tracer Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 13.5" long. S.E. Texas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 The "twist" in it resembles that of mylodont ground sloth?? "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 13.5" long. S.E. Texas That is a very large humerus, that is, a very long humerus -- especially considering that a portion of it is missing from the proximal end. It doesn't appear to be a horse. I don't have a cow example here. If it is a fossil, don't rule out a camel. 1 http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracer Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 an additional picture in hopes of getting ID help. cranial view of distal humerus, but where are the trochlea and capitulum? Are they just worn down or were they never there? no cancellous bone is exposed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Some similarities? (sorry for the pixelation...) This is a Giant Ground Sloth from the LaBrea Tar Pits. "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Siphuncle Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 It has been my observation that sloth bones tend to be a bit more robust than the relatively gracile specimen shown. I'm leaning toward one of the camelids too. I've seen camel limb bones in excess of 20 inches long, and they tend to be rather gracile. 1 Grüße, Daniel A. Wöhr aus Südtexas "To the motivated go the spoils." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 an additional picture in hopes of getting ID help. cranial view of distal humerus, but where are the trochlea and capitulum? Are they just worn down or were they never there? no cancellous bone is exposed. No wonder it was puzzling . . . it's HUMAN. http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 No wonder it was puzzling . . . it's HUMAN. HOLY COW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracer Jr. Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 okay i'm sorta starting to get freaked out. are we sure it's human? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest solius symbiosus Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 okay i'm sorta starting to get freaked out. are we sure it's human? I know next to nothing about verts, but I will "say" that Harry is one of the best on the forum regarding their ID. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommabetts Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Human wow, That is kinda freaky. Is it fossilized for sure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnJ Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 No wonder it was puzzling . . . it's HUMAN. (Can't believe I'm doing this...) Harry, are you sure??? (ducking now ) It appears a little different from this photo. The human mind has the ability to believe anything is true. - JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 HOLY COW. Nope; Human. "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracer Posted November 4, 2008 Author Share Posted November 4, 2008 well, having just rapidly looked at every human humerus i could find online, i can say that i certainly see the resemblance, but the fossil i have seems much thicker than a normal human humerus, and it's "twist" isn't quite the same, and there seem to be other differences. the thing is pretty heavily mineralized, has sort of a reddish "crust" of oxidation on it, so i'm not concerned about it being anything recent at all. but it just doesn't look nearly as thin as the humeri online. of course, it also looks nothing like other mammal humeri i'd already looked at, so i don't know. anybody know if humans used to have much thicker humeri? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Siphuncle Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I once had a girlfriend who said she was just big boned. Grüße, Daniel A. Wöhr aus Südtexas "To the motivated go the spoils." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
explorer1 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 that is no doubt human, WOW, AND ON HALLWEENO WEEKEND. CORRECT ME HARRY IF IAM WRONG.But we had a shorter human here with thicker legs and arms, big long name i will have to look up. lol not unless you found bigfoot, aka gigantopithicus. also i have gravel for sale check the trade room or my posts. god hunting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 ...anybody know if humans used to have much thicker humeri? Did you find it in Oklahoma? "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnJ Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 well, having just rapidly looked at every human humerus i could find online, i can say that i certainly see the resemblance, but the fossil i have seems much thicker than a normal human humerus, and it's "twist" isn't quite the same, and there seem to be other differences. the thing is pretty heavily mineralized, has sort of a reddish "crust" of oxidation on it, so i'm not concerned about it being anything recent at all. but it just doesn't look nearly as thin as the humeri online. of course, it also looks nothing like other mammal humeri i'd already looked at, so i don't know. anybody know if humans used to have much thicker humeri? Tracer, I thought the same thing. Your fossil seems more robust on the distal end and has the unusual twist. More to compare with HERE. The human mind has the ability to believe anything is true. - JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Nope; Human. I dunno' . . . This is so difficult image-to-image! The bone in the image that Auspex posted is definitely more gracile. On the other hand, we don't know if that medical image is of a small female humerus or not. The length is just right for human. The capitulum is correct. The lateral condyle projects appropriately for human. The line drawings I have use the reverse side (olecranon fossa side) and a top-down view (capitulum-down) of this distal end of the humerus. Post images with those views for further evaluation. Plus, a top-down view (to provide a profile of the articulating surfaces) of the proximal end of the bone would be helpful. There are many human skeletons available for comparison. Any high school or community college science teacher could help you. Any chiropractor would have a skeleton. That would be more reliable, I think. Good luck with the police and state archives/natural resources people -- you don't have any native-American artifacts, do you? In Florida, disturbing a burial site (read "midden") is a serious offense. Probably nothing to worry about in Texas, though . . . right? 1 http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommabetts Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Same rules for Texas too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracer Posted November 4, 2008 Author Share Posted November 4, 2008 personally, i think it looks more like a giant extinct lemur humerus, perhaps from Megaladapis edwardsi. its features do not match those of a modern human. and you will be very pleased i'm sure to hear that there have never been any middens or burial sites ever disturbed by me at any time in my lifetime, nor will there be. obviously, I wouldn't have wondered if it were from a camel or sloth if it had come from such a place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evans Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 WOW...Good luck with this one. Can anyone say NAGPRA (Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act ) Good luck again, Brian Brian Evans For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mommabetts Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Have you asked danwoehr? He is a member of the DPS and if he didn't know I am sure he could get you in touch with someone that can help you with this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Siphuncle Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I can neither confirm nor deny encountering human remains in the field... Grüße, Daniel A. Wöhr aus Südtexas "To the motivated go the spoils." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tracer Posted November 4, 2008 Author Share Posted November 4, 2008 ok, lessee, we collectively could not identify a raccoon jaw over several days of guessing, but people have me all jammed up over posting pictures of a bone that has distinct differences from every picture I could find online of a human humerus. to those who "wish me luck", i don't need it, as the circumstances hypothesized are not fact, and the statutes referenced do not apply. one sort of unrelated point to that - i have seen people huddle online in the past and debate the finer points of law before, when they obviously had no legal training or background. hopefully they don't also do medical procedures and tax preparation. thank everyone for their thoughts. i obviously had no idea that one of my random fossil postings would cause such a stir, and i will certainly attempt now to memorize enough osteology to avoid accidently posting any picture of anything that might resemble a human bone. it just never crossed my mind when i was thinking about horses, camels, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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