old bones Posted June 17, 2017 Share Posted June 17, 2017 What is the tiny pinecone shaped thing attached to this bit of matrix? It is rock hard and very firmly attached It is too small to get any detail with my camera. The first picture is the best I could do. I used a usb microscope to try to see more detail in the second set of pictures. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynot Posted June 17, 2017 Share Posted June 17, 2017 Looks like a very small paper wasp nest. Neat find! Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys." Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough." My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection My favorite thread on TFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darktooth Posted June 17, 2017 Share Posted June 17, 2017 What is the size of this thing! And where did you find this? I like Trilo-butts and I cannot lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westcoast Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 I can answer that cos there is a scale in mm on the first image and the tags say merrit island florida pleistocene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeschWhat Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 I think it is a charophyte...or algae fruit. Check out this LINK 7 Lori www.areallycrappystory.com/fossils www.facebook.com/fossilpoo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DPS Ammonite Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 What a nice pseudocoprolite. See this article on charophytes: http://sciencespot.co.uk/fortunate-find-for-fossil-fructification.html 3 My goal is to leave no stone or fossil unturned. See my Arizona Paleontology Guide link The best single resource for Arizona paleontology anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old bones Posted June 18, 2017 Author Share Posted June 18, 2017 1 hour ago, ynot said: Looks like a very small paper wasp nest. Neat find! I thought that as well, Tony. 1 hour ago, Darktooth said: What is the size of this thing! And where did you find this? Very small, and in a teaspoon of dirt! lol 1 hour ago, westcoast said: I can answer that cos there is a scale in mm on the first image and the tags say merrit island florida pleistocene. 46 minutes ago, GeschWhat said: I think it is a charophyte...or algae fruit. Check out this LINK 40 minutes ago, DPS Ammonite said: What a nice pseudocoprolite. See this article on charophytes: http://sciencespot.co.uk/fortunate-find-for-fossil-fructification.html Lori and DPS, thank you so much! I am continually amazed by the amount of knowledge on here. I never heard of these, and I am so pleased to have an ID. This is one of the most unusual things I've come across so far. Now I will go back to reading about these. Thanks for the link. Julianna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peat Burns Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 I agree with charophyte oogonium. Neat find! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old bones Posted June 18, 2017 Author Share Posted June 18, 2017 9 minutes ago, Peat Burns said: I agree with charophyte oogonium. Neat find! Thanks for the additional confirmation, Peat It's always fun to come across something new. (especially if you can put a name to it.) Julianna 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeschWhat Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 Actually, Julianna, I think I learned about these here on the forum! I thought they were so interesting (and beautiful), that I picked up some UK matrix that was known to contain them just so I could look for them. I am so glad you found them in the Merritt Island matrix. I have a whole box I have yet to crack open. I love that yours is affixed to matrix. Lori www.areallycrappystory.com/fossils www.facebook.com/fossilpoo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peat Burns Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 9 minutes ago, old bones said: Thanks for the additional confirmation, Peat It's always fun to come across something new. (especially if you can put a name to it.) Julianna I've seen more of these than I want to think about in late Pleistocene and holocene peatlands and other wetland deposits, but I've had few opportunities to encounter lithified specimens. Very cool. Beautiful photos by the way! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Mud Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 14 minutes ago, Peat Burns said: I've seen more of these than I want to think about in late Pleistocene and holocene peatlands and other wetland deposits, but I've had few opportunities to encounter lithified specimens. Very cool. Beautiful photos by the way! Hi Peat, Do you work on Quaternary paleoecology or environmental change? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Mud Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 Like PeatBurns, I come across these guys looking in Quaternary wetland deposits. This is indeed a charophyte oogonium. How old are these deposits? Charophytes (aquatic plants or macrophytes) can actually cause carbonate formation. Here's a paper about it with a discussion of their fossil record. http://www.paleolim.amu.edu.pl/SLETT/slett 05 2/slett 05_2_pp_55-66.pdf 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abyssunder Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 I just remembered this older thread due to the shape and the spiraling character of the specimen, and I think Lori and John are right with the ID. 2 " We are not separate and independent entities, but like links in a chain, and we could not by any means be what we are without those who went before us and showed us the way. " Thomas Mann My Library Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peat Burns Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 14 minutes ago, Doctor Mud said: Hi Peat, Do you work on Quaternary paleoecology or environmental change? Hi Doctor Mud, Yes, I work with peatland macrofossils and am particularly interested in autogenic factors involved in peatland typology and succession (allogenic, too, but specifically autogenic). I'm guessing by your username that you also work with lake and / or wetland sediments? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Mud Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 1 hour ago, Peat Burns said: Hi Doctor Mud, Yes, I work with peatland macrofossils and am particularly interested in autogenic factors involved in peatland typology and succession (allogenic, too, but specifically autogenic). I'm guessing by your username that you also work with lake and / or wetland sediments? Nice to "meet" you! Sounds very interesting. Great to hear too. Too often every little change is attributed to broader scale environmental change. Grand extrapolations are made about global change from a single peat core. But to me, sometimes the processes at play at the site level are just as interesting. You also need to understand these to be able to interpret records of environmental change. Yes - I am a mud doctor. I use a number of techniques to look at environmental change in natural archives, mainly wetland sediments. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 Nice to know there are people with telmatological /paleoecological interests here "Clavatorales " Doushantuo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old bones Posted June 18, 2017 Author Share Posted June 18, 2017 10 hours ago, GeschWhat said: Actually, Julianna, I think I learned about these here on the forum! I thought they were so interesting (and beautiful), that I picked up some UK matrix that was known to contain them just so I could look for them. I am so glad you found them in the Merritt Island matrix. I have a whole box I have yet to crack open. I love that yours is affixed to matrix. They are beautiful, Lori. I have probably overlooked them before now. The fact that this one was attached to the matrix is what made it large enough to come to my attention. From what I have read since last night, it might have helped create it's own matrix. This is why it is so important to check the dust at the bottom of the container... it is where I find the frog toes and snake teeth and other neat tiny things. I can't wait to see what you find in the Merritt Island matrix. ( plus there are some very nice coprolites in it!) 10 hours ago, Peat Burns said: I've seen more of these than I want to think about in late Pleistocene and holocene peatlands and other wetland deposits, but I've had few opportunities to encounter lithified specimens. Very cool. Beautiful photos by the way! 9 hours ago, Doctor Mud said: Like PeatBurns, I come across these guys looking in Quaternary wetland deposits. This is indeed a charophyte oogonium. How old are these deposits? Charophytes (aquatic plants or macrophytes) can actually cause carbonate formation. Here's a paper about it with a discussion of their fossil record. http://www.paleolim.amu.edu.pl/SLETT/slett 05 2/slett 05_2_pp_55-66.pdf Peat and Doctor Mud, Thanks very much for your input on this. I downloaded a couple of papers last night and it is a fascinating subject. Learning about this tiny fossil helps paint a mental picture of the Pleistocene environment that I have been studying. Thanks for the additional paper. 9 hours ago, abyssunder said: I just remembered this older thread due to the shape and the spiraling character of the specimen, and I think Lori and John are right with the ID. Thanks, abyssunder. I downloaded that paper last night with those great images! Now I'll have a look at the thread. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peat Burns Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 9 hours ago, Doctor Mud said: Nice to "meet" you! Sounds very interesting. Great to hear too. Too often every little change is attributed to broader scale environmental change. Grand extrapolations are made about global change from a single peat core. But to me, sometimes the processes at play at the site level are just as interesting. You also need to understand these to be able to interpret records of environmental change. Yes - I am a mud doctor. I use a number of techniques to look at environmental change in natural archives, mainly wetland sediments. Likewise, it's nice to make your acquaintance. I concur with everything you said. Much has been "concluded" from single peat cores. Although they can provide coarse information on community / ecosystem change, their low resolution is evidenced by the variability of macrofossils between cores taken in close proximity. To test this I once took three cores within a meter of each other. I was quite surprised in how relatively few species were found in all three and how many were found in only one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Mud Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 15 minutes ago, Peat Burns said: Likewise, it's nice to make your acquaintance. I concur with everything you said. Much has been "concluded" from single peat cores. Although they can provide coarse information on community / ecosystem change, their low resolution is evidenced by the variability of macrofossils between cores taken in close proximity. To test this I once took three cores within a meter of each other. I was quite surprised in how relatively few species were found in all three and how many were found in only one. Scary! Within 1 m! I bet this is especially true in peat bogs which may have limited agents for transport of macrofossils over large distances. If you don't have standing water. I work a lot with lake sediments and you do still have to be careful with taphonomy. I imagine large heavier macrofossils would be more common close to where they are produced. I also found in Australian wetlands I got a different record in different cores (but a cohesive overall picture) in semi-arid landscapes due to drying and removal of some sediments (by burning or deflation) creating unconformities. So often we don't do multiple cores though in paleoecology because it is so much work.... And there is pressure to cut to the chase and just publish a "sexy" plausible story from a single core. We have an automatic core scanner where I work, so we can at least rapidly look at sedimentology on multiple cores. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeschWhat Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 12 hours ago, abyssunder said: I just remembered this older thread due to the shape and the spiraling character of the specimen, and I think Lori and John are right with the ID. Yes! That thread (and your post) is where I first learned of charophytes. I would really love to know what that spiral mystery fossil is. Lori www.areallycrappystory.com/fossils www.facebook.com/fossilpoo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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