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Question about etiquette


smt126

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When I go fossil hunting it is always with my 4 kids who are 7 years old and younger. I've been trying to find books and read posts on here about fossil hunting etiquette to make sure that we are following the rules of the land. I recently read the one post about people digging out massive holes on a creek bed, leading to people falling as well as devastation to the wildlife in the area. When I'm with my kids I always try to get them to hunt in a way that leaves the slope of the area natural so that one doesn't create unstable areas where people can get hurt. I understand sometimes that fossil you want though is in the middle, and you might just have to chisel it out, versus taking down an entire wall.

 

My biggest question is this I guess.... Is it ok for the kids to do a lot of excavation? My kids find the part of digging and hammering limestone more fun than just looking at what is lying around on the ground. Sometimes this can be a decent chunk of material. They aren't digging up anything really scientifically significant, so from a science standpoint, I don't think it is impacting anything. I make sure like I said that they are not destroying natural sloping. One place we collect sometimes is under a bridge so I make sure that they are not digging anywhere that will affect the structural integrity of the bridge(although unfortunately it is apparent that others do so). I always try my best to raise my kids right with good manners, and just want to make sure I'm doing the same when we're out fossil hunting. When I went to Minnesota this last summer they took down a good size chunk of wall with some other children, and it just got me thinking. I was sorting through their pile, and they looked through it some too, but I just wonder what the community's view is on kids and their activities.

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It sounds to me like you are guiding them in the right direction. :) 

Like it or not, as parents, we are role models, and really should take that job seriously. 

 

Mention and stress the importance of safety, for them, and for those who come after.

 

With my kids, I discouraged willy-nilly hammering of outcrops. Although that is what they often wanted to do.

If they were really wanting to smack rocks, I limited them to the rubble already on the ground - I encouraged this by showing them what could be found, ... even in small or thin pieces of matrix. 

 

I taught them to work with a purpose, only to remove local overburden, and to not leave any loose material as a danger to others. 

I taught them to work small areas, rather than trying to tackle large areas. I also got them to pick up any stray garbage we came across, so as to leave the place better than it was, when we got there.


When sifting in streams, they were attention impaired, but were taught to NOT dig into the sidewalls of the creek/stream. 

One of my areas requires digging into the soil, and when there, I taught them to gently relocate any frogs, salamanders, or worms we came across.

They were told and shown to respect private property, and to respect No Trespassing signs. 


Kids are sponges, and absorb the good and bad that we show them on a daily basis.

By starting them off well, they will learn to respect the environment and others.

 

Hope that helps.
 

    Tim    -  VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER

   MOTM.png.61350469b02f439fd4d5d77c2c69da85.png      PaleoPartner.png.30c01982e09b0cc0b7d9d6a7a21f56c6.png.a600039856933851eeea617ca3f2d15f.png     Postmaster1.jpg.900efa599049929531fa81981f028e24.jpg    VFOTM.png.f1b09c78bf88298b009b0da14ef44cf0.png  VFOTM  --- APRIL - 2015  

__________________________________________________
"In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks."

John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~   ><))))( *>  About Me      

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3 minutes ago, tmaier said:

I believe that pneumatic tools and high explosives should not be used by children under 12.

:ighappy::rofl:

    Tim    -  VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER

   MOTM.png.61350469b02f439fd4d5d77c2c69da85.png      PaleoPartner.png.30c01982e09b0cc0b7d9d6a7a21f56c6.png.a600039856933851eeea617ca3f2d15f.png     Postmaster1.jpg.900efa599049929531fa81981f028e24.jpg    VFOTM.png.f1b09c78bf88298b009b0da14ef44cf0.png  VFOTM  --- APRIL - 2015  

__________________________________________________
"In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks."

John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~   ><))))( *>  About Me      

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33 minutes ago, tmaier said:

I believe that pneumatic tools and high explosives should not be used by children under 12.

 

I disagree, pneumatic tools are for ages 12 and under.

But explosives are safe for any one over the age of 3. (Holds up all 3 of his fingers)

 

Nah, SMT, you are doing right it sounds like. Some people may get "grumpy" that you brought your kids but you are teaching them and that is what's most important.

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One of the more obscure rules of fossil etiquette: Always split the shale of the person to your left. :P

 

I think Tim has it spot-on. You certainly want the kids to respect the space (and the tools) while not endangering themselves or others. One of the best things to cultivate is for them to spend more time examining what they hammered apart than time spent hammering itself. Going on "breaking binges" can certainly take away from appreciating what has already been split apart. And I know I'm occasionally guilty of that when falling into one of those modes when you get right into splitting as much material as you can, resulting in a little bit of impatience. I don't know what the ideal hammering-to-examining time would be, but I suspect it might be around 1:4.

 

...How to Philosophize with a Hammer

 

 

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1 hour ago, tmaier said:

I believe that pneumatic tools and high explosives should not be used by children under 12.

 

Ha!

 

I'm of an older generation.  I was one of 3 boys and the only issue when we were out on our own was who got to carry the rifle...12 was the age to be in charge.  

 

Explosives? I doubt if a week didnt go by in the summer when we werent trying to blow something up.  'Hey, lets empty all the gun powder from these fireworks and...:o'

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You definitely have that well in hand. Only wish others were as cognizant of ethics and etiquette. Most clubs and paleo societies have a code of conduct that they expect all members to follow. Things like not over collecting, no trespassing, leaving sites in good shape, etc. 

 

A number of years back we wrote up a "Field Trip Etiquette" list for our members after our trip leader became very frustrated with stupid behavior of the adults. Things like showing up on time, not expecting the caravan to wait while you get one more coffee, paying attention to the site rules when being given, etc. 

 

Etiquette, manors, ethics are all in short supply these days. I'm sure I am not the only one who appreciates your effort.

 

Erich

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3 hours ago, tmaier said:

I believe that pneumatic tools and high explosives should not be used by children under 12.

aw... you're no fun anymore.

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In my opinion one of the most important rules (from a safety standpoint) is to keep a good distance away from others. Hammers slip out of hands, chisels go flying, and rock particles whiz by like bullets. I have seen to many children get way to close to people out in the field.

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I like Trilo-butts and I cannot lie.

 

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When I take a group out there are only two rules. The same two rules our geology prof told us on my first field trip in the 1970's. 

 

Anyone complaining will be fed to a Grizzly.

If you want to keep a specimen, then YOU carry it out.  

 

I dont bother about etiquette, etc. I dont supervise adults and really dont care if they poke their eye out with a chisel or die of heat, cold or fall off a Cliff ( none of this ever happens). If they lack a brain or respect for Nature, they will just never come out with us again.

 

  

 

 

 

 

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I used to bring the Red Rider, fireworks, and good food to keep my kid onboard with dawn to dusk trips.  Somewhere I have a picture of him launching Texas Pop Rockets from fresh cow chips while I scanned an exposure. Then he got the idea of sticking the bottle rockets upside down in cow chips and laughing at the emerging debris field.  Strictly quality time for us!  He got a big turtle with his BB machine gun earlier this year while I collected shark teeth...fortunately the turtle was big enough for us to eat, but I made him butcher it.

Grüße,

Daniel A. Wöhr aus Südtexas

"To the motivated go the spoils."

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Thank you all for all your responses. Some of them literally had me LOL. I needed that as this has been quite a week. I read a lot on etiquette, but there just wasn't that much out there on kids. I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only one taking my kids out on these adventures too, as it does seem that some people frown upon the children collecting. Family is the most important thing in my life, and always comes first. As a kid I always dreamed of digging up fossils, but had a family life that wasn't conducive to those kinds of dreams. Now that I've got kids who have a love for that, I really want to let them experience their dreams, but I also want to make sure we are doing it right. I will continue to work with them on the patience of looking versus excavating. Unfortunately in today's technology driven world, kids just don't seem to have the same kind of patience that we had to have growing up.

 

I totally get the safety stuff you have brought up as well. Anyone who is digging or around those digging/hammering/etc must wear eye protection. I also try to make sure anyone swinging those hammers and picks are away from the others. We are planning a trip to Texas, and wildlife and flooding issues are a whole new safety concept I'm trying to read up on.

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6 hours ago, smt126 said:

Thank you all for all your responses. Some of them literally had me LOL. I needed that as this has been quite a week. I read a lot on etiquette, but there just wasn't that much out there on kids. I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only one taking my kids out on these adventures too, as it does seem that some people frown upon the children collecting. Family is the most important thing in my life, and always comes first. As a kid I always dreamed of digging up fossils, but had a family life that wasn't conducive to those kinds of dreams. Now that I've got kids who have a love for that, I really want to let them experience their dreams, but I also want to make sure we are doing it right. I will continue to work with them on the patience of looking versus excavating. Unfortunately in today's technology driven world, kids just don't seem to have the same kind of patience that we had to have growing up.

 

I totally get the safety stuff you have brought up as well. Anyone who is digging or around those digging/hammering/etc must wear eye protection. I also try to make sure anyone swinging those hammers and picks are away from the others. We are planning a trip to Texas, and wildlife and flooding issues are a whole new safety concept I'm trying to read up on.

 

Depending on the hike I'm leading I will put  'No children permitted...dogs allowed'

 

However, my friends all get the meaning.   At least once a year I lead a trip into badlands for all ages and have an event for kids at my house. On field trips I make sure every child finds some big dino bone or tooth to take home. One of us will spot a raptor tooth or whatever and declare 'this looks look like a good spot to look'.;)

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