whowat13 Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 I have in my posession, two fossilized giant salamander vertibrae. I found them in the Peace River, and was wondering about the scarcity of the material. Any help would be appreciated. I will post pictures of them if requested. -Bill H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 My sense is that such are not at all common from the Peace River (most giant salamander fossils are found in Eurasia). "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyc Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 I'd like to see pics! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whowat13 Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 OK... I will have to post them tomorrow though, because I forgot my digital camera adaptor cable. I am currently at the North American Paleontological Convention, and can't just run home (3 hrs away) to get it. I will find one to buy tomorrow though. -Bill H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRK Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Why don't you just ask while you are there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whowat13 Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 Just got back from a little walk (found a store near my hotel that had what I needed)... So... I will attach the photos to this comment. There are 4 different views of the two verts. PRK - I just figured I would ask about scarcity on this forum tonight because I forgot to ask the person who told me what they were today... Enjoy... -Bill H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickNC Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 I think something added to the photos for scale may be helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whowat13 Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 Sorry about the scale issue... The larger one measures about 3/4 of an inch across, and the smaller one is about 5/8 of an inch across. I tried taking the pictures on a lined sheet of paper, but the flash washed out the lines. -Bill H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Dente Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 I did some very rough measurements of your larger vertebra. If it is .75 inches across at the widest then the main part (excluding processes) of the vertebra is around 9.4 millimeters long. That is similar to the length of a Siren lacertina (Greater siren) vertebra posted on the Florida Museum webpage (around 10 millimeters long). Greater sirens are found as fossil and modern components of Florida streams. I don't know how rare fossils ones are. There are fossil Hellbender vertebra found in Tennessee (Miocene) but they are a little longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FossilDAWG Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 The processes on those seem very delicate. It's amazing they survived being tumbled around in gravel beds. Given the mix of ages found in the Peace River, do you have any idea how old these vertebrae are? Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whowat13 Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 They are probably somewhere in the Pliocene/Pleistocene age range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digit Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 Giant salamander you say? To my novice eye (and even more novice brain taking up residence just behind those novice eyes) I would have said snake vertebrae. I'm pretty sure snake verts have that ball-and-socket connection between them so that's what I would have called it had I pulled it from my sifting screen. Can somebody (with actual knowledge) let me know if other reptiles/amphibians have this type of vertebrae? Cheers. -Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgcox Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Looks like snake vertebrae to me also Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Dente Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Giant salamander you say? To my novice eye (and even more novice brain taking up residence just behind those novice eyes) I would have said snake vertebrae. I'm pretty sure snake verts have that ball-and-socket connection between them so that's what I would have called it had I pulled it from my sifting screen. Can somebody (with actual knowledge) let me know if other reptiles/amphibians have this type of vertebrae? Cheers. -Ken A few types of salamanders have ball and socket vertebrae (opisthocoelus) but most have concave surfaces on both sides (amphicoelus) like the ones in post #6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 A few types of salamanders have ball and socket vertebrae (opisthocoelus) but most have concave surfaces on both sides (amphicoelus) like the ones in post #6. Yes, the posted images of the vertebrae in question seem to be 'double socket' types. "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcoSr Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Definitely salamander, not snake. Marco Sr. "Any day that you can fossil hunt is a great day." My family fossil website Some Of My Shark, Ray, Fish And Other Micros My Extant Shark Jaw Collection Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digit Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Very interesting. Now I'll have to sort through my bowl of bits and check the vertebrae I've pulled from the Peace and check both sides to see if I've got any salamander as well. It would be cool if some of my snake verts 'morphed' into salamander upon closer inspection. Thanks for the education (this Forum's primary mission). -Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 I would say those are rare, but probably not unique. That's just based on a few years of seeing everyone's finds in Peace river trip reports and not seeing any others that I recall. Found this article that I thought was interesting too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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