molluscs from Cookiecutter Creek, Florida

[Monica]

Hello everyone!

 

I recently won a "rolling auction" lot that was put up by @digit.  Ken sent me a very heavy box that contained the fossils that I won, as well as some additional specimens.  This afternoon, while my son was napping, I tried to identify the molluscs that were collected by Ken at Cookiecutter Creek in Florida.  What follows are pictures of the specimens that Ken sent me, as well as my guesses regarding their identity (fyi - I searched the online image gallery of the Florida Museum/University of Florida website in order to come up with my guesses).  I appreciate any input/guidance that fellow TFF members can give me - thanks in advance!!!

 

Monica

 

Specimens #1 and #2: Bivalves

I think that the specimen on top in each picture is Phacoides pectinatus and the specimen on the bottom is Chione chipolana.  Please compare with the following images from the Florida Museum:

Phacoides pectinatus: http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/invertpaleo/display.asp?catalog_number=25110&gallery_type=Florida Mollusca-Bivalvia

Chione chipolana: http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/invertpaleo/display.asp?catalog_number=73007&gallery_type=Florida Mollusca-Bivalvia

 

 

[Monica]

Specimen #3: Gastropod which I believe is Strombus sp., but I'm not sure about the species.  The specimen I have looks a bit like the images of S. evergladesensis on the Florida Museum website (http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/invertpaleo/display.asp?catalog_number=145571&gallery_type=Florida Mollusca-Gastropoda), but mine is a bit wider at the top and the top of the outer lip on my specimen doesn't angle downwards quite as much as the specimen in the online museum image.  Here is my specimen:

[Monica]

Specimen #4: Gastropods which I think might be Melongena corona - please see below:

For comparison to an image of a specimen on the Florida Museum website: http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/invertpaleo/display.asp?catalog_number=22481&gallery_type=Florida Mollusca-Gastropoda

[Monica]

Specimen #5: Gastropod which I believe is Sinistrofulgur contrarium.  These little guys have their aperture on the lefthand side rather than the right, which I'm assuming accounts for their genus name having the prefix "sinistro" (in Italian, "sinistra" means "left" - thanks, mom and dad! ) - see images below:

Compare with an image of a specimen on the Florida Museum website: http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/invertpaleo/display.asp?catalog_number=30110&gallery_type=Florida Mollusca-Gastropoda

[Monica]

Specimen #6: Gastropod which might be Cerithium muscarum - what do you think?  Image is below:

Please compare with an image of a specimen on the Florida Museum website: http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/invertpaleo/display.asp?catalog_number=168676&gallery_type=Florida Mollusca-Gastropoda

[Monica]

Specimen #7: Gastropod that I think looks quite a bit like the images of Neverita duplicata (http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/invertpaleo/display.asp?catalog_number=84259&gallery_type=Florida Mollusca-Gastropoda) or Neverita eucallosa (http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/invertpaleo/display.asp?catalog_number=71810&gallery_type=Florida Mollusca-Gastropoda) on the Florida Museum website - please see image below, and if you need the specimen to be oriented differently to "match" the images on the Florida Museum website, then just let me know:

[digit]

I could definitely believe the specimen #1 to be a Phacoides. Specimen #2 is definitely a Chione (they are very common in South Florida--I could collect hundreds of them just digging holes in my back yard). The species might be Chione cancellata. Specimen #3 does appear to be some sort of Strombus (conch) species. Specimen #4 is either Melongena coronata or subcoronata. Specimen #5 is "reversed" (sinistral) and there are not too many species which buck the trend and are "left-handed" without being a rare aberration so you are probably right here. Specimen #7 is definitely one of the Naticidae (moon snails).

 

The one person who would be able to ID these with his eyes closed and one hand behind his back would be @MikeR I'm sure you'll get more information about these specimens once Mike catches wind of this topic.

 

Glad you're having fun with those specimens.

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

[Monica]

1 hour ago, digit said:

I could definitely believe the specimen #1 to be a Phacoides. Specimen #2 is definitely a Chione (they are very common in South Florida--I could collect hundreds of them just digging holes in my back yard). The species might be Chione cancellata. Specimen #3 does appear to be some sort of Strombus (conch) species. Specimen #4 is either Melongena coronata or subcoronata. Specimen #5 is "reversed" (sinistral) and there are not too many species which buck the trend and are "left-handed" without being a rare aberration so you are probably right here. Specimen #7 is definitely one of the Naticidae (moon snails).

 

The one person who would be able to ID these with his eyes closed and one hand behind his back would be @MikeR I'm sure you'll get more information about these specimens once Mike catches wind of this topic.

 

Glad you're having fun with those specimens.

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

Hi again, Ken!

 

Yes, I am indeed having fun with the box of goodies you sent me!  Viola (my daughter) had her eye on the shells as soon as she saw them so I let her have first pick which is why a few of the items from Cookiecutter Creek were not included in this thread - since they now belong to Viola, they are under her care, and identifying them down to genus or species isn't really a priority for her (not surprising since she's only 6 years old! ).  Now that I've tackled the Cookiecutter Creek shells and have some direction with regards to their identities so I can label them appropriately, I'm going to move onto the Peace River material you sent - I think this is going to be tougher since vertebrates are NOT my strong point, but I'll give it a go and post my guesses in another thread in the near future.

 

Thanks again!  I hope you're having a wonderful weekend!

 

Monica

 

PS - By the way - how old are these fossils from Cookiecutter Creek?  Are they Pliocene/Pleistocene?  Again, I'm just looking into labeling these specimens as best I can - thanks!

[Peace river rat]

Specimen # 3 I find all over in limerock roads here in Arcadia Fl. Don't know exactly what they are but they make fine david sling bullets. Imagine one spiraling like a football point first at 100 MPH on a parabolic arch at a range of 150 yards! Sorry, that is all I can offer.

 

I can pick up 30 or so in a short stretch oh dirt road!

[Monica]

1 hour ago, Peace river rat said:

Specimen # 3 I find all over in limerock roads here in Arcadia Fl. Don't know exactly what they are but they make fine david sling bullets. Imagine one spiraling like a football point first at 100 MPH on a parabolic arch at a range of 150 yards! Sorry, that is all I can offer.

 

I can pick up 30 or so in a short stretch oh dirt road!

Do you really use #3 in a slingshot (I'm assuming that's what you mean by "david sling bullets")?!  The one (Strombus sp., I'm thinking) that Ken sent me is pretty heavy - I imagine that it would do some damage traveling 150 yards - I hope you're not pointing it at anyone/anything!

 

As for your being able to find 30 in a short stretch of dirt road - I'm definitely envious - fossils in my area are not that easy to come by.

[Peace river rat]

13 minutes ago, Monica said:

Do you really use #3 in a slingshot (I'm assuming that's what you mean by "david sling bullets")?!  The one (Strombus sp., I'm thinking) that Ken sent me is pretty heavy - I imagine that it would do some damage traveling 150 yards - I hope you're not pointing it at anyone/anything!

 

As for your being able to find 30 in a short stretch of dirt road - I'm definitely envious - fossils in my area are not that easy to come by.

Not a slingshot, a david sling uses centrifugal force. Think a husky kid at the apex of a swing and a chain breaks on one top side! About 36 inches long, the ammo sits in the middle, you swing it round, at a certain point, you release one cord. No elastic, the cords have zero stretch, opposite of a slingshot. Check out Slinging. org.

 

It is a cool toy to take fossiling, your right it is dangerous, open rural areas are a must. It carrys the energy of medium bore pistol rounds. One of mans oldest projectile weapons.

 

Here in fl, fossil shells are driven over and very few pay attention to them, as noted I collect them for sling ammo! Happy hunting!

[digit]

Classic example of "familiarity breeds contempt". Marine shell fossils are so common in Florida that we pave roads with them. May seem sacrilegious but most fossils shells are so common they are devalued to the point of just being limestone fill.

 

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

[sdsnl]

Natica sp. may be a closer match for the last one. 

 

If only you posted this sooner, I could have sent you some similar shells to accompany these!

[Peace river rat]

13 hours ago, Monica said:

 

 

As for your being able to find 30 in a short stretch of dirt road - I'm definitely envious - fossils in my area are not that easy to come by.

If you make it to fl bring a few 5 gallon buckets, you can find em till the cows come home!

[Monica]

7 hours ago, sdsnl said:

Natica sp. may be a closer match for the last one. 

 

If only you posted this sooner, I could have sent you some similar shells to accompany these!

Hi @sdsnl

 

Here are a couple of additional pictures of the gastropod that might be Neverita sp. or Natica sp. - what do you think?

 

 

Thanks!

 

Monica

 

PS - No worries about what was sent - I'm excited that it's going to be a surprise 

[sdsnl]

16 hours ago, Monica said:

Hi @sdsnl

 

Here are a couple of additional pictures of the gastropod that might be Neverita sp. or Natica sp. - what do you think?

 

 

Thanks!

 

Monica

 

PS - No worries about what was sent - I'm excited that it's going to be a surprise 

Actually, could be Polinices too...I'm not sure which yours is exactly, but definitely Naticidae.

[Shellseeker]

Monica ,

One of the things I do when searching for an ID and checking out suggestions is use the upper right corner SEARCH function.  In this case , use the word "Natica" which results in 63 hits and one of mine, which has a comparison of fossil and current Natica examples.

 

[digit]

On 2/18/2017 at 8:07 PM, Monica said:

PS - By the way - how old are these fossils from Cookiecutter Creek?  Are they Pliocene/Pleistocene?  Again, I'm just looking into labeling these specimens as best I can - thanks!

 

@MikeR would have a more authoritative opinion on this but I believe I looked at a geological map of the area and figured there may be some Miocene fossils exposed in this area but that it is mostly Plie/Pleistocene. Take Mike's word for it over anything that I say.

 

Enjoying my time out in Dominica at the moment. Teaching a coral reef survey workshop here at the moment and got in our first couple of dives this afternoon--another 4 more days of diving and then I have a free day to go and play topside. Planning on visiting the Kalinago Carib Territory on the northeast corner of Dominica. Should be fun:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Island_Caribs

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

[Monica]

1 hour ago, digit said:

 

@MikeR would have a more authoritative opinion on this but I believe I looked at a geological map of the area and figured there may be some Miocene fossils exposed in this area but that it is mostly Plie/Pleistocene. Take Mike's word for it over anything that I say.

 

Enjoying my time out in Dominica at the moment. Teaching a coral reef survey workshop here at the moment and got in our first couple of dives this afternoon--another 4 more days of diving and then I have a free day to go and play topside. Planning on visiting the Kalinago Carib Territory on the northeast corner of Dominica. Should be fun:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Island_Caribs

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

Wow, Ken - you seem to do quite a bit of travelling - am I ever envious! (Especially since you're travelling to locales much warmer than mine - Viola and I went looking for fossils today because this past weekend was much warmer than usual for February, but it was still only about 5 degrees Celsius so dipping my hands into the creek to wash off specimens was excruciatingly painful - is it summer yet...?!)

 

Thanks for the box o' fossils as well as your help in identifying them - I really appreciate it!!!  Enjoy the rest of your time in Dominica, and dive safely!

 

Monica

 

[digit]

Dress warmly and bring a backpack with a big thermos of hot chocolate--yum!

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

[Monica]

1 minute ago, digit said:

Dress warmly and bring a backpack with a big thermos of hot chocolate--yum!

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

It's funny that you should mention that, Ken, because I made the whole family some hot chocolate (with marshmallows, of course - how the kids love their marshmallows!) as soon as we returned from our 2-hour fossil-hunt in an attempt to warm up - my hands were pretty raw and apparently my nose was still pink, even after I'd been inside the house for a while, so I think that perhaps I should leave the fossil-hunting trips for spring/summer/fall!

 

Take care, and enjoy the sunshine and warmth for those of us stuck in the north!!!

 

Monica

[digit]

I always say go when you possibly can and just prepare the best you can (and finish with a marshmallow-laden drink).

 

You might look into reusable chemical heat packs too. I used to use them when I dived in cold water (when I lived up in Chicago and was silly enough to dive in chilly water). The packs I had were large (nearly the size of a sheet of paper) and were filled some some sort of chemical goop in a thick flexible plastic skin. There was a little metal "button" inside which when squeezed released a chemical that started an exothermic reaction which solidified the heat pack. The heat persisted for quite some time before cooling off. It was reusable in that you could place it in boiling water for about 5 minutes and the process would reverse and the activation chemical would retreat to the "button". Mine came with a thin neoprene pouch to insulate and slow the cooling. You would put this under your wetsuit on your lower back. As all of your blood circulates through your kidneys, this was an effective way of warming your whole body. That is unless you are stupid like me (well, my younger self anyway) and you wanted an extra bit of warmth on a day that was too cold for sane people to be diving and you decided to forego the neoprene pack. It started out way too hot and cooled too quickly. When I pulled my wetsuit off after a chilly dive I had a nice red square that persisted on my lower back for a few days. Live and learn--I only did that once so I guess I am capable of learning.

 

Something like this should provide relieve to chilly digits when digging around in cold Canadian streams for fossils. You can probably do an internet search with appropriate terms and find these for sale online.

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

[MikeR]

Where is Cookiecutter Creek at least in a geographical sense?  If I had to guess (which I am) I would say Middle Pleistocene Bermont Formation.  Neverita duplicata, Cerithium muscarum, Sinistrofulgur contrarium, Melongena consors, Chione elevata, Stewartia floridana.

[digit]

1 hour ago, MikeR said:

Where is Cookiecutter Creek at least in a geographical sense?  If I had to guess (which I am) I would say Middle Pleistocene Bermont Formation.

 

I'd guess your guess was right.

 

According to this map, the area is what they call generically TQsu (Shelly sediments of Plio-Pleistocene age) in southwestern Florida.

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

 

 

 

[Monica]

11 hours ago, digit said:

I always say go when you possibly can and just prepare the best you can (and finish with a marshmallow-laden drink).

 

You might look into reusable chemical heat packs too. I used to use them when I dived in cold water (when I lived up in Chicago and was silly enough to dive in chilly water). The packs I had were large (nearly the size of a sheet of paper) and were filled some some sort of chemical goop in a thick flexible plastic skin. There was a little metal "button" inside which when squeezed released a chemical that started an exothermic reaction which solidified the heat pack. The heat persisted for quite some time before cooling off. It was reusable in that you could place it in boiling water for about 5 minutes and the process would reverse and the activation chemical would retreat to the "button". Mine came with a thin neoprene pouch to insulate and slow the cooling. You would put this under your wetsuit on your lower back. As all of your blood circulates through your kidneys, this was an effective way of warming your whole body. That is unless you are stupid like me (well, my younger self anyway) and you wanted an extra bit of warmth on a day that was too cold for sane people to be diving and you decided to forego the neoprene pack. It started out way too hot and cooled too quickly. When I pulled my wetsuit off after a chilly dive I had a nice red square that persisted on my lower back for a few days. Live and learn--I only did that once so I guess I am capable of learning.

 

Something like this should provide relieve to chilly digits when digging around in cold Canadian streams for fossils. You can probably do an internet search with appropriate terms and find these for sale online.

 

 

Cheers.

 

-Ken

Your funny little story about diving in cold water reminded me of one of mine...

 

In 3rd year university, I decided to get SCUBA certified, and I wanted to complete my certification before heading to Australia on a zoology field course in May (we weren't allowed to dive during the course, but I was going to remain in Australia for a week after the course was over to do a little sightseeing as well as a couple of dives in the Great Barrier Reef).  Consequently, I had to do my open water dives in a little lake in the Guelph, ON area in April!!!  It was SO cold that my dive instructor used duct tape to create somewhat of a seal for our gloves, boots, and hood after he poured water that had just been heated in a kettle down our suits!!!  It made the entry into the lake not so bad, but it didn't last - I recall being chilled to the bone that entire weekend!!!

 

The story continues...

 

After returning from Australia, I wanted to get my dry suit certification because I was going up to the arctic to collect aquatic specimens for my prof as part of my summer job, and I had to do my open water dives in July when it was scorching hot!!!  Not fun, either.  Looking back, though, I don't know which was more uncomfortable - neither situation was ideal - definitely NOT recommended...