Identify skull jaws

[legoog]

Hello !

 

 

Please help to identify skull parts. It is were found at Bissekty formation, Uzbekistan

 

All photos available at google drive https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B4kOegB1CWCJWnpsNnBRNjZXVDQ?usp=sharing

 

 

Sorry but there is max size for photos 

Is there are crocodile skulls/jaw parts ? The main qustion

 

Thank you for helping

[Miocene_Mason]

Im not an expert on these things, but the circular teeth indicate psicivory, and I would geuss crocodile. But, I wouldn't rule out fish, maybe even plesiosaur. 

[Pemphix]

Difficult to tell with just one photo from the side.

But yes, it's part of the skull which you can simply see by the fact that this fossil shows alveoles and remains of teeth inside of them.

So something like mandidble/maxilla...

But to point out the genus is a little bit difficult without any info about strata or locality...

 

Best regards,

Pemphix

 

[Miocene_Mason]

9 minutes ago, Pemphix said:

But to point out the genus is a little bit difficult without any info about strata or locality...

It says bissekty formation, Uzbekistan.

heres Wikipedias article, which includes a faunal list:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bissekty_Formation

[ynot]

2 hours ago, legoog said:

Sorry but there is max size for photos 

You can post more pictures in a "reply" to the thread.

Also use the refresh if You have problems loading pictures.

[legoog]

1 hour ago, ynot said:

You can post more pictures in a "reply" to the thread.

Also use the refresh if You have problems loading pictures.

JAW №1

[ynot]

Nice pieces!

[legoog]

26 minutes ago, ynot said:

You can post more pictures in a "reply" to the thread.

Also use the refresh if You have problems loading pictures.

Sorry but i can't upload more  

 

Who can please look at google drive https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B4kOegB1CWCJWnpsNnBRNjZXVDQ?usp=sharing

[Miocene_Mason]

I'd say odd are it's kansajsuchus or zholsuchus. Congrats on the find!

1 minute ago, legoog said:

Sorry but i can't upload more  

 

Who can please look at google drive https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B4kOegB1CWCJWnpsNnBRNjZXVDQ?usp=sharing

You would have to refresh again for more.

[legoog]

JAW №2

 

[Miocene_Mason]

There is not many bones of crocodilians from the bissekty formation, so genuses are a little murky. It might be good to ask a museum curator or university professor to examine it, he/she may be able to give a more confidant ID. Who knows? Maybe it will turn out to warrant its own genus or species!

[legoog]

Refresh is help) Thanks! Thats all parts that i need to help identify

 

JAW №3

 

[ynot]

Could some of these be fish?

[legoog]

14 minutes ago, ynot said:

Could some of these be fish?

may be thi article wold be helpful:

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/295113675_Therizinosauroidea_Dinosauria_Theropoda_from_the_Upper_Cretaceous_of_Uzbekistan

 

and old topic 

 

[Miocene_Mason]

6 minutes ago, legoog said:

may be thi article wold be helpful:

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/295113675_Therizinosauroidea_Dinosauria_Theropoda_from_the_Upper_Cretaceous_of_Uzbekistan

 

and old topic 

 

I do not believe these to be therizinosaurs if this is what you are suggesting. They do not have circular teeth, but teeth that are more akin to that of a hadrosaur or a horse, as they are herbivores. The more derived ones have beaks and several layers of teeth, a bit like a mammoth. 

These appear to be piscivore, with circular teeth. Predatory fish, crocodilamorphs, some large amphibians, spinosaurs, large aquatic reptiles, and pterosaurs are all known to have these. Because of the little pits I would guess croc on these. Again, a true professional with a examination may be able to confirm (or deny) this.

[Miocene_Mason]

Btw these pits are electrosensory organs, similar to the ampullae of Lorenzini in sharks, or lateral lines in other vertabrates. I'm not sure what the technical name is for them.

[Miocene_Mason]

Found it! Domed pressure receptors (DPRs) are the crocodilian equivalent of lateral lines (although I don't believe they are homologous, maybe someone else can confirm or deny)

[legoog]

7 minutes ago, WhodamanHD said:

Found it! Domed pressure receptors (DPRs) are the crocodilian equivalent of lateral lines (although I don't believe they are homologous, maybe someone else can confirm or deny)

This is about black one? 

 

JAW №2 ?

[Miocene_Mason]

1 minute ago, legoog said:

This is about black one? 

 

JAW №2 ?

All the ones you've posted here have evidence of this.

[legoog]

5 minutes ago, WhodamanHD said:

All the ones you've posted here have evidence of this.

Dal Sasso C., Maganuco S. & Cioffi A., 2009. A neurovascular cavity within the snout of the predatory dinosaur Spinosaurus. First International Congress on North African Vertebrate Palaeontology, 25-27 May 2009 Marrakech (Morocco), 22-23.

In 2005, Dal Sasso et al. described an almost complete snout of the unusual theropod Spinosaurus, from the Late Cretaceous of Morocco. Siemens CAT scan analysis, performed recently on the same specimen at the Ospedale Maggiore di Milano, reveals that the numerous foramina located on the outer wall of the rostrum communicate with a common internal cavity, deeply encased medially within the premaxillae, which is unique among theropod dinosaurs. The extreme retraction of the external nares in Spinosaurus permits to exclude any respiratory/olfactory function of this cavity, which in turn has a neurovascular nature. The cavity flows into two paired neurovascular passages, going through the entire snout and meeting caudally at level of the fifth maxillary tooth. This suggests that a rostral extension of the trigeminal nerve innervated the cavity.
Soares (2002) demonstrated that the foramina on the facial bones of living and extinct semi-aquatic crocodilians house dome pressure receptors, innervated by the trigeminal nerve, that are useful to hunt even in darkness, detecting prey-made pressure waves associated with disruptions to the air-water interface. According to Taquet (1984) and Holtz (2003), spinosaurids might have hunted in riparian habitats in a manner similar to herons. As for Spinosaurus, we postulate the presence of croc-like pressure receptors, that might have given its mouth, when positioned on the air-water interface, an unexpected tactile function, useful to catch swimming preys without relying on sight.

[Miocene_Mason]

5 minutes ago, legoog said:

Dal Sasso C., Maganuco S. & Cioffi A., 2009. A neurovascular cavity within the snout of the predatory dinosaur Spinosaurus. First International Congress on North African Vertebrate Palaeontology, 25-27 May 2009 Marrakech (Morocco), 22-23.

In 2005, Dal Sasso et al. described an almost complete snout of the unusual theropod Spinosaurus, from the Late Cretaceous of Morocco. Siemens CAT scan analysis, performed recently on the same specimen at the Ospedale Maggiore di Milano, reveals that the numerous foramina located on the outer wall of the rostrum communicate with a common internal cavity, deeply encased medially within the premaxillae, which is unique among theropod dinosaurs. The extreme retraction of the external nares in Spinosaurus permits to exclude any respiratory/olfactory function of this cavity, which in turn has a neurovascular nature. The cavity flows into two paired neurovascular passages, going through the entire snout and meeting caudally at level of the fifth maxillary tooth. This suggests that a rostral extension of the trigeminal nerve innervated the cavity.
Soares (2002) demonstrated that the foramina on the facial bones of living and extinct semi-aquatic crocodilians house dome pressure receptors, innervated by the trigeminal nerve, that are useful to hunt even in darkness, detecting prey-made pressure waves associated with disruptions to the air-water interface. According to Taquet (1984) and Holtz (2003), spinosaurids might have hunted in riparian habitats in a manner similar to herons. As for Spinosaurus, we postulate the presence of croc-like pressure receptors, that might have given its mouth, when positioned on the air-water interface, an unexpected tactile function, useful to catch swimming preys without relying on sight.

Yes, spinosaurids have evolved convergently with crocodiles. No spinosaurids are described from the bissekty formation, but one Chinese spinosaurid is late Cretaceous, so it is a possibility. I just like to stick with described species.

[Miocene_Mason]

Wikipedia:

"They persisted at least into the Late Cretaceous, as shown by a single baryonychine tooth found from the mid-Santonian, in the Majiacun Formation of Henan, China"

source:Hone, Dave, Xing Xu, Deyou Wang, and Vertebrata Palasiatica. 2010. “A Probable Baryonychine (Theropoda: Spinosauridae) Tooth from the Upper Cretaceous of Henan Province, China

Available on research gate.

"sinopliosaurus" fusuiensis Is known from China's early Cretaceous, so I assume it and the baryonchid are related, connect the dots and spinosaurs should have been in Asia at that period (although Uzbekistan is a ways from east? china as you probably know)