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Ordovician Mystery - Utica Shale


Fossildude19

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Hello all,

Have a bit of a mystery here. Found a few of these items while going through the shale finds from a trip to the Utica Shale of New York - near Little Falls.

Not sure what they are. Cephalopod? Conularid? Hyolith? I am stumped.

post-2806-0-07249300-1411612787_thumb.jp

post-2806-0-97711900-1411612809_thumb.jp

also, a smaller one on a different slab:

post-2806-0-07211700-1411612837_thumb.jp

It doesn't look like any of the other cephalopods I found there - there is one in the middle of the plate that has some of these on it.

post-2806-0-96837100-1411612769_thumb.jp

Anyone else have any ideas?

Thanks in advance for looking.

Regards,

    Tim    -  VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER

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Strange stuff Tim.

Could pic #3 be the underside of a Trilo?

Pics #1-#2 I've never seen anything like that. It looks like a soft tissue preservation but with a semi hard shell (similar to a shrimp). Very weird.....

~Charlie~

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Strange stuff Tim.

Could pic #3 be the underside of a Trilo?

Pics #1-#2 I've never seen anything like that. It looks like a soft tissue preservation but with a semi hard shell (similar to a shrimp). Very weird.....

Thanks, Charlie.

I don't think trilo on pic 3 - very similar if not exactly the same as the larger ones.

Regards,

    Tim    -  VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER

   MOTM.png.61350469b02f439fd4d5d77c2c69da85.png      PaleoPartner.png.30c01982e09b0cc0b7d9d6a7a21f56c6.png.a600039856933851eeea617ca3f2d15f.png     Postmaster1.jpg.900efa599049929531fa81981f028e24.jpg    VFOTM.png.f1b09c78bf88298b009b0da14ef44cf0.png  VFOTM  --- APRIL - 2015  

__________________________________________________
"In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks."

John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~   ><))))( *>  About Me      

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Might be conularids? Not sure if I see the zigzag lines on the small one (resolution not good enough) but I notice there are 4 'strands' visible.

Edited by Wrangellian
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The tube like structure is from a Sphenothallus. I have found them in the Ordovician Collingwood fm. at Bowmanville Quarry and in the Silurian Eramosa fm. Wiarton Qy.

I believe they lasted into the Pennsylvanian age. Here is a picture of a large colony.

post-296-0-55302200-1411619643_thumb.jpg An artist rendition of the living worm tube. post-296-0-18324600-1411619964_thumb.jpg

Edited by fossilcrazy
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The tube like structure is from a Sphenothallus. I have found them in the Ordovician Collingwood fm. at Bowmanville Quarry and in the Silurian Eramosa fm. Wiarton Qy.

I believe they lasted into the Pennsylvanian age. Here is a picture of a large colony.

Thank you, John!

I had no idea this was a possibility.

Regards,

    Tim    -  VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER

   MOTM.png.61350469b02f439fd4d5d77c2c69da85.png      PaleoPartner.png.30c01982e09b0cc0b7d9d6a7a21f56c6.png.a600039856933851eeea617ca3f2d15f.png     Postmaster1.jpg.900efa599049929531fa81981f028e24.jpg    VFOTM.png.f1b09c78bf88298b009b0da14ef44cf0.png  VFOTM  --- APRIL - 2015  

__________________________________________________
"In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks."

John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~   ><))))( *>  About Me      

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Whoa... that is a weird creature. Is it related to coral? Glad you posted about this Tim, I found one or two of those as well.

-Dave

__________________________________________________

Geologists on the whole are inconsistent drivers. When a roadcut presents itself, they tend to lurch and weave. To them, the roadcut is a portal, a fragment of a regional story, a proscenium arch that leads their imaginations into the earth and through the surrounding terrain. - John McPhee

If I'm going to drive safely, I can't do geology. - John McPhee

Check out my Blog for more fossils I've found: http://viewsofthemahantango.blogspot.com/

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It appears (from what little I have found online), that they are of unknown affiliation, (problematica) with possible links to conulariids, or possibly annelids.

LINK.

from the above link:

"Recent speculation on the phylogenetic relationships of Sphenothallus Hall, 1847 has focused on two alternatives: (1) affinity with hydrozoan or scyphozoan cnidarians, or (2) affinity with annelids or other ‘worms’."

    Tim    -  VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER

   MOTM.png.61350469b02f439fd4d5d77c2c69da85.png      PaleoPartner.png.30c01982e09b0cc0b7d9d6a7a21f56c6.png.a600039856933851eeea617ca3f2d15f.png     Postmaster1.jpg.900efa599049929531fa81981f028e24.jpg    VFOTM.png.f1b09c78bf88298b009b0da14ef44cf0.png  VFOTM  --- APRIL - 2015  

__________________________________________________
"In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks."

John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~   ><))))( *>  About Me      

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Jellyfish and worms - nature's catch-all for problematica. :P

Regards,

    Tim    -  VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER

   MOTM.png.61350469b02f439fd4d5d77c2c69da85.png      PaleoPartner.png.30c01982e09b0cc0b7d9d6a7a21f56c6.png.a600039856933851eeea617ca3f2d15f.png     Postmaster1.jpg.900efa599049929531fa81981f028e24.jpg    VFOTM.png.f1b09c78bf88298b009b0da14ef44cf0.png  VFOTM  --- APRIL - 2015  

__________________________________________________
"In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks."

John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~   ><))))( *>  About Me      

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terrific find Tim, hope to hear more about it... :popcorn:

"Your serpent of Egypt is bred now of your mud by the operation of your sun; so is your crocodile." Lepidus

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Thanks for posting this, Tim. I also found one of these:

post-6366-0-56619000-1411699486_thumb.jpg post-6366-0-87154400-1411699454_thumb.jpg

and Dave gave me one that he found too:

post-6366-0-37560300-1411699473_thumb.jpg

I think these are the same as yours, Tim. Let me know if you think they are something else. They resemble the nautiloids, but I don't think that's what they are.

Thank you, John, for the Sphenothallus ID. That's an interesting critter.

Mike

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Interesting for sure... That's what I like about the Paleozoic (and earlier), so many problematic things, it seems to never end!

Great - another item for the collection 'bucket list'

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I've found similar fossils from the same Little Falls locality. At least one I have is obscured by iron oxide, so I don't have the level of detail you have, but the exact same shape & size. Interesting stuff...

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Thanks for posting this, Tim. I also found one of these:

attachicon.gifLittle Falls unknown2a.jpg attachicon.giflf micro 5.jpg

and Dave gave me one that he found too:

attachicon.gifLittle Falls unknown1b.jpg

I think these are the same as yours, Tim. Let me know if you think they are something else. They resemble the nautiloids, but I don't think that's what they are.

Thank you, John, for the Sphenothallus ID. That's an interesting critter.

Mike

They certainly look the same as my examples, to me, at least, Mike.

Regards,

    Tim    -  VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER

   MOTM.png.61350469b02f439fd4d5d77c2c69da85.png      PaleoPartner.png.30c01982e09b0cc0b7d9d6a7a21f56c6.png.a600039856933851eeea617ca3f2d15f.png     Postmaster1.jpg.900efa599049929531fa81981f028e24.jpg    VFOTM.png.f1b09c78bf88298b009b0da14ef44cf0.png  VFOTM  --- APRIL - 2015  

__________________________________________________
"In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks."

John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~   ><))))( *>  About Me      

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Here is a small Sphenothallus colony I found at Bowmanville Quarry. The Collingwood Shale relates close in age to the Utica Shale.

post-296-0-46368600-1411857059_thumb.jpg

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That picture really helps to pin down the ID. Thanks for posting it!

-Dave

__________________________________________________

Geologists on the whole are inconsistent drivers. When a roadcut presents itself, they tend to lurch and weave. To them, the roadcut is a portal, a fragment of a regional story, a proscenium arch that leads their imaginations into the earth and through the surrounding terrain. - John McPhee

If I'm going to drive safely, I can't do geology. - John McPhee

Check out my Blog for more fossils I've found: http://viewsofthemahantango.blogspot.com/

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