JojoMozza Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 I bought this nice theropod tooth online and the seller told me that it was a Daspletosaurus from the Judith River Formation, Montana. While looking online for more info, I found a few people saying that some dealers lie about the genus of tyrannosaurid teeth (especially with Daspletosaurus) as they are hard to identify. Just wondering if anyone here can I.D. this tooth? Suggestions are much appreciated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramon Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 It may be hard to identify a specific genus. Scientists use what's called serrations by millimeter. They measure the serrations or the little spikes at the edge of the tooth. Depending on how many are in a mm you can know which species. Also size matters. Hope this helps!!! "Without fossils, no one would have ever dreamed that there were successive epochs in the formation of the earth" - Georges Cuvier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordTrilobite Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 You probably can't put a name on it. Daspletosaurus shared it's environment with Albertosaurus and Gorgosaurus. They have nearly identical teeth. I think Daspletosaurus can get a little bigger but that's about it as far as differences in the teeth go. There is also some differences in distribution. If I remember correctly Daspletosaurus favoured the southern areas while Albertosaurus and Gorgosaurus extended more north. But there's a lot of overlap so this won't be very helpful in identification. So probably just best to put Tyrannosaurid indet. on it. @Troodon might know more. Olof Moleman AKA Lord Trilobite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramon Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 Also daspletosaurus teeth are usually 4 inches long "Without fossils, no one would have ever dreamed that there were successive epochs in the formation of the earth" - Georges Cuvier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgehiker Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 Its not possible to identify an isolated Tyrannosaur tooth from the Judith River deposits. The best you can do is know the specific location. GPS coordinates, etc and the specific strata it was found in. The location where a specimen is found never changes. Calling it Albertosaurus, Daspletosaurus, gorgosaurus, etc. is meaningless. 'Judith River' is vague. The pre Maastrichtian Montana tyrannosaur theropods are not all that defined. In general identifications are based on more extensive articulated skeletons found across the border in Alberta. One needs actual skulls and then tooth positions for comparison. Tyrannosaur material from non Hell Creek Formation is disarticulated and doesnt offer any clues. and...even if there was some means to identify the genus, how would the seller do this? The top theropod researchers at The Tyrell Museum would even shy away from indentifying an isolated tooth. It 'could be' this or it 'could be' that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgehiker Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 6 minutes ago, Ramon said: Also daspletosaurus teeth are usually 4 inches long Huh? News to me. I've collected a thousand or more Tyrannosaurid teeth from Judith River aged deposits and they are not 4 inches long. Even teeth from their bigger cousins T rex in the Late Maastrictian are usually about 3 inches. I doubt if i've ever found a dozen T rex teeth a full 4 inches in length. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Andy- Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 With such a small tooth it could be any of the three tyrannosaurs. The experts here know best. Just now, Canadawest said: Huh? News to me. I've collected a thousand or more Tyrannosaurid teeth from Judith River aged deposits and they are not 4 inches long. I was told teeth 3.5 inches or longer could reasonably be attributed to Daspletosaurus. Is that wrong? Looking forward to meeting my fellow Singaporean collectors! Do PM me if you are a Singaporean, or an overseas fossil-collector coming here for a holiday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan from PA Posted January 6, 2017 Share Posted January 6, 2017 2 hours ago, -Andy- said: With such a small tooth it could be any of the three tyrannosaurs. The experts here know best. I was told teeth 3.5 inches or longer could reasonably be attributed to Daspletosaurus. Is that wrong? I think that statement was made in relation to people selling smaller Tyrannosuarid teeth from the Judith River Formation and identifying them as Daspletosaurus in order make more of a profit, due to the popularity of the name "Daspletosaurus", versus Albertosaurus and Gorgosaurus. It was stated that all Tyrannosaurid teeth from this formation should be identified as Tyrannosaurid indet. A tooth that is 3.5 inches in length may be attributed to Daspletosaurus due to its size, but not with 100% certainty. All Tyrannosaurid teeth in my collection from the Judith River Formation are identified as Tyrannosaurid indet., regardless of the size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JojoMozza Posted January 7, 2017 Author Share Posted January 7, 2017 Thank you all so much for the information. I'm a bit disappointed that it is not a Daspletosaurus, but it is a Tyrannosaurid, which is still pretty awesome. What are the different Tyrannosaurids could this possibly belong to? I guess I'll have to label this tooth as Tyrannosaurid indet as LordTrilobite suggested. Thanks again! Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan from PA Posted January 7, 2017 Share Posted January 7, 2017 1 hour ago, JojoMozza said: Thank you all so much for the information. I'm a bit disappointed that it is not a Daspletosaurus, but it is a Tyrannosaurid, which is still pretty awesome. What are the different Tyrannosaurids could this possibly belong to? I guess I'll have to label this tooth as Tyrannosaurid indet as LordTrilobite suggested. Thanks again! Cheers! The Tyrannosaurs that the tooth could belong to are Daspletosaurus, Albertosaurus, or Gorgosaurus. Still a very nice tooth despite the fact that Tyrannosaurid indet. is the best identity at this time. Congrats! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JojoMozza Posted January 7, 2017 Author Share Posted January 7, 2017 13 hours ago, Susan from PA said: The Tyrannosaurs that the tooth could belong to are Daspletosaurus, Albertosaurus, or Gorgosaurus. Still a very nice tooth despite the fact that Tyrannosaurid indet. is the best identity at this time. Congrats! Thank you very much Susan! Any of those three possibilities would be awesome and am very happy it is a Tyrannosaurid tooth. I now know to take what fossil sellers say when it comes to Tyrannosaurid teeth with a grain of salt. Cheers! Jojo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Andy- Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 18 hours ago, JojoMozza said: Thank you all so much for the information. I'm a bit disappointed that it is not a Daspletosaurus, but it is a Tyrannosaurid, which is still pretty awesome. What are the different Tyrannosaurids could this possibly belong to? I guess I'll have to label this tooth as Tyrannosaurid indet as LordTrilobite suggested. Thanks again! Cheers! Tyrannosaurids are awesome, so don't be disappointed! If you are like me who simply must give an ID to your fossils, label it instead as Gorgosaurus/Albertosaurus/Daspletosaurus. It's one of the three species after all Looking forward to meeting my fellow Singaporean collectors! Do PM me if you are a Singaporean, or an overseas fossil-collector coming here for a holiday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zekky Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 Fun tooth, but sadly there is no current way to know the difference between the two species. If a tooth is 4 inches + and fat then it's likely Daspletosaurus, but that's the only one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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