Preserving Fossils

[RickNC]

I have dealt with many, many wet fossils, and I have never used a 'slow dry' regimen as you describe. Put the tooth in a place with some air circulation, heat the tooth with an infra-red lamp (or in a closed automobile parked in the sun), then dip it (or baste it) in a consolidant. (My infra-red lamp is one of the most useful tools I ever acquired.)

Hey Harry. I got that idea from here under the Sub Fossil bone category. http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/vertpaleo/prep.htm

The problem isn't that the fossil is wet (I always deal with wet fossils) but that the interior of the root is very soft as in little fossilization.

[Harry Pristis]

Hey Harry. I got that idea from here under the Sub Fossil bone category. http://www.flmnh.ufl...tpaleo/prep.htm

The problem isn't that the fossil is wet (I always deal with wet fossils) but that the interior of the root is very soft as in little fossilization.

I read the bit about the slow drying sub-fossils. That sound like unnecessary work for preparing a mastodon tooth. The term "sub-fossil" is mis-used on that page to refer to a state of preservation. I think "sub-fossil" is a term of art relating to the age of remains.

"Sub-fossil" sounds to me like a cow bone or an Native American dog jaw from a midden. A sub-fossil may or may not have residual collagen, but collagen does not survive long when exposed to weathering. Sub-fossils may be highly mineralized, but mammal teeth have no collagen in their construction.

But, I digress. Your mastodon tooth, like other mammal teeth, has no collagen. Roots are the last thing to develop, and they are laid down from the outside of the tooth to the inside. It may be that your tooth root was not fully developed when the elephant died. Is it unworn?

Anyway, just air dry the tooth . . . the root will not be damaged. If it is soft, all the more reason to do a good job of consolidating it.

(from my TFF profile page)

There seems to be endless misunderstanding about the term "fossilized."

"Fossilized" is a near meaningless term. The term is often substituted for "mineralized" in describing a bone or tooth. But, fossilized doesn't always equate to mineralized because many fossils are not impregnated or replaced by minerals.

Bone is primarily composed of hydroxyapatite and collagen. Hydroxyapatite is an inorganic compound of calcium, phosphate, and hydroxide which is organized in a crystal latticework that gives bone (and teeth) structural rigidity. It preserves well as a fossil under some conditions.

Collagen is a fiberous protein that serves as connective tissue in bones and muscles. It does not preserve well in a fossil. As collagen decomposes, it may be replaced in the hydroxyapatite latticework by minerals from the depositional environment (e.g. silica dioxide dissolved in groundwater).

Bone reinforced with exogenous minerals is said to be "mineralized."

A 'burn test' or 'match test' will usually indicate whether there is collagen remaining in a bone -- scorched collagen has an awful smell. Teeth - dentin and enamel - contain hydroxyapatite, but don't contain collagen, so the 'burn test' on a tooth would be a waste of time.

The 'click test' - tapping a putative fossil against your teeth - was a joke that caught on. There are plenty of other things in the environment against which you can click a bone. Don't put the remains of dead, decomposed animals in your mouth.

[DeloiVarden]

I read the bit about the slow drying sub-fossils. That sound like unnecessary work for preparing a mastodon tooth. The term "sub-fossil" is mis-used on that page to refer to a state of preservation. I think "sub-fossil" is a term of art relating to the age of remains.

"Sub-fossil" sounds to me like a cow bone or an Native American dog jaw from a midden. A sub-fossil may or may not have residual collagen, but collagen does not survive long when exposed to weathering. Sub-fossils may be highly mineralized, but mammal teeth have no collagen in their construction.

But, I digress. Your mastodon tooth, like other mammal teeth, has no collagen. Roots are the last thing to develop, and they are laid down from the outside of the tooth to the inside. It may be that your tooth root was not fully developed when the elephant died. Is it unworn?

Anyway, just air dry the tooth . . . the root will not be damaged. If it is soft, all the more reason to do a good job of consolidating it.

(from my TFF profile page)

There seems to be endless misunderstanding about the term "fossilized."

"Fossilized" is a near meaningless term. The term is often substituted for "mineralized" in describing a bone or tooth. But, fossilized doesn't always equate to mineralized because many fossils are not impregnated or replaced by minerals.

Bone is primarily composed of hydroxyapatite and collagen. Hydroxyapatite is an inorganic compound of calcium, phosphate, and hydroxide which is organized in a crystal latticework that gives bone (and teeth) structural rigidity. It preserves well as a fossil under some conditions.

Collagen is a fiberous protein that serves as connective tissue in bones and muscles. It does not preserve well in a fossil. As collagen decomposes, it may be replaced in the hydroxyapatite latticework by minerals from the depositional environment (e.g. silica dioxide dissolved in groundwater).

Bone reinforced with exogenous minerals is said to be "mineralized."

A 'burn test' or 'match test' will usually indicate whether there is collagen remaining in a bone -- scorched collagen has an awful smell. Teeth - dentin and enamel - contain hydroxyapatite, but don't contain collagen, so the 'burn test' on a tooth would be a waste of time.

The 'click test' - tapping a putative fossil against your teeth - was a joke that caught on. There are plenty of other things in the environment against which you can click a bone. Don't put the remains of dead, decomposed animals in your mouth.

Even as a fellow scientist Harry, I catch myself having to reread your posts several times to soak up all your information. You need to write a book dude.

[RickNC]

Thanks Harry. No, the crown does have some wear. The softness inside the root is hard to explain but it feels squishy. But I'll haul it out and let it dry. Thanks.

[Harry Pristis]

Thanks Harry. No, the crown does have some wear. The softness inside the root is hard to explain but it feels squishy. But I'll haul it out and let it dry. Thanks.

Even as a fellow scientist Harry, I catch myself having to reread your posts several times to soak up all your information. You need to write a book dude.

You're welcome, Rick. Let us know how it works out.

Thank you for the feedback, 'DeloiVarden'. It's reassuring to hear that some subscribers here are reading such posts.

[rockinthehead]

Hey guys and gals,

I just noticed this thread and thought I would throw in my two cents. I have been able to hunt the Coon Creek fossil site in Tennessee and we preserved our fossils with a mixture of water and Future floor wax. I am not sure if this will apply to what you are talking about, but it works exceptionally well for these.

[tooth_claw]

G'day folks,

Just thought I would throw in my methodology......

I have been preparing pleistocene vertebrates for about 10 years now. I have two main products that I use, Mowital and Paraliod B72 (google them for more info, they sound very similar to Butvar or Vinac) dissolved in acetone mainly, ethanol if working in caves (to avoid toxic fumes). These can be mixed as a thin, penetrating liquid all the way up to a thick glue, depending on your needs. I usually apply the mix with a brush or pippette, dipping can sometimes make bones soft and very fragile (think wet cardboard) but is a fine method if your fossils are robust.

Fossils from cave deposits (for example) are often wet, this will result in the plastics forming a white film on the surface and prevent them from penetrating the bone, I have found that this can be redissolved as the specimen dries. (I have never used the heat lamp trick...might have to experiment some!). You can actually get a variety of results ranging from dry-looking bone to glossy laquer with these products depending on your needs, also the method is reversible and any extra glue blobs can simply be redissolved with acetone and removed with a brush (I always try to clean up glued surfaces to make the join neat).

Consolidation of fossils can mean the difference between a bone and a pile of crumbs- I would always try to get some 'plastic' into a fossil, the surface can be given the original dry look again by brushing with acetone until the consolidant retreats into the core of the specimen.

Finally, Acetone is not your friend! Wear as much saftey gear as possible (goggles, mask, gloves, labcoat).

I have learned a few tips and tricks here, thanks for sharing!

[koscojo]

I bought some Holloway House Quick Shine Floor Finish to preserve my dry and cracking fossils, but I'm not sure how to apply it. Any suggestions?

[Auspex]

I bought some Holloway House Quick Shine Floor Finish to preserve my dry and cracking fossils, but I'm not sure how to apply it. Any suggestions?

Seems similar to the old Future Floor Polish (also a water-born polymer); I know several folks who applied Future by thinning it down with water and spraying their fragile fossils with a spray bottle. Experiment on something you can afford to ruin first!

[koscojo]

Seems similar to the old Future Floor Polish (also a water-born polymer); I know several folks who applied Future by thinning it down with water and spraying their fragile fossils with a spray bottle. Experiment on something you can afford to ruin first!

HARD DECISION! Lol. I love all of my fossils I guess my main issue would also be how it will affect my fossils down the road.

[koscojo]

Hey guys and gals,

I just noticed this thread and thought I would throw in my two cents. I have been able to hunt the Coon Creek fossil site in Tennessee and we preserved our fossils with a mixture of water and Future floor wax. I am not sure if this will apply to what you are talking about, but it works exceptionally well for these.

What parts do you use? One part wax to one part water?

[ecleland]

How about polyurethane and does anyone know anything specifically about thinner shell fossils.

[ElliebellyS]

I don't use anything on sharks' teeth and similar specimens.

[ZiggieCie]

Here is a link to one of my favorite fossil preparation sites. They explain the why's and hows of fossil prep, the chemicals they use and don't use. Also links to suppliers.

http://preparation.paleo.amnh.org/1/home

Link to suppliers.

http://preparation.paleo.amnh.org/14/unpacking-a-specimen

[-Andy-]

I am trying out mod podge on my fossils.

So far the result looks decent, not too glossy, and it forms a protective outer layer.

A little sticky though, I may have applied too much.

Anyone else tried mod podge?

[Wrangellian]

I would avoid putting anything on fossils unless they're fragile and you expect to be handling them frequently. If they are at all glossy they can be difficult to photograph without glare. If they are fragile there are ways of applying particular glues to them that will not be glossy or look unnatural.

[NZ_Fossil_Collecta]

Putting a thin coating of 'turtle' car wax on amber and then buffing it with a cloth 15 minutes later is good for amber specimens, and you only need to do it once a year

Edited May 17, 2014 by NZ_Fossil_Collecta

[Cluros]

This may sound archaic but an older collector friend of mine said that in the 1960s and early 70s a number of collectors used pieces of styrofoam coffee cups dissolved in acetone. He thought the results were as good as butvar and vivac. I myself haven't tried this, but his stabilized fossils still look good 50 years later.

[Auspex]

This may sound archaic but an older collector friend of mine said that in the 1960s and early 70s a number of collectors used pieces of styrofoam coffee cups dissolved in acetone. He thought the results were as good as butvar and vivac. I myself haven't tried this, but his stabilized fossils still look good 50 years later.

Just keep them out of the sunlight; styrene is notably unstable under UV exposure.

[GeschWhat]

NEVER use GLUE on fossil POO!

I just received two coprolites from Morocco and was sad to find that a stabilizer was used on them in a few places. This make prepping the specimens difficult and can interfere with chemical analysis. I made this mistake myself once upon a time. While it is perfectly acceptable to use stabilizers like paraloid, paleobond, etc., on fossil bone, it can ruin coprolites. I was told by one of the foremost experts on coprolites to simply wrap crumbly coprolites in foil. Pass it on!

[SULLY]

Wow! Talk about a lot of information to take in all at once. Thank you again for all the information everyone. Newbs such as myself really appreciate it!

 

    Sincerely, J

[oldtimer]

In using Butvar or Duco mixed with acetone is there a risk or damage to fossils already treated or that have been stabilized?  What cautions should be considered when treating fossils of unknown histories?

[Harry Pristis]

2 hours ago, oldtimer said:

In using Butvar or Duco mixed with acetone is there a risk or damage to fossils already treated or that have been stabilized? What cautions should be considered when treating fossils of unknown histories?

 

The acetone will loosen glue joins (except epoxy glue) and it will make a mess of white glue, though it won't remove it.  Always test a small, obscure area of the fossil for reaction to the acetone.

 

 

[DoyouthinkhesaurusRex]

Does anybody here have experience with B08SY Resin?

 

The site it is available on says it "is considered an equivalent resin to Butvar B-76, from a different supplier.  It utilizes the same Polyvinyl Butyral resin as Butvar B-76.  B08SY resin has the same solubility as Butvar B-76, but has a smaller grain size."

 

Needless to say, I would rather be safe and ask here before ordering.  Any input is appreciated.

 

 

[Sagebrush Steve]

On 1/24/2018 at 3:06 PM, DoyouthinkhesaurusRex said:

Does anybody here have experience with B08SY Resin?

 

The site it is available on says it "is considered an equivalent resin to Butvar B-76, from a different supplier.  It utilizes the same Polyvinyl Butyral resin as Butvar B-76.  B08SY resin has the same solubility as Butvar B-76, but has a smaller grain size."

 

Needless to say, I would rather be safe and ask here before ordering.  Any input is appreciated.