FosselDumbDumb Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 Hello, Are the two below fossils real? I don't have any info on the fly but the info I have on the lizard is from Odernheim, Pfalz, Germany and that it is a Branchiosauria. Both fossils are absolutely flat with no raised bones or bumps. Also, how can I tell the difference between real or fake fossils in the future? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rustdee Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 Perhaps compare your lizard to the amphibian, Branchiosaur. It looks fairly similar to yours. Beyond that I don't know enough about them to help authenticate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 The skeleton might be Onchiodon ,Sclerocephalus,Archegosaurus,Micromelerpeton.or a number of other "rhachitome" branchiosaurids.A number of ontogenetic("growth") stages of these amphibians were assigned to different taxa .So Permocarboniferous amphibian taxonomy is "in a state of flux" As the Zechstein is a hydrocarbon province and vertebrate fossils figure in its biostratigraphy,it might even be economically sensible to figure these taxa out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snolly50 Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 Rustdee is correct - amphibian, not lizard. "Real," yes. Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, also are remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so. - Douglas Adams, Last Chance to See Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FosselDumbDumb Posted September 18, 2016 Author Share Posted September 18, 2016 3 minutes ago, doushantuo said: The skeleton might be Onchiodon ,Sclerocephalus,or a number of other "rhachitome" branchiosaurids.A number of ontogenetic("growth") stages of these amphibians were assigned to different taxa .So Permocarboniferous amphibian taxonomy is "in a state of flux" 3 minutes ago, snolly50 said: Rustdee is correct - amphibian, not lizard. "Real," yes. So the amphibian fossil is real? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 yes.It looks a lot like any of the taxa figured by ,e.g.,Schoch,Schneider,Werneburg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FosselDumbDumb Posted September 18, 2016 Author Share Posted September 18, 2016 Just now, doushantuo said: yes Thank you! I am a dumb dumb when it comes to this stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 Some fossils do become flat. These are called compression fossils. Often times, in the case of the Branchiosaurs, ... the bones are replaced by carbon films. BTW - I believe both are real. Regards, Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 Am working on the hexapod("fly").Might be a palaeodictyopteran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FosselDumbDumb Posted September 18, 2016 Author Share Posted September 18, 2016 2 minutes ago, Fossildude19 said: Some fossils do become flat. These are called compression fossils. Often times, in the case of the Branchiosaurs, ... the bones are replaced by carbon films. BTW - I believe both are real. Regards, You are great! Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FosselDumbDumb Posted September 18, 2016 Author Share Posted September 18, 2016 2 minutes ago, doushantuo said: Am working on the hexapod("fly").Might be a palaeodictyopteran Thank you!!!! You are great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 Don't thank me yet. I enlarged the fly photo. It appears to me that it may have been enhanced with some paint. Not positive, however. Your best bet, though,... is to look at it through a 20x Loupe, and see if you can see any detail to the body or wings. Or brush strokes. Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 here's the reason why Tim mentioned the wings: bethouxvenationalavehexapoo2008p219.pdf Willi Hennig pioneered the use of cladistics in insect phylogeny,using wing venaton patterns Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FosselDumbDumb Posted September 18, 2016 Author Share Posted September 18, 2016 3 minutes ago, Fossildude19 said: Don't thank me yet. I enlarged the fly photo. It appears to me that it may have been enhanced with some paint. Not positive, however. Your best bet, though,... is to look at it through a 20x Loupe, and see if you can see any detail to the body or wings. Or brush strokes. I am not too broken up about the fly. I was more worried about the amphibian. My understanding is that both are real but the fly may be enhanced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 8 hours ago, FosselDumbDumb said: ... I am a dumb dumb when it comes to this stuff. We all have to start off somewhere. We all were uneducated in fossils when we started. You are educating yourself, which is a smart move, in my opinion. It can be a steep learning curve, but familiarizing yourself with the fossils you are going to purchase is a good method for avoiding most of the pitfalls that go along with fossil collecting from the Internet Formation. Regards, Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triceratops Posted October 5, 2016 Share Posted October 5, 2016 Am I correct in thinking that Branchiosaurs were related to the modern day axolotl, or did they just resemble it? -Lyall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Andy- Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Yes the Branchiosaurus is real. Possibly enhanced with a coating, but real. Looking forward to meeting my fellow Singaporean collectors! Do PM me if you are a Singaporean, or an overseas fossil-collector coming here for a holiday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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