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Dimetrodon neural spines


dinodigger

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Hey gang here's a great Ddon fin spine. just finished prepping. Had to remove a lot of caliche cemented to the outside. very young ddon.

20161205_121333.jpg

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Fascinating evolutionary experiment. I know nothing more about Dimetrodons past what I read in my dinosaur books before I was probably 10. Most reptiles that would have such frilly projections I believe are able to deploy or retract them through articulated joints at the base but as the sails on these guys are strung along the neural spines of the vertebrae I'm guessing they had little to no play in them. The only other types of animals that I can think of (offhand) that have tall neural processes are things like bovids (bison, muskox, etc.) where they formed attachments for huge musculature to support heavy skulls. I guess it would be difficult to determine from the fossil record and the neurals on the Dimetrodons are likely found fragmented, but it would seem to me that these could be quite the liability and might easily be fractured during the rough and tumble of the animal's life. Never thought of this before till I saw the breaks in that fine specimen pictured above. Do Dimetrodon skeletons often show signs of breaks (and healing scars) in their neural spines?

 

Looking forward to further updates as you get more along into prepping your recent finds.

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

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9 hours ago, Carl said:

Doc! Ya need to find a hatchling or newborn Dimetrodons! The HAD to lack sails. Picture the alternative!

Duuuude. You have no idea how frustrating it is... I've been trying to figure out the infant issue for a while now. I have found bits and pieces of very small fin bones that I have to equate as baby ddon. I think they were born with them- most likely folded down at the contact between the neural spine and the neural arch. Cartilage joint must mature quickly into bone. Haven't found any babies with vert and n.s. attached. 

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10 hours ago, digit said:

Fascinating evolutionary experiment. I know nothing more about Dimetrodons past what I read in my dinosaur books before I was probably 10. Most reptiles that would have such frilly projections I believe are able to deploy or retract them through articulated joints at the base but as the sails on these guys are strung along the neural spines of the vertebrae I'm guessing they had little to no play in them. The only other types of animals that I can think of (offhand) that have tall neural processes are things like bovids (bison, muskox, etc.) where they formed attachments for huge musculature to support heavy skulls. I guess it would be difficult to determine from the fossil record and the neurals on the Dimetrodons are likely found fragmented, but it would seem to me that these could be quite the liability and might easily be fractured during the rough and tumble of the animal's life. Never thought of this before till I saw the breaks in that fine specimen pictured above. Do Dimetrodon skeletons often show signs of breaks (and healing scars) in their neural spines?

 

Looking forward to further updates as you get more along into prepping your recent finds.

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

Hey Ken- pathologies such as breaks are very common. Those fin spines do break in life and heal. We did collect a fin spine that had broken and healed improperly- resulting in a spine that makes an abrupt left turn. The spines were definitely multi-tasking. They weren't strong enough for any form of defense but made a wonderful billboard for sexual display and a warning sign. The amount of muscles needed to keep those up as well as support the head and tail would have been much more massive than what we once thought. Try imagining a sail that isn't thin, but much much thicker. Heat regulation? Mayyyybe. Not convinced though. 

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9 hours ago, dinodigger said:

Hey Ken- pathologies such as breaks are very common. Those fin spines do break in life and heal. We did collect a fin spine that had broken and healed improperly- resulting in a spine that makes an abrupt left turn. The spines were definitely multi-tasking. They weren't strong enough for any form of defense but made a wonderful billboard for sexual display and a warning sign. The amount of muscles needed to keep those up as well as support the head and tail would have been much more massive than what we once thought. Try imagining a sail that isn't thin, but much much thicker. Heat regulation? Mayyyybe. Not convinced though. 

 

 

And How would they have fared in windstorms? I guess they would seek shelter or line up to face the winds. Otherwise they might get blown right over or the sail gets broken off completely. Also, forgive my ignorance here, did the females have the sails as well or just the males?

-Dave

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22 hours ago, digit said:

Fascinating evolutionary experiment. I know nothing more about Dimetrodons past what I read in my dinosaur books before I was probably 10. 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

 

Its fascinating how certain fossil vertebrates become part of the popular culture.

 

When I was 10 years old ( mid 1960's), we all knew what a Dimetrodon was. They must have had a good PR agent like T rex, Brontosaurus and Triceratops.  Few had heard of a Mosasaur, Hadrosaur, any raptor, etc.

 

Today I'm not sure every 10 year old would know Dimetrodon. Velociraptor may now be one of the 'in crowd'.

 

A whole Dimetrodon sail spine!!   I found a one inch section years ago and it was a 'wow' moment. I can still remember the thrill when our field school guide  told us what it was.

 

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More musculature supporting a thicker sail would seem more reasonable than the wildly improbable thin sails I'm used to seeing in drawings of this genus.

 

I think that in the mid 1960's we all had little plastic dinosaurs from the same handful of companies and these were make to show a variety of shapes. I can remember Dimetrodon being joined by Triceratops, Brontosaurus, T rex as well as Ankylosaurus, Stegosaurus. I had a hard bound dinosaur book as a kid that was coffee table book size with some wonderful images of it. No idea when it parted ways with me but I wish I had it back now. As a precocious kid I could easily spout the names of several dozen dinosaur types and for some time would reply "Paleontologist" while other kids my age were answering "Baseball player, Cop, Fireman" when asked what they wanted to be when they grew up. Had computers not come available in the mid 1970's and had I not discovered that I had a natural proclivity for programming, I'd likely be living out west and sporting a full Robert Bakker beard by now--but there is still time. ;)

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

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Digit...yes, I forgot about Stegosaurus.    Here in Alberta we find skull domes of A Pachycephalosaur called 'Stegoceras' and have to always point out we are not saying Stegosauras.

 

I've been out with Phil Currie a few times and his interest in dinosaurs started in the early 1960's from those plastic dinosaur models that came in boxes of detergent.  Unfortunately my mother must have bought the detergent with the free towels.  I know I had plastic dinos from some other source as we used to shoot them with the BB gun.

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