the time of dead, it is a fallacy to conclude the non existence of petrified animal remains as well. Also, for the argument I know is going to come at me in terms of geology of Southern California and volcanic activity and magma formation of igneous rocks, has no one thought or realized that if a fossil petrified or not being made out of sand stone can be heated (especially if heated and cooled at a slow rate) would crystallized similar to that of the formation of glass. The head is loose on this specimen most likely due to environmental factors shifting in the ground but was found in its position holding on by a very fragile piece when uncovered in the ground. Here’s a close of the right face containing its skin that has been petrified from permineralization replacement. I know this is 100% a fossil because I have four other specimens that are of a much greater size that have also undergone the same petrification process and are fully in tact and anatomically complete. I really just need someone in my area to come on site to verify and certify and to maybe help figure out the age of which this dinosaur did exist. Compensation would be in order. Thank you for your time and take care.

[Ludwigia]

I hate to tell you this, but after this rant, you are in all probabability not going to be able to find an expert who would be willing to "verify and certify" this rock as a dinosaur. As far as close-mindedness is concerned, I would suggest that you also keep an open mind to what our members are telling you here, particularly the ones who are trained paleontologists, who have years of experience in the field. I'd suggest you transport your stone to the nearest natural history museum for assessment if you still don't want to listen to what we are trying to tell you. In the meantime, look up the definition of pareidolia.

[ThePhysicist]

31 minutes ago, Exoticminerallennial said:

I’ve come to realize that the fossil community/paleontologist  have become very closed minded

31 minutes ago, Exoticminerallennial said:

I know this is 100% a fossil

Doesn't sound like this discussion can progress any further.   

[Troodon]

Your best case is what we tell everyone when we come to this impass.  Just take your easiest to transport item to the nearest museum and see what they say, unless you believe they will also be close minded.   I doubt anyone will visit you after seeing your specimens, nice they are but not fossils.

[JBkansas]

On 11/26/2022 at 3:08 PM, Ludwigia said:

I'm not an expert, but I have my sincere doubts that you have found dinosaur fossils in California, since they are exceedingly rare in that state, let alone opalized fossils, which are only found in Australia as far as I know. But hopefully someone will come along here who is more familiar with Californian exposures.

I believe Virgin Valley also has opalized fossils (in addition to their petrified wood).

 

https://www.royalpeacock.com/fee-digging/about-our-opals

[Coco]

Hi,

 

It’s amazing how many people arrive here, asking to identify their findings while claiming that our minds are closed simply because we don’t answer what they want to hear! There is no fossil record here! No one can tell you otherwise. Pareidolie...

 

Coco

(40 years of experience)

[Ludwigia]

30 minutes ago, JBkansas said:

I believe Virgin Valley also has opalized fossils (in addition to their petrified wood).

 

https://www.royalpeacock.com/fee-digging/about-our-opals

Yes of course, but Virgin Valley is in Nevada, not southern California, although it's not in Australia

[jpc]

As a working paleontologist, I wish I had a dollar for every time someone on here (and at work) had a non-fossil and told us we need to have an open mind and then explain to us some nonsense about how they think it came to be.  :  )

 

Close-mindedly respectful (or not),

jpc

 

moderators, feel free to remove if I am getting too snarky

[JohnJ]

3 hours ago, Exoticminerallennial said:

I know this is 100% a fossil

 

Honestly, how do you know this? 

 

Specifically, what direct evidence do you have to support the notion this is a fossil.

 

Your explanation, so far, sounds almost word for word like a couple of other recent, unsatisfied, new members promoting hopeful ideas that supposedly gain credibility based on their rejection by established scientific methods

 

 

[Exoticminerallennial]

Literally just needed a contact. Never requested to have my specimen identified. I hope you all the best and maybe one day when this discovery comes to light you’ll reflect, positively anyway. 

[DPS Ammonite]

13 minutes ago, Exoticminerallennial said:

Literally just needed a contact. Never requested to have my specimen identified. I hope you all the best and maybe one day when this discovery comes to light you’ll reflect, positively anyway. 

Please let us know what you find out about your pieces.

[JohnJ]

5 hours ago, Exoticminerallennial said:

I really just need someone in my area to come on site to verify and certify and to maybe help figure out the age of which this dinosaur did exist. Compensation would be in order. Thank you for your time and take care.

 

Best of success in your search for accurate information.  Unfortunately, I doubt you will find anyone within the scientific community that will give you the answers you want.  But, that's just my opinion.

 

On the other hand, I think there are plenty of pseudo science marketeers that will gladly take your money.  They will also be happy to play on any beliefs that all who disagree this is a fossil are just standing in the way of human knowledge while they take advantage of anyone else's lack of geologic knowledge.  

[Mark Kmiecik]

On 11/27/2022 at 7:37 PM, Exoticminerallennial said:

Literally just needed a contact. Never requested to have my specimen identified. I hope you all the best and maybe one day when this discovery comes to light you’ll reflect, positively anyway. 

 

Just Google "paleontologists in california" and you get a whole list of museums in the state. Pick the one nearest you and call them. The phone numbers are provided.

 

They will ask you for the same information and photos as we did, and will probably tell you the same thing we did. They don't have the money or the time to spend on running out to tell people that what they found is not a dinosaur (there are no permineralized dino fossils found in California), and the rock you found is not opal (it isn't). There's Lifetime collectors, professors of paleontology, renowned authors of fossil publications, museum curators and many other professionals on this forum. Trust me, if the people on this forum tell you it's not what you think it is, then it is not. Period. You don't need to spend any more time or pay out money for further identification. If there was any chance that what you found is what you think we would be the first to congratulate you and help you identify it and lead you to the best minds in the country if we could not identify it. We have nothing to gain by misleading you.

 

I'm sorry that you have for some reason taken offence. That is not our intent. Feel free to waste all your time and money in your endeavor to turn a common rock into something else. Good luck, smile, and don't forget to breathe. 

 

P.S. -- Soft tissue is seldom preserved and when it is it's only a piece here and there, not covering the entire creature as you imply. Skin and guts either rot away or are eaten by scavengers long before the fossilization process begins. Even if the animal is immediately buried, anaerobic bacteria turn soft tissue into unidetifiable "goop" 99.999% of the time.

Edited November 29, 2022 by Mark Kmiecik
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