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GeschWhat

Puzzle in poop - Cartilage, denticles or tooth plate in coprolite?

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GeschWhat

I have been finding a lot of inclusions in a batch of coprolites from the Smoky Hill Chalk that assumed were bits of cartilage. One of the newer specimens from that batch had a piece of the material in question on the surface; enabling me to view it from the side. They look like little teeth, so now I don't know what I have. I have one other specimen that has a couple of the little tooth-like structures intact (one that I posted a while back that has possible Ptychodus tooth fragments). Is this skin with denticles, cartilage, a skull part or some sort of tooth plate? As always, any help is greatly appreciated. 

IMG_4413.jpg

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GeschWhat

Here is another coprolite with similar material embedded. I don't know if it helps, but the visible scales and some of the bones on this one look like they might be from a lobe-finned fish. I'm waiting for a few more to arrive before I try exposing anything on this.

KSUS-NF-SHC-10.jpg

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Ptychodus04

Albulid tooth plates maybe? They look similar to some I found in the Britton Shale (Eagle Ford Group) here in north Texas. Smokey Hill Chalk has similar fauna as the Eagle Ford and Austin.

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abyssunder

Sure looks like fish tooth plate. Here's an image from Harry's collection:

 

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GeschWhat
1 hour ago, Ptychodus04 said:

Albulid tooth plates maybe? They look similar to some I found in the Britton Shale (Eagle Ford Group) here in north Texas. Smokey Hill Chalk has similar fauna as the Eagle Ford and Austin.

Do you happen to have a species in mind? All I am seeing is the rounded crushing teeth. Here are a couple more photos from another coprolite showing more pointy tooth-like structures.

Unknown Inclusion-2.jpg

Unknown Inclusion.jpg

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Ptychodus04
1 hour ago, GeschWhat said:

Do you happen to have a species in mind? All I am seeing is the rounded crushing teeth. Here are a couple more photos from another coprolite showing more pointy tooth-like structures.

 

The pieces I found were from Deltaichthyes albuloides. I don’t know if that particular fish is found in the Smokey Hill Chalk.

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GeschWhat
6 minutes ago, Ptychodus04 said:

The pieces I found were from Deltaichthyes albuloides. I don’t know if that particular fish is found in the Smokey Hill Chalk.

Thanks...it's a place to start :D

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abyssunder

Lori, I'm not so well-versed on these, but are you sure that specimens in the second picture / B are scales?

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GeschWhat
15 hours ago, abyssunder said:

Lori, I'm not so well-versed on these, but are you sure that specimens in the second picture / B are scales?

No...just a guess. You thinking part of the skull? There is one peaking out of another specimen in this group as well, just not as exposed. I thought that might be a skull plate of some sort. I am not all that familiar with this formation. I had the opportunity to get a group from a single source, of which many had similar inclusions. I'm just trying to learn...and all of you are the best teachers! :D

 

Here is a micro image of the one from another coprolite. Once I get the remainder of the group, I might start trying to expose things a little more. I just hate to use destructive measures if I don't have to.

 

Marine-Coprolite-Spiral-Fish-Skull-Bones-Smoky-Hill-Chalk.jpg

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Carl

Delicious!

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GeschWhat

@abyssunder I never would have thought of that! Since there were so many fish parts, I figured it was related. I think you are be right. Here is another micro image that shows what might be the flange. What do you think? 

 

 

Flange.jpg

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abyssunder

I think it could be that. :)

 

Flange.jpg.98392b4d3c29e205cd65f7781567b0a3.thumb.jpg.e34b973d25923f5c0743bb949188c5c2.jpg4.thumb.jpg.8995a05d0df52ad22973844e31f16dbd.jpg

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GeschWhat

@abyssunder you are a rock star! Based on baculite jaw id, I found synchrotron X-ray microtomography imagery of their radula. I think I have been mistaking radula for small unusual fish bones. Here is some more imagery (with reference added) that I found online. I so love the weird and wonderful world of coprolite! I have to find a way to have these scans done.

F1.large.jpg

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abyssunder

You never know what can be in a coprolite. Good research, Lori! :)

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GeschWhat
On 11/8/2017 at 7:31 PM, Ptychodus04 said:

The pieces I found were from Deltaichthyes albuloides. I don’t know if that particular fish is found in the Smokey Hill Chalk.

Do you happen to have photos of your pieces? I tried to do a search on this and got nothing. Well, I got one thing, but got a weird message when I tried to click on it. I contacted Mike Everhart with Oceans of Kansas. According to him, not much research has been done on the smaller fish.

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Ptychodus04
1 hour ago, GeschWhat said:

Do you happen to have photos of your pieces? I tried to do a search on this and got nothing. Well, I got one thing, but got a weird message when I tried to click on it. I contacted Mike Everhart with Oceans of Kansas. According to him, not much research has been done on the smaller fish.

 

I don’t have any photos (lost a bunch in a catastrophic hard drive failure) but I will try to run down to the Perot and see if I can find them in the collection. I donated a ton of stuff a decade ago and they were in the lot.

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Sagebrush Steve
On 11/11/2017 at 11:29 AM, Ptychodus04 said:

 

I don’t have any photos (lost a bunch in a catastrophic hard drive failure) but I will try to run down to the Perot and see if I can find them in the collection. I donated a ton of stuff a decade ago and they were in the lot.

Two words for you: cloud backups.

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