fifbrindacier Posted October 18, 2016 Share Posted October 18, 2016 This post is to share photos of false fossils, even good copies. Here is a site where you can find some http://www.fossiliraptor.be/coupdegueule.htm Like those ones : "On ne voit bien que par le coeur, l'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux." (Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) "We only well see with the heart, the essential is invisible for the eyes." In memory of Doren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ischua Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 The first one almost made me blow a glass of milk out of my nose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifbrindacier Posted October 19, 2016 Author Share Posted October 19, 2016 I am really not an expert, but it did me the same effect. And the crime scene makes me laugh. "On ne voit bien que par le coeur, l'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux." (Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) "We only well see with the heart, the essential is invisible for the eyes." In memory of Doren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevonianDigger Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 https://www.nextnature.net/2009/05/modern-fossils/ Jay A. Wollin Lead Fossil Educator - Penn Dixie Fossil Park and Nature Reserve Hamburg, New York, USA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir.tommy.the.toad Posted October 19, 2016 Share Posted October 19, 2016 6 hours ago, DevonianDigger said: https://www.nextnature.net/2009/05/modern-fossils/ lol well these are kinda fossils now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifbrindacier Posted October 20, 2016 Author Share Posted October 20, 2016 On 19 octobre 2016 at 8:17 AM, DevonianDigger said: https://www.nextnature.net/2009/05/modern-fossils/ On 19 octobre 2016 at 2:47 PM, Sir.tommy.the.toad said: lol well these are kinda fossils now Sure ! "On ne voit bien que par le coeur, l'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux." (Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) "We only well see with the heart, the essential is invisible for the eyes." In memory of Doren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordTrilobite Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 On 19/10/2016 at 0:20 AM, fifbrindacier said: I think this crocodile looks real for the most part. The only thing that looks suspicious is that tip of the snout that looks like it could have been constructed. Olof Moleman AKA Lord Trilobite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifbrindacier Posted October 20, 2016 Author Share Posted October 20, 2016 17 minutes ago, LordTrilobite said: I think this crocodile looks real for the most part. The only thing that looks suspicious is that tip of the snout that looks like it could have been constructed. And the plaster all around it. I think it would be really difficult to move fossilized bones of this size and put them in a hardened plaster with their matrix all together, or even to make plaster hardening around the lot without moving them out of their original position. Or you would have to glue them back one by one. "On ne voit bien que par le coeur, l'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux." (Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) "We only well see with the heart, the essential is invisible for the eyes." In memory of Doren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifbrindacier Posted October 20, 2016 Author Share Posted October 20, 2016 Here are another "crocodiles" with their plaster shells : "On ne voit bien que par le coeur, l'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux." (Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) "We only well see with the heart, the essential is invisible for the eyes." In memory of Doren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordTrilobite Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 49 minutes ago, fifbrindacier said: And the plaster all around it. I think it would be really difficult to move fossilized bones of this size and put them in a hardened plaster with their matrix all together, or even to make plaster hardening around the lot without moving them out of their original position. Or you would have to glue them back one by one. Not really. That plaster jacket looks pretty standard. Doesn't look suspicious at all imo. This looks like a real fossil with possibly only slight touch ups. 44 minutes ago, fifbrindacier said: Here are another "crocodiles" with their plaster shells : The top crocodile looks real as well. Nothing suspicious there. the "croc" on the bottom though, has a completely fake skull. The bones around it may be real but the skull is constructed from random pieces of bone. Olof Moleman AKA Lord Trilobite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgehiker Posted October 20, 2016 Share Posted October 20, 2016 On 2016-10-19 at 0:17 AM, DevonianDigger said: https://www.nextnature.net/2009/05/modern-fossils/ This is the only item that looks legitimate. Lets just hope its not Disco music. Re all the Chinese and Moroccan 'bobbles'. It doesnt matter what is real or not. There is so much wrong information, altered fossils, bogus provenance that the fossils have no credibility. The first thing one asks 'is it real'? That very first thought is why specimens from those countries should be shunned. A fossil without full ducumented info from those countries as to who collected it, 'exact' locale etc is a pretty ornament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifbrindacier Posted October 20, 2016 Author Share Posted October 20, 2016 That's the problem, it discredits all the fossils that the people from those countries honestly collect, and so it also discredits their work. When i was in Morocco, in a souk, i saw numerous sellers of numerous trilobites, that were all in the same position, in the same state of conservation, and had exactly the same presentation, all well polished, astonishing. So i didn't bought one there. "On ne voit bien que par le coeur, l'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux." (Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) "We only well see with the heart, the essential is invisible for the eyes." In memory of Doren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fossiling Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 the trilos in a circle made me paleoLOL! Keep looking! They're everywhere! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifbrindacier Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 5 hours ago, fossiling said: the trilos in a circle made me paleoLOL! The owner of the site called that photo " à la queue leu leu" which means in indian file, word to word : to the tail wolf wolf ("leu" is an ancient word for wolf), i imagine them holding kindly the tail of an inexisting wolf to be in a file and wait kindly to be covered by sediment and fossilized one by one. They must have had a collective hallucination. "On ne voit bien que par le coeur, l'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux." (Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) "We only well see with the heart, the essential is invisible for the eyes." In memory of Doren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdsnl Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 I cannot tell that the shells in matrix are fake. What's the indication? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifbrindacier Posted October 22, 2016 Author Share Posted October 22, 2016 The shells are not fake, what is fake is the matrix and their accumulation. And selling them as if they all have been found like this is a lie to lure the buyer. I don't know why they were presented like this, if it was to hide damaged parts of the shells or for some other reason. "On ne voit bien que par le coeur, l'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux." (Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) "We only well see with the heart, the essential is invisible for the eyes." In memory of Doren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdsnl Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 7 hours ago, fifbrindacier said: The shells are not fake, what is fake is the matrix and their accumulation. And selling them as if they all have been found like this is a lie to lure the buyer. I don't know why they were presented like this, if it was to hide damaged parts of the shells or for some other reason. But did you know from glue marks or because you know that location doesn't have that kind of matrix or such a high concentration of fossils? If I see something like this, how should I determine whether it is real or not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifbrindacier Posted October 23, 2016 Author Share Posted October 23, 2016 The owner of the site from where i quoted those photos says that those shells are real ones and of the same period, but also that almost all the shells of that period are there and that they are glued together on the matrix, that's why i posted this photo on this thread. The price of selling is quite different between a real plate and a fake, even made with real fossils from the same period. So, except if the seller hasn't clean enoughly the excess of glue it would be difficult to determine if it is a real one. "On ne voit bien que par le coeur, l'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux." (Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) "We only well see with the heart, the essential is invisible for the eyes." In memory of Doren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordTrilobite Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 13 hours ago, sdsnl said: But did you know from glue marks or because you know that location doesn't have that kind of matrix or such a high concentration of fossils? If I see something like this, how should I determine whether it is real or not? Often sand/dirt/rock from the same fossil location is mixed in with glue and is used to make a kind of fake matrix. This can be used to make repairs or make a piece a little more visually appealing. but it can also be used to make a completely new block that has nothing to do with the original situation. This constructed matrix is often very homogenous in colour and structure, it might look more smooth than the natural matrix. It will also lack nodules/microfossils and other junk that might appear in natural matrix. And sometimes even brushstrokes can be seen on the fake matrix like the first photo at the top of the page in this thread. Olof Moleman AKA Lord Trilobite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troodon Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 It's very difficult and not realistic to field plaster the way this one is done with the hole in the middle, just not done. My guess is that it's been rearranged from the same or different Croc to make it more presentable for sale. All real. I think most items come from the field and are neatly re-plastered to look nice and saleable. Sometimes items added to make it look more complete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordTrilobite Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 You know what might make sense for that piece. What if it was found in 2 or 3 pieces and then later combined into one piece forsaleability. But yeah, it might also have random stuff added to it. Such a shame. Because the skull looks pretty nice. Olof Moleman AKA Lord Trilobite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sseth Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 On 10/23/2016 at 6:37 AM, Troodon said: It's very difficult and not realistic to field plaster the way this one is done with the hole in the middle, just not done. My guess is that it's been rearranged from the same or different Croc to make it more presentable for sale. All real. I think most items come from the field and are neatly re-plastered to look nice and saleable. Sometimes items added to make it look more complete I agree with Troodon on this. Looks like his piece had been composited together. I did jacket a partial dinosaur with a hole in the middle once though. We thought we had the whole critter in the first section of the jacket and when we began removing the stone so we could prepare the piece for plaster and flit we found more. After plastering it we turned it over to prep and when we removed the jacket from the bottom side(top working side) it left a hole in the middle where the low spot was. Not sure that is what happened here though. Seth _____________________________________ Seth www.fossilshack.com www.americanfossil.com www.fishdig.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sagebrush Steve Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 On 10/23/2016 at 5:37 AM, Troodon said: It's very difficult and not realistic to field plaster the way this one is done with the hole in the middle, just not done. My guess is that it's been rearranged from the same or different Croc to make it more presentable for sale. All real. I think most items come from the field and are neatly re-plastered to look nice and saleable. Sometimes items added to make it look more complete So if the skull is real, I could use this piece as a way to practice my fossil prep skills and remove it from the matrix to have a nice skull? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troodon Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 3 minutes ago, Sagebrush Steve said: So if the skull is real, I could use this piece as a way to practice my fossil prep skills and remove it from the matrix to have a nice skull? Skull looks real from this angle however you would need a different angle to see if the teeth are Croc and if they have been composited from a different species. A lateral view & closeup would also determine if anything has been to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Andy- Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 Echoing what the experts have said, the croc skull looks to be a genuine Dyrosaurus. Looking forward to meeting my fellow Singaporean collectors! Do PM me if you are a Singaporean, or an overseas fossil-collector coming here for a holiday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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