Preserving Fossils

[screweduptexan]

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Thank you tracer...great information and definitely not confusing.

[Harry Pristis]

wow i hadnt thought about this until now... Harry should i be preserving the micro bones? i definantly dont want them splitting or being damaged.... is it nessasary with these specimins? if so what would you suggest be the best method?

I didn't remember, 'kauffy', whether or not I had consolidated my micro bones -- I did, I just checked.

Instead of manipulating individual bones in and out of the consolidant, I might start with two jars, one with consolidant, the other empty.

I would add two groups of micro bones, one to each jar. After the fizzing stops in the first jar, I would then decant the solution off the bones into the second jar with the second group of bones. Then I would dump out the bones from the first jar onto cardboard to dry. And so on.

You can keep alternating jars for each new group of bones, and it should go pretty fast. One challenge is to keep the group of identified bones segregated from other bones. Beer flats are cheap and plentiful.

BTW, I like to flip over bones and teeth almost immediately after they hit the cardboard as a precaution against the formation of beads or "pearls" of plastic as the consolidant drains from the specimen. This is probably not a serious consideration with micro bones.

Nicholas, Duco Cement that we're discussing here is colorless model cement. I believe that Duco does make a different cement which is opaque -- that's not what you want. I priced Duco Cement at Wal-Mart a few weeks ago, and it cost $1.19 for a tube, if I remember correctly.

'lawooten' . . . I would check with your local museum preparator who has experience with bones such as you're finding in NC. You don't have to re-invent the wheel here; there is a local reservoir of knowledge. Tell us about your find!!

[Guest Nicholas]

Nicholas, Duco Cement that we're discussing here is colorless model cement. I believe that Duco does make a different cement which is opaque -- that's not what you want. I priced Duco Cement at Wal-Mart a few weeks ago, and it cost $1.19 for a tube, if I remember correctly.

Appreciate it Harry, I'll be picking some within the next 2 weeks. I have much some bones which need preserving.

[lawooten]

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Tracer great read also I put the tab on my desk top for fast reference.

[lawooten]

Harry to answer your question we found what must have been a pod of whales that had beached many years ago. We collected 53 inner ears and that could be pairs or I am guessing that a good many were lost with the rising waters. You know we boxed all the vertebrates we found but I will be opening the entire collection of boxes soon to Butvar them and will get a count. We found a good number of teeth from great white, bones, Megs, and other assorted sharks. Not far past this spot we found a whale mandible and in the opposite direction we found a mastodon rib and vertebrates. All together it took us three days to collect and transport all of them. I have posted here and there on the forum some of the pics of the daily collection we did.

[mommabetts]

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Thanks Tracer!

[Harry Pristis]

Harry to answer your question we found what must have been a pod of whales that had beached many years ago. We collected 53 inner ears and that could be pairs or I am guessing that a good many were lost with the rising waters. You know we boxed all the vertebrates we found but I will be opening the entire collection of boxes soon to Butvar them and will get a count. We found a good number of teeth from great white, bones, Megs, and other assorted sharks. Not far past this spot we found a whale mandible and in the opposite direction we found a mastodon rib and vertebrates. All together it took us three days to collect and transport all of them. I have posted here and there on the forum some of the pics of the daily collection we did.

Gosh! That's great! What sort of whales? . . . toothed whales? . . . baleen whales?

You're on the right track with the Butvar-76. Tracer's link provides interesting information on "white glue" and Duco Cement, but nothing about polyvinyl butyral (Butvar-76). But then, the info in the article is as much as 38 years old (1970 according to the citation). A lot has changed. By 1984, Butvar-76 was the "preferred consolidant" at the Florida State Museum (huge vertebrate collection).

I don't recall seeing the images you mention -- maybe they were too large for me to open.

Good luck with your project!

[tracer]

i have read everything i could find on consolidating fossils, and i continue to search using the best boolean search parameters i can think of. when i was researching butvar, and tried to acquire it from a known museum source, i was told by the curator that they had switched to vinac. based on my research, i have personally chosen to use vinac except for certain repair work, or sealing lapidary work involving dino bone. for those purposes i have used primarily cyanoacrylate glue, or a colorless lapidary epoxy which hardens with more or less the optical characteristics of quartz so that it polishes well and is not visible.

i cannot normally speak to the accuracy of information i post or link to that i have obtained from the internet. one would hope that if a university scientist posts it as a reference for others, that it's currency would have been considered. i guess i go by my previous experience in evaluating things i read. we all know that UV light and the outdoor environment are harsh on many materials. you can paint your front door with spar varnish, urethane, or whatever, but you're going to have to redo it sooner than later. i try to figure out what is most easily redone or reversed that offers the best protection, knowing that perhaps the day will come when there's something better out there, and a do over becomes the best way to proceed.

i am somewhat concerned regarding the use of cellulose nitrate lacquer as a preservative. in my opinion, it remains highly flammable, and it over time deteriorates. nitrocellulose has been used as firearms propellant, and some blackpower enthusiasts use it to treat paper cartridges and fuses to ensure complete combustion. it was long ago abandoned for use in film because of it's instability, and projectors in recent history used to run those old films have had to be equipped with elaborate fire suppression systems.

having said all i've said, i clearly recognize that economy and availability of products frequently determine what is used, and i did use a water-based, polyvinyl acetate glue of unknown formulation briefly before i was able to acquire the vinac.

please bear in mind that it may well not matter what sealant or consolidant you use if you do not take whatever steps are necessary to stabilize your material before sealing it. the analogy is grabbing a spray can and going over the outside of a rusting vehicle. the problem isn't solved. if hygroscopic salts remain, if chemical processes of instability continue, then there's a problem. depending on the size of your material and it's porosity, it may be unlikely or impossible without vacuum assistance to achieve full penetration of consolidant. the dilution and the molecular size of the consolidant matters. you don't want a great "crust" on your fossil and a rotting, cracking, oxidizing, or unstable interior. some of your fossils may have metallic oxides on them, such as iron sulfides, that are preyed upon by bacteria, with a chemical end result being acids that convert your treasure to oxidized dust. oxidation of metallic compounds is enough of an issue that many metal artifacts found in a marine environment must be completely cleaned of salt for months and then are stabilized though an electrolytic process prior to being finally sealed.

my game plan for my son's latest, greatest find involves months of soaking in progressively less saline solution and dehydration in progressively more alcohol solution, and probably an acetone bath for final dehydration insurance before sealing, since alcohol is water soluble.

the above are just my thoughts - which are, of course, the thoughts of the forum fool. they're worth what you paid for them. chemistry is dangerous. i don't advocate anybody do anything in life, other than try to stay healthy and happy.

[Auspex]

...try to stay healthy and happy.

And don't forget to dance

[Ronbo]

I am liking Harrys glue thing seems to be the easiest and effective way of consolidating them, now the acetone would be available where? and it fizzes lol might be an outside project, lol

[Auspex]

...might be an outside project, lol

Well ventilated area, away from ANY source of combustion!

Acetone vapor can not only knock you out, but can form an explosive atmosphere. It is possible to die stoned off your gourd and on fire. Be very careful.

[Pristiformes]

Ron,

Vinac 15 can also be obtained from the Florida Paleontological Society, Inc., operating out of the Florida Museum of Natural History (UF) for $7 per pound, plus tax. I am told that Vinac does not yellow like Butvar does. It can be made into a liquid with either acetone or ethanol. I've always used ethanol. Duco cement deluted with acetone also works, but creats a yellow sheen to fossils, which can be seen if the fossil was a light color to begin with.

Good luck.

Jason

[tracer]

Jason - would you elaborate on why you prefer using ethanol over acetone, please...

[Pristiformes]

Jason - would you elaborate on why you prefer using ethanol over acetone, please...

Oops. I misspoke about using ethanol. I meant to say that I've always used acetone! It must be Friday because my brain is gone. I've been told by George Hecht of the Florida Museum that you can use ethanol. It is probably conveinent for museum staff to use ethanol since it is a common preservative for wet specimens of extant critters, and so the paleontology staff would have easy access to it (versus buying acetone at the hardware store). There may be other reasons too.

There is a publication on proper preparation techniques, written by H. Converse, titled Paleo Preparation Techniques. Like the Vinac 15 I mentioned, this publication is available through the Florida Paleontological Society for $10 + S/H. I forgot to mention in my earlier e-mail that the Vinac (and this publication) are available only to members of FPS. I haven't had the chance to look at the Converse pub, so I can't tell you anything about it.

[kauffy]

I didn't remember, 'kauffy', whether or not I had consolidated my micro bones -- I did, I just checked.

Instead of manipulating individual bones in and out of the consolidant, I might start with two jars, one with consolidant, the other empty.

I would add two groups of micro bones, one to each jar. After the fizzing stops in the first jar, I would then decant the solution off the bones into the second jar with the second group of bones. Then I would dump out the bones from the first jar onto cardboard to dry. And so on.

You can keep alternating jars for each new group of bones, and it should go pretty fast. One challenge is to keep the group of identified bones segregated from other bones. Beer flats are cheap and plentiful.

BTW, I like to flip over bones and teeth almost immediately after they hit the cardboard as a precaution against the formation of beads or "pearls" of plastic as the consolidant drains from the specimen. This is probably not a serious consideration with micro bones.

Nicholas, Duco Cement that we're discussing here is colorless model cement. I believe that Duco does make a different cement which is opaque -- that's not what you want. I priced Duco Cement at Wal-Mart a few weeks ago, and it cost $1.19 for a tube, if I remember correctly.

'lawooten' . . . I would check with your local museum preparator who has experience with bones such as you're finding in NC. You don't have to re-invent the wheel here; there is a local reservoir of knowledge. Tell us about your find!!

Thanks for all of that Harry, when i get some time I will give it a go, i really want to preserve them but dont want to change the way they look...i will try to do some tests on bone fragments to see what sort of a solution works best... i think the issue will be finding all of the materials needed!

Your method sounds very efficient, many of the bones have the fissure dirt in the hollows will this be preserved in this process or will it just dissolve/break down?

Im also curious, just as a side note, did you collect fossils from this fissure material until you had an extensive overview? any chance of a photo of your collection of these micro bones? after seeing some pictures of your other collections i guess you store them in those little plastic containers with foam on the bottom?

Thanks again, i will look into gathering the materials from a local source... perhaps i can speak to my freind at the museum and see if he has a supplier.

[kauffy]

Here is a workable technique for consolidating fossils.

Polyurethane will not give the desired penetration of the fossil. Putting polyurethane on a fossil is usually a bad idea.

I recommend against white glue (polyvinyl acetate) as a consolidant because there are better materials available. (Normal prep lab dilution of white glue is one part water to two parts glue.) Rarely, a specimen cannot be dried without it crumbling, and white glue is the only reasonable answer. In my experience, white glue is messy and never looks good when the specimen is fully-prepared.

A much better material for bone is a polyvinyl butyral plastic such as Butvar-76, but that material is hard to find in small quantities. I have used this plastic, dissolved in acetone, for many types of fossils. (I have used it successfully on Silurian-age shales with brachiopods, for example.) It penetrates well, and in the proper dilution it produces a "damp-looking" finish with no gloss.

Butvar-76 (but not other Butvar varieties) is also soluble in alcohol. (I assume that is denatured alcohol that you can buy in gallon cans.) I have never tried this solution for consolidation. The alcohol takes considerably longer to boil off the treated specimen.

So, what works best? I recommend a solution of Duco Cement (clear, like model airplane glue) in acetone.

In a pinch, you can use a styrene plastic such as styrofoam dissolved in acetone. (I am not recommending this as I have no experience with styrene plastic. It is a tip I picked up years ago, but never needed to try.)

Dilution? Start with a tube of glue dissolved in about eight ounces of acetone in a glass jar. Shake well.

Adjust the dilution with more acetone until, after shaking, the tiniest air bubbles are just slightly retarded in their rise to the surface.

I usually heat specimens with an infra-red lamp to drive off moisture just before dipping the fossil. I do this with all sorts of fossils, and have never had one damaged by the heating. The untreated specimen is always at least as wet at the relative humidity of the air around it, I suppose. (A microwave oven may be as effective, but I've only dried glass beads for my air-abrasive unit.)

Do NOT heat the acetone solution directly. The acetone solution will get warm after dipping a number of heated fossils. You must have good ventilation to deal with the fumes!

I use a long-jawed forceps -- ten-inch tweezers, really -- to dip and/or retreive the fossils from the jar.

Ideally, you would submerge the dry specimen in this consolidant for a brief time (say 15-30 seconds, or until the specimen stops fizzing). Set each wet specimen aside to dry on cardboard (I use beer-flats).

For a specimen too thick to be submerged, you can use a turkey-baster to flood the difficult areas. I treated an adult mammoth tibia that, because of its size, I dried in the Florida sun, then used the baster to pump consolidant into every opening of the bone.

I use a RubberMaid-type cake-pan to hold the consolidant for this soaking step - that plastic seems to be impervious to the acetone. Get 'em at your local dollar-store.

Acetone evaporates very quickly. Replenish the consolidant mixture with a bit of acetone if you are using it on many specimens. Store it in a tightly sealed glass jar. Even if some acetone evaporates away between uses (it always does, it seems), you can reconstitute the solution by replacing the acetone.

Acetone is a nasty solvent. The fumes are explosive. The fumes are toxic. The liquid penetrates the skin-blood barrier. It's best to use gloves. Use in a well-ventilated area.

--------------Harry Pristis

Harry how hot do the specimins need to be? im confused, is the heating of the nessasary?

[Ronbo]

Well ventilated area, away from ANY source of combustion!

Acetone vapor can not only knock you out, but can form an explosive atmosphere. It is possible to die stoned off your gourd and on fire. Be very careful.

Dont want to have a Richard Pryor episode you bet I`ll do it outside and away fro any heat source and for sure not let the kids get around it,dont want something fun to turn into something I wish I had never started,

I also have this thing that looks like a stingray barb ora catfish spine, its small and looks like a jigsaw blade, and it is complete, I had wondered about keeping it in a testtube suspended in some sort of liquid, has anyone ever done a fossil like that? I was thinking the testube because the curve of the glass adds some magnification and you can really see the details in it, Right now I have it in a water bottle full of water to keep it from getting chipped up or even broke..I hadnt thought of keeping it like that till John and his crew told me that was a good way to get it home..Thanks John..

This is a very interesting topic to me and I sure appreciate all the typing and info ya`ll are sharing here..

Ron

[lawooten]

Gosh! That's great! What sort of whales? . . . toothed whales? . . . baleen whales?

You're on the right track with the Butvar-76. Tracer's link provides interesting information on "white glue" and Duco Cement, but nothing about polyvinyl butyral (Butvar-76). But then, the info in the article is as much as 38 years old (1970 according to the citation). A lot has changed. By 1984, Butvar-76 was the "preferred consolidant" at the Florida State Museum (huge vertebrate collection).

I don't recall seeing the images you mention -- maybe they were too large for me to open.

Good luck with your project!

Harry,

I am not sure if they are toothed whales? . . . Baleen whales but you know we only found one whale tooth throughout the area. There is a member who has said he will take a look at some of the inner ears and could passable id them for me but I need to get some pics together with different angles to him. I need to make myself do that today as a matter of fact. Will keep you posted as to type if you are interested?

[MikeD]

I am liking Harrys glue thing seems to be the easiest and effective way of consolidating them, now the acetone would be available where? and it fizzes lol might be an outside project, lol

You can get acetone at the Home Depot, Lowes, etc. where all of the other cans of chemicals are. Definitely an outside project. If you want to know what it would be like inside, walk into a nail salon.

[lawooten]

I have another question for you guys. Some of the whale verts have a green algae coating on them and saying that what would be an ideal solvent to soak them in before using Butvar? Alcohol is water based yes so it is not an option now Acetone is not a water based solvent so maybe I could soak them in Acetone and if so for how long? But would the Acetone take care of the algae is my question them the time limit.

[Auspex]

I have another question for you guys. Some of the whale verts have a green algae coating on them and saying that what would be an ideal solvent to soak them in before using Butvar? Alcohol is water based yes so it is not an option now Acetone is not a water based solvent so maybe I could soak them in Acetone and if so for how long? But would the Acetone take care of the algae is my question them the time limit.

I don't know of anything that will "dissolve" algae. Sounds like a job for a soft scrub brush and a dishpan full of 10% bleach solution. Then rinse-rinse-rinse and begin the drying process.

[mommabetts]

I want to thank everyone for the valuable information that you have shared with us here.

[Pristiformes]

I don't know of anything that will "dissolve" algae. Sounds like a job for a soft scrub brush and a dishpan full of 10% bleach solution. Then rinse-rinse-rinse and begin the drying process.

I'd be a little reluctant to immerse the fossils in a bleach solution, unless they were not highly prized ones. Bleach steals CaCO3 (calcium carbonate) from stuff like bone, and although I'm not sure if it would effect fossils in the same way, I'd be suspicius that it might damage them a little. Instead, I suggest using H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide) on the fossils, but first scrub them (lightly) with some mildly abrasive instrument such as an old toothbrush and dish detergent (in warm water). Then, purchase some H2O2 from the local drug store or wallyworld in 3% solution for use as a topical antimicrobial. Soak them in it for several hours but check it every once in a while. Hydrogen peroxide only attacks proteins (such as algal proteins) and the 3% solution should not damage your mineralized fossils (or even if they had some bone still) at all. I'm not sure how big your fossils are or how much liquid it would need to immerse them, but you have some options. You can buy enough H2O2 to completely immerse them, or you can dilute it with tap water to a lower concentration till it covers them and just leave it in for a few more hours, or, you can partially immerse them in the 3% solution and cover the remainder of the fossil with an old rag or towel soaked in the same solution. It works fine to just cover them with an old rag/shirt/towel soaked in the solution, but just turn the fossils over once or twice to ensure an even distribution.

With all that said, I wouldn't count on any solution to remove the algae as much as a careful scrubbing could do.

Whatever you choose to do, the best of luck to you!

Jason

[Harry Pristis]

Harry how hot do the specimins need to be? im confused, is the heating of the nessasary?

Not essential, just more effective. I think that your micro-vertebrates are pretty dry, but no more dry than the relative humidity at which they're stored. You probably won't have problems if you don't drive off moisture from them.

As to how hot you should make them, remember that I am using an infra-red lamp which provides penetrating heat. For the mineralized fossils I prepare, I have never made one "too hot" -- too hot to handle casually, yes. But I've never damaged one with heat (and I watch for that). I suggest that if you heat the micro-verts to the point that you smell burning hair, that's too hot!

Many of the fossils that are discussed here on the forum have some residual moisture internally. Bones may trap moisture in their cancellous structure, though the surface may appear dry. I'm talking gross moisture as well as interstitial water.

A consolidant bath will bring the moisture to the surface of the bone (or tooth) where it appears as a white "blister." After the blister collapses, the white film remains on the surface of the bone. The white film is readily removed, but it is pain if you're treating a number of fossils. It's just not good preparation.

Better to drive off all the moisture, get maximum penetration of the consolidant, and do it without going back to erase white marks.

[lawooten]

I'd be a little reluctant to immerse the fossils in a bleach solution, unless they were not highly prized ones. Bleach steals CaCO3 (calcium carbonate) from stuff like bone, and although I'm not sure if it would effect fossils in the same way, I'd be suspicius that it might damage them a little. Instead, I suggest using H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide) on the fossils, but first scrub them (lightly) with some mildly abrasive instrument such as an old toothbrush and dish detergent (in warm water). Then, purchase some H2O2 from the local drug store or wallyworld in 3% solution for use as a topical antimicrobial. Soak them in it for several hours but check it every once in a while. Hydrogen peroxide only attacks proteins (such as algal proteins) and the 3% solution should not damage your mineralized fossils (or even if they had some bone still) at all. I'm not sure how big your fossils are or how much liquid it would need to immerse them, but you have some options. You can buy enough H2O2 to completely immerse them, or you can dilute it with tap water to a lower concentration till it covers them and just leave it in for a few more hours, or, you can partially immerse them in the 3% solution and cover the remainder of the fossil with an old rag or towel soaked in the same solution. It works fine to just cover them with an old rag/shirt/towel soaked in the solution, but just turn the fossils over once or twice to ensure an even distribution.

With all that said, I wouldn't count on any solution to remove the algae as much as a careful scrubbing could do.

Whatever you choose to do, the best of luck to you!

Jason

I do not think I would use bleach either on any of my fossils but now that you mention it Jason H2O2 was what I used to soak specimens in to eliminate protein matter and the bone stayed intact in the forensic lab at the university. I will try H2O2 diluted then go from there. Thanks Jason