Poppy Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Hey everyone. Im new here and have always been interested in finding things. I found these years ago but have never known what they are. Any ideas would be appreciated. Im hoping to learn a lot here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrow Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Alligator Gar fish scales. Atractosteus spatula Darrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Welcome to the Forum, Poppy. I agree - those are gar scales. However, I think they are modern, rather than fossil. Regards, Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vieira Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 I agree. Modern gar scales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppy Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 Awesome thanks guys. When you say modern like how modern? Have they been used as spears or arrows? What are the imprints on them? Hope you dont mind all my questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Hard to say how modern. They are white in color - so that speaks to them being modern. 1yr? 5rs? 10 or 20 years? 75 years ago? Who knows. (Fossil Gar Scales are usually brown or black!) They don't look to have been used as any type of tool, to me. The imprints are ornamentation on the scales, that has worn away due to erosion/water/sand action. Regards, Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Come on, fella's! You know that color is a very weak indicator of age. Why has no one asked about the burial/exposure conditions (Poppy . . . . . ?). I could imagine gar scales with this color coming from a coastal midden, for example. http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppy Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 Well i found them in east Texas, shelbyville, to be exact. They were under a very old oak tree by the national forest. I dug maybe a foot down and the earth is very clay based where i lived. I dont know if that helps with age. Thanks for clarifying things Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Clay is one burial situation that may preserve the light color. That is so because there is little groundwater circulation in clay. Groundwater is the common vehicle to transfer exogenous minerals and stains to the bone. Here is an image showing stages of staining of protosynthetocerine phalanges based on exposure to water: http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Siphuncle Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Agreed on color being no indicator of age. To Harry's point, I've grabbed light complected Pleistocene gar scales in a TX coastal deposit that contained same colored remains of sloth, mammoth, Glyptotherium, alligator, turtle etc.. The ones I've snagged in the TX Eocene were all black. Grüße, Daniel A. Wöhr aus Südtexas "To the motivated go the spoils." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Thank you @Harry Pristis and @Uncle Siphuncle for setting me straight on that. I actually didn't know that. Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 The question now being begged is 'where were they found, and under what geological circumstances?'. If found loose on a river bar, in an area where Alligator Gars currently live, one possibility is strengthened. If dug from clay in a region that has not hosted the species for millennia, another comes to the fore. These are not proofs, only the next logical steps in hoping to know something "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppy Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 The closest water source by the site where these were found would either be the sabine river or huxley bay a few miles away. The area where they were found is heavily wooded and dense clay soil for the most part about a foot down along with many others and flint rock. Appreciate everyones responses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jewelonly Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrow Posted July 15, 2017 Share Posted July 15, 2017 Gar are very tolerant of low oxygen environments and surprisingly large specimens are taken from very small creeks and practically stagnant ponds. There are populations in pretty much every body of water creek and pond in East Texas and Louisiana. In this area "a foot down" is essentially the surface. Unless the scales were found in the vicinity of fossil remains of mammoth, camel, sloth or some other long extinct species I would assume they were recent Holocene. Darrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted July 15, 2017 Share Posted July 15, 2017 On 7/13/2017 at 6:23 PM, Poppy said: The closest water source by the site where these were found would either be the sabine river or huxley bay a few miles away. The area where they were found is heavily wooded and dense clay soil for the most part about a foot down along with many others and flint rock. Appreciate everyones responses. 8 hours ago, darrow said: Gar are very tolerant of low oxygen environments and surprisingly large specimens are taken from very small creeks and practically stagnant ponds. There are populations in pretty much every body of water creek and pond in East Texas and Louisiana. In this area "a foot down" is essentially the surface. Unless the scales were found in the vicinity of fossil remains of mammoth, camel, sloth or some other long extinct species I would assume they were recent Holocene. Darrow Maybe these scales are from that legendary, East Texas "climbing gar" which slithered about the riparian forest floor and up into the trees to raid bird nests. This individual may have over-extended itself and fallen to its death below the oak tree. Well, maybe not. But, if we are to ignore the testimonial evidence of the finder, we can come to whatever conclusion our imagination dictates. http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynot Posted July 15, 2017 Share Posted July 15, 2017 10 minutes ago, Harry Pristis said: Maybe these scales are from that legendary, East Texas "climbing gar" which slithered about the riparian forest floor and up into the trees to raid bird nests. This individual may have over-extended itself and fallen to its death below the oak tree. Do not forget the flint rocks it used for breaking the eggs open. Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys." Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough." My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection My favorite thread on TFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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