Taffie Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 Oligocene - Chandler Bridge Formation. Thought it may be a thresher, what do ya think? Thanks for taking a look. Taffie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gizmo Posted April 7, 2013 Share Posted April 7, 2013 Looks like it to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffie Posted April 7, 2013 Author Share Posted April 7, 2013 Looks like it to me. Yea!!! Thanks Gizmo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixgill pete Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 For sure, probably Alopias superciliosus. Bulldozers and dirt Bulldozers and dirt behind the trailer, my desert Them red clay piles are heaven on earth I get my rocks off, bulldozers and dirt Patterson Hood; Drive-By Truckers May 2016 May 2012 Aug 2013, May 2016, Apr 2020 Oct 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffie Posted April 8, 2013 Author Share Posted April 8, 2013 For sure, probably Alopias superciliosus. Thanks Don. I've had a chance to go hunting a couple of times lately and had a little luck. Thanks for looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hieronymus Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 (edited) For sure, probably Alopias superciliosus. I disagree. Look at how broad the crown of the tooth of the OP is. Alopias superciliosus has very narrow crowns, unlike this one. Recent superciliosus: On top of that, I'm not quite sure about the presence of the extant superciliosus all the way back to the Oligocene? The only ones I know are Alopias latidens (broad) and exigua (narrow) from the Oligocene. http://users.skynet.be/somniosus/oligocene_Alopiidae.htm That's why I tend to call this one Alopias latidens, or atleast something more closely related to latidens than to exigua or superciliosus. However, recent finds suggest possible additional species of Alopias, somewhere in the Miocene (perhaps also Oligocene?). These examples are broad as well, but far larger than latidens, while having a totally different shape as Alopias grandis. Currently, these examples are just called Alopias sp. Just some food for thought :-) Edited April 8, 2013 by Hieronymus http://rhaetianlorraine.webs.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffie Posted April 8, 2013 Author Share Posted April 8, 2013 Thank you for your response. It certainly does look like the Alopias latidens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowsharks Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 Yep, definitely thresher. Could it be Alopias hermani? I'm not an expert on the formation your specimen came from, but I've seen other folks refer to similar looking/size threshers as A. hermani. Daryl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixgill pete Posted April 8, 2013 Share Posted April 8, 2013 latidens is Miocene/Pliocene. I was guessing superciliosus because it is known from some Oligocene locations. Here in my part of NC, we find a narrower from of thresher in the Oligocene Trent and Belgrade formations, even one with minute cusplets that is describes as Alopias sp. from one location and superciliosus from another. However I think Daryl may have it correct with A. hermani. Bulldozers and dirt Bulldozers and dirt behind the trailer, my desert Them red clay piles are heaven on earth I get my rocks off, bulldozers and dirt Patterson Hood; Drive-By Truckers May 2016 May 2012 Aug 2013, May 2016, Apr 2020 Oct 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hieronymus Posted April 9, 2013 Share Posted April 9, 2013 latidens is Miocene/Pliocene. I was guessing superciliosus because it is known from some Oligocene locations. Here in my part of NC, we find a narrower from of thresher in the Oligocene Trent and Belgrade formations, even one with minute cusplets that is describes as Alopias sp. from one location and superciliosus from another. However I think Daryl may have it correct with A. hermani. Alopias latidens is definitely present in the Oligocene, as it is in the Miocene. Pliocene presence is quite unsure. Here are some references: http://shark-references.com/literature/listBySpecies/185 As I said, superciliosus is an extant species that also occurs in the Pliocene, but is not known from the Oligocene or Miocene(?). That would be it's predecessor A. exigua. Alopias hermani is, as far as I know only known from the Eocene according to literature. I do see a link there with A. latidens, but not stratigraphically. Point is that the tooth of the the OP is broad shaped. Exit superciliosus and exigua. It's from the Oligocene, exit superciliosus and hermani or other Alopids such as Usakias wardi. No sidecusps, so again exit Usakias wardi or Trigonotodus alteri. That leaves us with latidens and grandis of the Alopid species that are known/described from the Oligocene and have broad crowns and no sidecusps. Alopias/Trigonotodus grandis has teeth that are far more distally inclined and tend to be larger. Exit grandis. What remains? Alopias latidens... what I know as latidens has the same characteristics as the tooth of the OP. Plus, it adds up with the stratigraphical occurrence of the species... Of course, you may have read other papers and books than I have, or held other teeth :-). If you have, please cite the references, I'd be most interested. I'm very interested in any literature references of superciliosus in the Oligocene though (not that it matters for the determination of this tooth, since it has narrow crowns). http://rhaetianlorraine.webs.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudduck Posted April 11, 2013 Share Posted April 11, 2013 Nice Find! Taffie! Question, do I see slight serrations?! It's are to tell with the photo, but it appears there are very slight serrations on your tooth. Keep in mind, some Threshers will have slight serrations which is very rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffie Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 Nice Find! Taffie! Question, do I see slight serrations?! It's are to tell with the photo, but it appears there are very slight serrations on your tooth. Keep in mind, some Threshers will have slight serrations which is very rare. I was thinking that the edge of the tooth was just chipped but I will take a better picture tomorrow out in the sunshine, if the sun shines tomorrow. Thanks for taking a look, Mudduck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffie Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 I was thinking that the edge of the tooth was just chipped but I will take a better picture tomorrow out in the sunshine, if the sun shines tomorrow. Thanks for taking a look, Mudduck. Hope this picture is a little better. Not sure about any serrations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudduck Posted April 12, 2013 Share Posted April 12, 2013 Thanks Taffie, No, not what I thought I saw. There is no pattern. Just slightly worn. I did see a serrated thresher recently and thought this might be the case as well. Still an AWESOME FIND! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffie Posted April 12, 2013 Author Share Posted April 12, 2013 Thanks Taffie, No, not what I thought I saw. There is no pattern. Just slightly worn. I did see a serrated thresher recently and thought this might be the case as well. Still an AWESOME FIND! Thanks for taking another look, Mudduck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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