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Kem Kem Theropod Teeth: what you need to know


Troodon

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Mayhap there was just ALOT of fish to eat there?

It's possible but teeth morphology usually define the primary type of food they consume like Spino teeth are suited for fish. Those other three theropod have meat eating teeth.

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On a related note, is there conclusively only one species of pterosaur from Kem Kem?

It's hard to fathom just one species from the Kem Kem. If you look at other regions multiple pterosaur coexist.
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Mayhap there was just ALOT of fish to eat there?

On a related note, is there conclusively only one species of pterosaur from Kem Kem?

There is indeed a lot of fish. There are different types of gars, giant coelacanths, giant sawfish, several giant lungfish and lots more. Also crocs and turtles.

Here is a paper on some of the fish present at Kem Kem:

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0125786

As far as I know there are two Pterosaurs that are described. Siroccopteryx moroccensis and Alanqa saharica.

Siroccopteryx is and Ornithocheirid and it's teeth are often seen on the market.

Alanqa is an Azhdarchid known only from some fragmentary remains.

Paper: http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0010875

Though some have suggested that there are also Tapejarids and Pteranodontids. But those haven't been described.

Edited by LordTrilobite
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Olof Moleman AKA Lord Trilobite

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As far as I know there are two Pterosaurs that are described. Siroccopteryx moroccensis and Alanqa saharica.

Siroccopteryx is and Ornithocheirid and it's teeth are often seen on the market.

Alanqa is an Azhdarchid known only from some fragmentary remains.

Though some have suggested that there are also Tapejarids and Pteranodontids. But those haven't been described.

Indeed. These are the three most common Kem Kem pterosaur teeth names by dealers:

Siroccopteryx

Anhanguera

Coloborhynchus

Looking forward to meeting my fellow Singaporean collectors! Do PM me if you are a Singaporean, or an overseas fossil-collector coming here for a holiday!

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Wasn't Siroccopteryx once identified as Coloborhynchus but then given it's own genus?

Olof Moleman AKA Lord Trilobite

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I believe so, but Pterosaurs from this region are just as big a mystery as theropods. Need new finds to help clarify what's out there and my guess is that we will uncover numerous species

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...Those other three theropod have meat eating teeth.

So do wolves and bears, neither of which go hungry if fish are available. ;)

"There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant

“Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley

>Paleontology is an evolving science.

>May your wonders never cease!

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So do wolves and bears, neither of which go hungry if fish are available. ;)

True but serrations are needed to cut meat.

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Ouranosaurus is known from Niger right? And wasn't Carcharodontosaurus as well? Does anyone know if those deposits are the same ages as those from Kem Kem? If so, it might just be that most herbivores live further inland.

Olof Moleman AKA Lord Trilobite

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Ouranosaurus is known from Niger right? And wasn't Carcharodontosaurus as well? Does anyone know if those deposits are the same ages as those from Kem Kem? If so, it might just be that most herbivores live further inland.

I believe the Elhraz Formation is a little older than the Kem Kem Beds. However dinosaur remains from Spinosaurus and Carchardontosaurus have been found there and in Egypt. But more herbivores are described from both Niger and Egypt. Could the preservation in the Kem Kem beds have to do with part of it?

Edited by Runner64
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Aptian vs Cenomanian but no reason that family of Dinosaur was not present in the Kem Kem. Preservation might be the answer but with the variety of species found in the Kem Kem you would have expected something to pop up.

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I remember seeing a forum member with an ankylosaur tooth from the Kem Kem Beds. If anyone knows who has that tooth, it would be great if we could add this tooth to the discussion.

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On 10/13/2015 at 3:22 PM, Runner64 said:

I remember seeing a forum member with an ankylosaur tooth from the Kem Kem Beds. If anyone knows who has that tooth, it would be great if we could add this tooth to the discussion.

Good memory, mostly likely my tooth, those were my original optimistic thoughts when I picked up the tooth. The more I looked at I'm not convinced it's Ankylosaurid. Has some features but not sure, its different. Has the center ridge, cusplets around the crown, right size 1" but not there yet.

Update: a crocodylomorph

post-10935-0-60676200-1444765887_thumb.jpg

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Good memory, mostly likely my tooth, those were my original optimistic thoughts when I picked up the tooth. The more I looked at I'm not convinced it's Ankylosaurid. Has some features but not sure, its different. Has the center ridge, cusplets around the crown, right size 1" but not there yet.

attachicon.gifAnkytoothLingual - D215.jpg

Hah! Is there anything you don't have in your collection? It's certainly a really cool tooth. Is there anything else it could be if it's not Ankylosaurid?

Olof Moleman AKA Lord Trilobite

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Nice tooth Troodon! Definitely a tooth from an undescribed dinosaur. Have you tried showing it to anyone to try and narrow it down?

I second what LordTrilobite said, is there anything you don't have?! It seems like you have everything haha. Another candidate is a pachysephalosaur tooth? However the root doesn't really appear to come from a pachysephalosaur. Too fat.

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True but serrations are needed to cut meat.

True that, but they are no handicap for eating fish. It is not possible that the region in question was a constrained habitat, low on edible plants and supporting an 'upside-down' food chain, with the base of the chain in the water?

"There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant

“Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley

>Paleontology is an evolving science.

>May your wonders never cease!

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Hah! Is there anything you don't have in your collection? It's certainly a really cool tooth. Is there anything else it could be if it's not Ankylosaurid?

Yes, really cool why I bought it, an eBay pickup no less. I thought it might be one at first but I hesitate just because I've never seen one from the North African region any age or locality. I would just be happy if it's turns out to be dinosaurian.

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True that, but they are no handicap for eating fish. It is not possible that the region in question was a constrained habitat, low on edible plants and supporting an 'upside-down' food chain, with the base of the chain in the water?

Now that's an interesting thought. Only question I have with that is how would an ecosystem like that provide enough food for sauropods like Rebbachisaurus but no other herbivores? Just curious.

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True that, but they are no handicap for eating fish. It is not possible that the region in question was a constrained habitat, low on edible plants and supporting an 'upside-down' food chain, with the base of the chain in the water?

Anything is possible if it was an upside food chain. I read one wild dinosaur blog that hypothesized the big three theropods fed on Spinosaurs when they came on land since they would be out of their environment and easy prey. Another more realistic one pointed out that it could be due to higher errosional rates of terrestrial deposits in the uplands of the Kem Kem.

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Nice tooth Troodon! Definitely a tooth from an undescribed dinosaur. Have you tried showing it to anyone to try and narrow it down?

I second what LordTrilobite said, is there anything you don't have?! It seems like you have everything haha. Another candidate is a pachysephalosaur tooth? However the root doesn't really appear to come from a pachysephalosaur. Too fat.

I need to show the tooth to David Evans (of the ROM) at the next Tucson show. He knows the region pretty well and might have some thoughts on it. Thanks for the reminder. Agreed don't see Pachy and its a bit early for one but who knows.

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Good memory, mostly likely my tooth, those were my original optimistic thoughts when I picked up the tooth. The more I looked at I'm not convinced it's Ankylosaurid. Has some features but not sure, its different. Has the center ridge, cusplets around the crown, right size 1" but not there yet.

attachicon.gifAnkytoothLingual - D215.jpg

Nice tooth! I've only seen one other. I have a feeling this is not going to be a dinosaur tooth. It reminds me of a Revueltosaurus tooth which was thought to be a ornithischian dinosaur but turned out to be a pseudoschian.

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Okay I got a reply from George Corneille of Fossilgrove. He agreed that the giant rooted tooth I linked in page 1 is a Carch tooth.

Here's another 2 pics of his supposed Deltadromeus tooth and what he said.

post-4888-0-23141700-1444837504_thumb.jpg post-4888-0-49365600-1444837506_thumb.jpg

Here are some pics Andy of a genuine delta tooth.they are narrow and laterally compressed,2 inches to 2 1/2 inches is the maximum size,they are a very gracile tooth compared to carch teeth I spoke to Gabrielle Lyon who actually discovered Deltadromeous and while no skull was ever found with the remains there were 2 types of teeth found these teeth and teeth from rugops primus,she described the teeth as been no bigger than 2 inches

Looking forward to meeting my fellow Singaporean collectors! Do PM me if you are a Singaporean, or an overseas fossil-collector coming here for a holiday!

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Okay I got a reply from George Corneille of Fossilgrove. He agreed that the giant rooted tooth I linked in page 1 is a Carch tooth.

Here's another 2 pics of his supposed Deltadromeus tooth and what he said.

attachicon.gif12165790_10206028435728334_2070084403_n.jpg attachicon.gif12168736_10206028436288348_1171751385_o.jpg

Here are some pics Andy of a genuine delta tooth.they are narrow and laterally compressed,2 inches to 2 1/2 inches is the maximum size,they are a very gracile tooth compared to carch teeth I spoke to Gabrielle Lyon who actually discovered Deltadromeous and while no skull was ever found with the remains there were 2 types of teeth found these teeth and teeth from rugops primus,she described the teeth as been no bigger than 2 inches

I like George, I consider him a friend and I definitely respect his opinion but in this case I have to disagree with him. In my opinion this tooth is a juvenile Carch.

Edited by Dracorex_hogwartsia
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