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Is this a Physogaleus "contortus" symphyseal?


ynot

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Hey Folks,

Got this tooth in the spoils pile at the Aurora Fossil museum.

I think it is a Physogaleus contortus  symphyseal tooth, looking for confirmation or alternatives.

It is 1/2 inch on slant.

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Thanks,

Tony

 

PS @MarcoSr, @siteseer, @sixgill pete, @Al Dente

Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys."

Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough."

 

My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection

My favorite thread on TFF.

 

 

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@ynot Tony, it could be. I would really like to see a full on side view with the root straight up. Without the clip you are using to hold it. But based on what I see so far I would say most likely it is.

 

Now, you were at Aurora?

Bulldozers and dirt Bulldozers and dirt
behind the trailer, my desert
Them red clay piles are heaven on earth
I get my rocks off, bulldozers and dirt

Patterson Hood; Drive-By Truckers

 

image.png.0c956e87cee523facebb6947cb34e842.png May 2016  MOTM.png.61350469b02f439fd4d5d77c2c69da85.png.a47e14d65deb3f8b242019b3a81d8160.png.b42a25e3438348310ba19ce6852f50c1.png May 2012 IPFOTM5.png.fb4f2a268e315c58c5980ed865b39e1f.png.1721b8912c45105152ac70b0ae8303c3.png.2b6263683ee32421d97e7fa481bd418a.pngAug 2013, May 2016, Apr 2020 VFOTM.png.f1b09c78bf88298b009b0da14ef44cf0.png.af5065d0585e85f4accd8b291bf0cc2e.png.72a83362710033c9bdc8510be7454b66.png.9171036128e7f95de57b6a0f03c491da.png Oct 2022

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1 minute ago, sixgill pete said:

Now, you were at Aurora?

In October 2014, just after I joined the Forum.

I spent 3 days there. (Just went through the finds to see if I had missed anything that would stand out to Me now that I have learned so much here since joining.)

 

Thanks @sixgill pete

PS It may take a while to get the picture You requested.

Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys."

Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough."

 

My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection

My favorite thread on TFF.

 

 

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Tony

The genus Physogaleus is in the order Carcharhiniformes and based upon Compagno 1988 medial teeth (see below) are present in most extant species of the order except in some Scyliorhinids and Triakids.  So I would expect medial teeth (what you are calling symphyseal teeth) in Physogaleus.

 

5a1d814ac03c1_Compagnodefinitions1a.jpg.03418bd530740e1cd190947f3302cedc.jpg

 

 

5a1d82e494110_Compagnodefinitions2a.jpg.30e9a75c2411455fd92d89d2d7121863.jpg

 

Your tooth has the features (the serrations and especially the root) and size (smaller than other teeth in the dentition, but not very much smaller like in Carcharhinus species) of what I would expect for a medial tooth in Physogaleus contortus.  If you look closely at other positions of Physogaleus contortus you will see on some teeth the ends of the root curve upward like on your tooth.  Although there are other possibilities (I hate to id teeth from pictures no matter how good) I think your tooth is a Physogaleus contortus medial tooth.  I would not have had the same opinion based on just the original pictures which you posted.  The additional pictures changed my mind.

 

Marco Sr.

"Any day that you can fossil hunt is a great day."

My family fossil website     Some Of My Shark, Ray, Fish And Other Micros     My Extant Shark Jaw Collection

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2 hours ago, MarcoSr said:

I think your tooth is a Physogaleus contortus medial tooth. 

Thank You Marco.

Especially for the wonderful explanation!!:thumbsu:

 

Respectfully,

Tony

Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys."

Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough."

 

My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection

My favorite thread on TFF.

 

 

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Hi Tony,

 

I've been looking at this tooth since yesterday.  I have seen a tooth like it identified as a Physogaleus contortus symphyseal/medial.  The crown seems rather flat and blade-like (usually with more of a tapering cusp with at least a slight twist) but that tooth position can vary in morphology.  It looks like the root had more of a lingual protuberance but it was worn away and that helps push it toward being a P. contortus tooth.  I might be more open to the possibility that it's a Carcharhinus or a Galeocerdo tooth, but as Marco Sr. observed, that side view sure looks more Physogaleus - looks like a lower tooth too.

 

When shooting shark teeth, always go for a straight on labial and lingual view.  A side view is always a plus.  I liked that you included the apical (top) view.  I know it can be difficult to get a tooth to sit still for photos.  Fossil photographers use a tacky gum for that - something that sticks but doesn't leave a hard-to-clean residue.

 

Jess

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22 minutes ago, siteseer said:

, that side view sure looks more Physogaleus - looks like a lower tooth too.

Thanks Jess!

Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys."

Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough."

 

My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection

My favorite thread on TFF.

 

 

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