izak_ Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 Hi! I have a couple of questions and things, so here they are! I always wondered why museums and larger collections often have labelled numbers on them... but now I know. Apparently it is really important to catalogue them... but how do I do it? What do I need? I don't know much about it, so any help would be appreciated! Izak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Andy- Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 This is something I've often wondered myself. I am seriously considering labeling mine too. Maybe I will go by my most common fossils first. Ammonites = A Cleoniceras = A1 Ammolite = A2 Psiloceras = A3 Hoplites = A4 etc... My 2nd most common fossils would be crocodiles. Crocodilians = B Borealosuchus jaw = B1 Elosuchus Tooth = B2 Elosuchus scute = B3 etc... Looking forward to meeting my fellow Singaporean collectors! Do PM me if you are a Singaporean, or an overseas fossil-collector coming here for a holiday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troodon Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 Lots of ways to do this. I do something similar to what Andy does. I use alphanumeric labeling ID. Example D = dinosaur, followed by a number for Species, then a lower case letter for a specific specimen. All the detail information is on my excel worksheet which contains everything I know about the specimen. D1a Albertosaurus sarcophagus tooth from Judith River Fm. D1b A. sarcophagus tooth from Dinosaur Park Fm. D1c A. sarcophagus foot claw Judith River I use tiny round self stick permanent labels to mark the ID on the specimen. Others follow this method which is pinned under fossil preparation http://www.thefossilforum.com/index.php?/topic/43063-assembling-an-archival-marking-kit-for-paleontological-specimens/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordTrilobite Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 Many have their own system. I guess you can choose what you think is important to have on a label and make your own system. Here's what I do: I have an abbreviation for the location where the fossil was found, the year it was found, and then the number of the fossil from that location. If the specimen comes in pieces, I will name those A, B and so on. An example: HKK2009015 is the number I have for an Orthocone piece. HKK - It was found in Hällekis Kinnekulle, Sweden. 2009 - It was found in 2009 015 - It's the 15th fossil I number from that year from that location. It comes in one piece, so I didn't add an A or B. Some things that could be important that I don't have on my labeling is the formation or age. I don't put genus or species on the labeling as those can sometimes change over time. Olof Moleman AKA Lord Trilobite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IonRocks Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 I'm rather lazy when it come to my rather small collection, but I have index cards in a box, which have all the information I know about each specimen (including "notes", for example There is some restoration here and here and there or Self Collected etc) The specimens themselves have a tiny number (on a tiny sticker) which corresponds with the card, and because I started doing this in the beginning of my collection, all my specimens are ordered by the date they were obtained Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 It is tempting to make up elaborate codes when labeling fossils in a collection, but I would personally advice against it. A label is typically just an identifier linking the actual specimen to a record in a database. So the key is to keep it simple. For example, including a 'C' for your crinoids means trouble once you collect your first ceratite, conodont, coprolite, cystoid, crustacean, .... . Or maybe your crinoid was wrongly identified and turns out to be a hyolite? Will you change the label? Tricky. In the end, the C serves no purpose other than adding complexity and confusion. This is how I started out: FPL1 or FPL0001 (the zeroes do not really matter). FPL are my initials, stating the specimen is in my collection, and the 1 is just a serial number. So the second fossil to add is FPL2, regardless of it being a jurassic ammonite or a devonian trilobite. It is important to write that code directly on the specimens, or include the code in or on the box, ziplock, or whatever you use to store the fossil in. Code and fossil should be together for life, happily ever after. Then, in your database, include a single record with the same code. In this record you store all the info, including location, age, identification, etc. When some of this info needs updating, the code remains the same. That is in my experience the basic setup of a good system. All the rest (for example a fancy label with basic info to put along the fossil in your showcase) is secondary. My 2 cents. I worte some other thoughts on compiling a collection down here: link Paleo database, information and community Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossil Claw Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 Is there a specific brand of labels you use? Lots of ways to do this. I do something similar to what Andy does. I use alphanumeric labeling ID. Example D = dinosaur, followed by a number for Species, then a lower case letter for a specific specimen. All the detail information is on my excel worksheet which contains everything I know about the specimen. D1a Albertosaurus sarcophagus tooth from Judith River Fm. D1b A. sarcophagus tooth from Dinosaur Park Fm. D1c A. sarcophagus foot claw Judith River I use tiny round self stick permanent labels to mark the ID on the specimen. Others follow this method which is pinned under fossil preparation http://www.thefossilforum.com/index.php?/topic/43063-assembling-an-archival-marking-kit-for-paleontological-specimens/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troodon Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 Is there a specific brand of labels you use? I use these and they work quite well, its simple for my applications. Come off without a problem and any residue easily removable. Need a fine point pen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 LINK to more information. Sort through the info, and choose what works best for you. Regards, Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paleoflor Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 I fully agree with Fred when it comes to specimen numbering. This older topic might be interesting too. Searching for green in the dark grey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izak_ Posted October 7, 2015 Author Share Posted October 7, 2015 Thanks very much for the information everyone! I will keep in mind what everyone has said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNCollector Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 There are lots of ways. Some people use a journal, some print out little index cards with the info on them. My company sells a software for it if you are interested. The Mac beta version is the only current release. But I have a beta Windows and Linux version that can be bought. You have to email support... Link to site: http://paleoarchiver.com/index.html I used to use a digital note application that was pretty effective for smaller collections. I would type the information into the notes and generate a tag that I would label the fossil with. It is a simple and free method, but can get hard to navigate when there are hundreds of fossils to catalogue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZiggieCie Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 OK, here is my 2cents worth: I collect Ordovician to Mississippian marine fossils; they mostly are in a matrix of Limestone, Dolomite, Shale, etc. Also, have many that are free of matrix. If the matrix is smooth or the fossil is smooth and large enough and not going to be a part of a group, example, (20 Brachiopods, all the same species) the group fossils will be in a box or container with a label with a catalog number. Individual fossils or matrix pieces will have a catalog number written on them with permanent India ink and a staedtler refillable art pen. On rougher pieces, I will use white artist acrylic Gesso and a small brush and put a small white strip that I can put a catalog number on. My catalog numbers are alpha numerical; Z-1001 Z-1002 and so on. They give no other info than the catalog number this is where the magic happens. My database is a relational DB built with Microsoft Access. Here I have all of the information I wish to have for each numbered fossil. Common type name, Phylum, Class, etc. / Storage box ID, Nature of specimen, Date coll, Fossil ID resource, Field notes, prep work, photo,/ Location and stratigraphy, site notes, system-period, Series formation, age, etc. Here is a look at a full form with all of the info; the location is there but it is now a housing development. Link: (long/full form) 01 Sample - Ziggies Fossil Collection main DB full record.pdf From my DB I can print out full sheets as shown or short form with some vital info to put with the fossil. 3 per sheet. Link: (Short form) 02 Sample - Ziggies Fossil Colection main DB short card (2).pdf I also have a series of forms that I use with fossil from one area, these I pre fill with most of the info for an area, such as a quarry with location and stratigraphy printed on the form. The blank spaces I fill by hand, as I work on the fossil, ID, size and other pertinent info I find and then can transfer it to the DB later but I have the vital info with the fossil. Link: (pre printed for fossil) fossil fill out form -blank 10-15.pdf With my DB, I can sort fossils by type, location, age, any way I want or need. Building a fossil DB in Access is not a job to be taken lightly, it is a major project, and these forms are a lot of work, but can be customized. Form for fossil box record and tracking to share.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izak_ Posted October 8, 2015 Author Share Posted October 8, 2015 Thanks so much everyone! Everyone is being really helpful Oh, and TNCollector, thanks for the website! Do you think its worth getting on a mac?.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrangellian Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 OK, I may as well add my system even though it's already described elsewhere (but so is everyone else's!) The only differences from others described here: My numbering system uses a 2-letter code for different sites followed by a number from 1-to-open-ended. Eg. "Tz" for Mt Tzuhalem, or "HR" for the roadcuts on Herd Road. I mark the fossil, eg. "Tz1" then enter the number in pencil in a spiral bound notebook with any pertinent details for the fossil (date found, precise location, what it was found in association with, etc). I don't bother with all the taxonomic details except for what I think it is, as specifically as possible. Eg. "bivalve" if that's all I can tell, or full genus-species if I know it confidently. As already pointed out, this is not as important as location. Let the pro's figure out what species it is and what it's related to. My sites may be somewhat arbitrary in how they are delineated (should I consider each roadcut on Herd Road to be a separate site?) but the precise location details are entered in the book so it doesn't matter much. I just call them all Herd Rd (HR) and then state which outcrop each fossil was found at. For fossils bought/traded from elsewhere, I have not begun to catalogue them yet, but if I do I would probably come up with a different system so they can be easily separated from my local Island stuff. So far it will have to suffice to keep with each fossil a label containing all known info for it. I haven't bothered digitizing my info yet either, but if I did, I guess for me the easiest and cheapest computer-based 'notebook' would be a simple text or rtf file, for universal access if I should donate everything to the museum for instance, and for ease of updating/adding to it. The important thing is to record the info and not take up too much time doing so, and not to look snazzy. Be sure to have a backup copy somewhere too. I use a Uni-ball Signo white pen to put my numbers on dark rock, (shale, which most of my local stuff is), and the already-mentioned archival black pen for the light-colored matrix. I believe the white pen is an archival (ie non-fading) gel ink, but it has lately started to gum up and won't write as well as it did for the first few hundred specimens. I will need to either find a different brand (though finding this one was difficult enough), or go to using archival white acrylic or some such, and apply with a small quill or brush. Or I might try and buy a new Signo and try to prevent the ink from drying up somehow, as that is what seems to have happened. On top of both black and white specimen numbers I will be putting a clear protective coat, but what kind I haven't figure out yet, so I haven't begun to do this either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrangellian Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 I always have good intentions of making it short and sweet but it rarely ends up that way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZiggieCie Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 A link to labeling fossils and other collectables. http://www.collectioncare.org/numbering-museum-collections How to handle and store your collectables. http://www.collectioncare.org/storage-guidelines http://icom.museum/fileadmin/user_upload/pdf/Guidelines/CIDOC_Fact_Sheet_No2.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNCollector Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 Thanks so much everyone! Everyone is being really helpful Oh, and TNCollector, thanks for the website! Do you think its worth getting on a mac?.. I wrote the application, so I am biased. But yes I think it is worth it. I have been using it for a long time and it has saved me lots of time and made the cataloging process very simple. The company offers a 7 day refund on the beta version, so you could always try it out and if you don't like it get a refund. It is still undergoing beta testing, so there may be a few bugs here and there but I personally haven't had any issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izak_ Posted October 8, 2015 Author Share Posted October 8, 2015 Wrangellian, Thanks for all that info ZiggieCie, thanks for the links And TNCollector, I will hopefully get it Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeR Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 I am a fan of the simplistic numerical system in ascending order. In addition to that number I attach a locality number so for instance the gastropod Akleistostoma carolinensis floridana from SMR quarry in Sarasota County Florida is No. 9459-1017. The reason behind this is that my labels are relatively simplistic in description on locality in this case only Sarasota County, Florida. No. 9459-1017 Akleistostoma carolinensis floridana (Mansfield, 1930) Upper Pliocene Tamiami Formation Pinecrest Sand Member Sarasota County, Florida The real star of my collection is my Access 2007 database where I can run queries on those numbers as well as any other data field not included on the label. Although the location is captured in the db entry for that specimen number, the locality number allows me to quickly say that it is from SMR Phase 10 (locality 1017) as opposed to SMR Phase 8 (Locality 1016) or APAC (Locality 92) all located in Sarasota County. Mike "A problem solved is a problem caused"--Karl Pilkington "I was dead for millions of years before I was born and it never inconvenienced me a bit." -- Mark Twain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZiggieCie Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 As you can see, everyone has their own way. I believe most museums have their own cataloging systems, especialy since the advent of computers and programers needing jobs. The main point is to have something that someone can figure out after we are gone. Something so that someone can look at one of your fossils and find your record of it; I believe that that is the whole idea. Wether ten fossils or thousands. A trail to where it came from. PS. I use Access 2007 also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrangellian Posted October 16, 2015 Share Posted October 16, 2015 It is tempting to make up elaborate codes when labeling fossils in a collection, but I would personally advice against it. A label is typically just an identifier linking the actual specimen to a record in a database. So the key is to keep it simple. For example, including a 'C' for your crinoids means trouble once you collect your first ceratite, conodont, coprolite, cystoid, crustacean, .... . Or maybe your crinoid was wrongly identified and turns out to be a hyolite? Will you change the label? Tricky. In the end, the C serves no purpose other than adding complexity and confusion. This is how I started out: FPL1 or FPL0001 (the zeroes do not really matter). FPL are my initials, stating the specimen is in my collection, and the 1 is just a serial number. So the second fossil to add is FPL2, regardless of it being a jurassic ammonite or a devonian trilobite. It is important to write that code directly on the specimens, or include the code in or on the box, ziplock, or whatever you use to store the fossil in. Code and fossil should be together for life, happily ever after. Then, in your database, include a single record with the same code. In this record you store all the info, including location, age, identification, etc. When some of this info needs updating, the code remains the same. That is in my experience the basic setup of a good system. All the rest (for example a fancy label with basic info to put along the fossil in your showcase) is secondary. My 2 cents. I worte some other thoughts on compiling a collection down here: link This is a good link. Nice cabinet shown there! I want one like that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izak_ Posted October 17, 2015 Author Share Posted October 17, 2015 Thanks again everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 Thanks Wrangellian! Paleo database, information and community Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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