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Spectrum

Isle of Sheppey UK, Odd Balls.

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Spectrum

Good afternoon, 

 

I have been looking for an ID on these for a while. I have found a thread from another site where they said the following. 

 

"Thank you for your enquiry, I have shown your specimen to a number of palaeontologists who found it interesting. After carefully examining your specimen, it seems that the most likely identification is pyrite forming around a phosphate nodule. It is possible that in the first instance, it formed around something biogenic, however, sadly, there is not enough evidence to  be able to tell.

 

The Isle of Sheppey is particularly interesting for studying Taphonomy (the study of decaying organisms over time and how they may become fossilzed). It can be considered a special place of preservation called a “Lagerstatten”.

 

http://www.nhm.ac.uk/natureplus/message/85395

 

I was wondering if the regular internal geometry from the few 'balls' I have found may shed any more light on a possible answer. I love the way they only break in 3 almost equal directions. Even if these are not fossils, I still find it enchanting the way nature can produce these fractal shapes.

 

Thanks in advance for any advice/answers you can give on these. 

 

B.jpg

C.jpg

E.jpg

F.jpg

A.jpg

D.jpg

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ynot

Neat concretions.

I do not understand what You are wanting to know.

Can You please clarify Your question?

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Spectrum
3 minutes ago, ynot said:

Neat concretions.

I do not understand what You are wanting to know.

Can You please clarify Your question?

Sorry for not being very clear. I'm a relative beginner when it comes to fossils. I guess the question is a simple one. Are these fossils?. They look like nuts to me.

Thanks :)

 

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Kosmoceras

I will echo answer from the Natural History Museum, these are nodules with pyrite around them.

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Spectrum
22 minutes ago, Kosmoceras said:

The will echo answer from the Natural History Museum, these are nodules with pyrite around them.

Thanks. The reason I asked is because the NHM said "most likely identification", and I thought maybe these might help with a more definite answer. 

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Bobby Rico

Isle of Sheppy is one of the best places in the world for the fossilisation of plant seeds. I have a small collection of seeds from there. But I think what you have are some very cool concretions. Just a tip to help with your  IDs add a ruler in your photos for size reference.  I will a add a pic of some of my seeds from Isle of Sheppy to compare. 

 

Cheers Bobby

 

15B95D41-1F6B-462F-A3C1-B88C9FB3138C.jpeg

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WhodamanHD
1 hour ago, Spectrum said:

Lagerstatten

I may be a bit picky but it should be Lagerstätte. Lagerstätten is plural. Tisk tisk.

 

Also I agree with cool looking concretions, keep looking! 

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Spectrum
22 minutes ago, Bobby Rico said:

Isle of Sheppy is one of the best places in the world for the fossilisation of plant seeds. I have a small collection of seeds from there. But I think what you have are some very cool concretions. Just a tip to help with your  IDs add a ruler in your photos for size reference.  I will a add a pic of some of my seeds from Isle of Sheppy to compare. 

 

Cheers Bobby

 

 

Thanks Bobby. I will add a ruler for size reference in future. I had a couple of seeds from a previous visit which looked just like the dark middle left seed in your picture, but they became lost before I could store them safely. It's good to know that such a variety of finds are possible from the London clay. It's not always an easy place to find things but it was where I took my first fossil walk, so it's my go to place if/when I run away from home. 

20 minutes ago, WhodamanHD said:

I may be a bit picky but it should be Lagerstätte. Lagerstätten is plural. Tisk tisk.

 

Also I agree with cool looking concretions, keep looking! 

Thanks for the encouragement. I'm just reading up on Lagerstätten, plural ;) . Very cool!. 

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GeschWhat

This one could be a spiral coprolite (from a fish). I have shown it next to a similar type from Morocco. They are often hollow in the center. What does the underside look like?

Isle of Sheppey-Possible spiral.jpg

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JohnBrewer

Crabs are common there. I’m surprised there isn’t one in your haul unless one or two are hiding inside any of these concretions. Worth going hunting for some. It’s a good place for lots of other things too. 

 

Sheppy crab

 

C58E76B9-8AC2-4C66-B3A5-EEA61B8088C1.jpeg.2d4517938f3f9b4e5ed43872928b7b8d.jpeg

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Bobby Rico

Crabs,lobster, fish scales and bits , sharks teeth, plant material and starfish . One of my favourite  places in uk for fossil. I got this starfish material for my birthday this year , it came from Sheppy. 

Definitely keep looking at Sheppy plenty of treasure to be found. 

 

Bobby

90B3C28C-FAD4-4BB0-A50A-4DD47947BECB.jpeg

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Spectrum
56 minutes ago, GeschWhat said:

This one could be a spiral coprolite (from a fish). I have shown it next to a similar type from Morocco. They are often hollow inhe center. What does the underside look like?

 

Wow. That spiral coprolite from Morocco is beautiful. I have attached a few different angles of the piece in question. They all seem to be hollow top and bottom. The layering pattern of the pyrite circling my piece does seem quite similar to yours. Thanks for the input GeschWhat. 

 

Ax.jpg

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GeschWhat

That really does look like a coprolite to me. You don't see that kind very often. I have quite a few from Isle of Sheppey. All look like they are made of the same material, but none of mine have that shape. I almost wonder if this one is a coprolite as well. Perhaps that is what they look like prior to opening up after exposure to the water - which would make sense. Extraordinary! @Carl?

 

Here are some smaller examples from Morocco.

 

If you find more, send me a PM and perhaps we can work out a deal/trade for some US poo :)

Spiral-Coprolite-Pair-Kem-Kem-Beds-Morocco-Cover2.jpg

Isle of Sheppey.jpg

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Spectrum
50 minutes ago, JohnBrewer said:

Crabs are common there. I’m surprised there isn’t one in your haul unless one or two are hiding inside any of these concretions. Worth going hunting for some. It’s a good place for lots of other things too. 

 

Sheppy crab

 

 

I do have one crab find from Sheppey but I didn't find it myself.. I got it on my second visit when myself and my girlfriend bumped into Fred Clouter. I had been looking at his website the night before, and when he said hello, he mentioned that he had found a skull a few years earlier on the exact same day, and I clocked it was his site I was looking at in the build up to my trip. He was very helpful and spent almost an hour of his time giving us advice. He was telling us about nodules and started looking around his feet for one we could use for reference, and the first nodule he picked up had a crab in it, and he was kind enough to give it to us. Top Bloke :). I like your crab pic JohnBrewer. looking a fossil in the eye after 50 million odd years of slumber is something magical. 

16 minutes ago, Bobby Rico said:

Crabs,lobster, fish scales and bits , sharks teeth, plant material and starfish . One of my favourite  places in uk for fossil. I got this starfish material for my birthday this year , it came from Sheppy. 

Definitely keep looking at Sheppy plenty of treasure to be found. 

 

Bobby

 

Your three pieces look great Bobby Rico. The starfish is beautiful. It's really helpful to see your stuff as it gives me a point of reference for future searches. Thanks 

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JohnBrewer
15 minutes ago, Spectrum said:

I like your crab pic JohnBrewer

Not mine, found on google images ;) 

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Spectrum
50 minutes ago, GeschWhat said:

That really does look like a coprolite to me. You don't see that kind very often. I have quite a few from Isle of Sheppey. All look like they are made of the same material, but none of mine have that shape. I almost wonder if this one is a coprolite as well. Perhaps that is what they look like prior to opening up after exposure to the water - which would make sense. Extraordinary! @Carl?

 

Here are some smaller examples from Morocco.

 

If you find more, send me a PM and perhaps we can work out a deal/trade for some US poo :)

Spiral-Coprolite-Pair-Kem-Kem-Beds-Morocco-Cover2.jpg

Isle of Sheppey.jpg

When I compare it to the lower example of your smaller ones from morocco, there seems to be one big overlap in both, and both in the bottom right hand corner as pictured. When you look at the possibly unopened one, there is one layer more prominent than the rest in the top right side area. I can imagine it unfolding like one of those flowering Japanese green teas, and that part would create the biggest overlap and only in one place around each circumference. Maybe I'm over thinking it. 

 

I'm happy to talk poo trade sometime. The place where I found these was very small. They all came from the same 10m X 5m patch. I think the spot gets overlooked as there is very little cliff erosion behind it. The main reason I came across them is because there is a concrete slab of an old WW2 radar assembly, so I'm told, which is very comfortable to sit on :). 

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Spectrum
1 hour ago, JohnBrewer said:

Not mine, found on google images ;) 

That's okay, I'd say google images is at least 75% as magical as the real thing :) . I'm flicking through pictures all day long. It's as addictive as coffee. 

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RJB

  Im one of those guys who needs something deffinet.  To me these are just some interesting rocks.  I cant spell either.  Ha!!  :) 

 

RB

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GeschWhat
3 hours ago, Spectrum said:

I can imagine it unfolding like one of those flowering Japanese green teas, and that part would create the biggest overlap and only in one place around each circumference.

I was thinking the exact same thing :D

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Spectrum
19 hours ago, GeschWhat said:

I was thinking the exact same thing :D

I'm glad you can see it too GeschWhat. I'm really glad that you gave your input on these. I was convinced in my head that if they were anything then it was some kind of nut, like a walnut or a chessnut. The first comparison you made showed the same scale like layering, and the second pic you sent shows the same overall shape, with the one major overlap around each one. 

 

I was looking at spiral coprolites on google images and I came across your website. I had a lot of fun looking at your collection :). I have quite intense Pareidolia myself and I could see the same things. My favourites are the hexagon and the crocodile. I also noticed one with the side view of a human skull which was cool. I will order a copy of your book for my cousin's birthday in May. I'm also going to email you some of my pareidolia pics as well. I would post a few on here as they are quite interesting, but they are not fossils and I think that violates the site rules. 

 

Thanks for igniting my interest in poo GeschWhat :D

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Spectrum
22 hours ago, RJB said:

  Im one of those guys who needs something deffinet.  To me these are just some interesting rocks.  I cant spell either.  Ha!!  :) 

 

RB

That's okay RJB. I'm really enjoying trying to figure out an answer though. I might get the NHM to have a look at GeschWhat's images/info and they might be able to offer a more their opinion whether they are coprolites or not. I would never have thought they were until I compared my ones with the ones from morocco. 

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GeschWhat
4 minutes ago, Spectrum said:

That's okay RJB. I'm really enjoying trying to figure out an answer though. I might get the NHM to have a look at GeschWhat's images/info and they might be able to offer a more their opinion whether they are coprolites or not. I would never have thought they were until I compared my ones with the ones from morocco. 

If you contact the NHM in London, ask for  David Ward. He is a fellow fossil poo enthusiast and all around great guy.

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GeschWhat
17 minutes ago, Spectrum said:

Thanks for igniting my interest in poo GeschWhat :D

Once you find fossil poo - nothing else will do :D

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MeargleSchmeargl
On 2/18/2018 at 12:00 PM, Spectrum said:

Good afternoon, 

 

I have been looking for an ID on these for a while. I have found a thread from another site where they said the following. 

 

"Thank you for your enquiry, I have shown your specimen to a number of palaeontologists who found it interesting. After carefully examining your specimen, it seems that the most likely identification is pyrite forming around a phosphate nodule. It is possible that in the first instance, it formed around something biogenic, however, sadly, there is not enough evidence to  be able to tell.

 

The Isle of Sheppey is particularly interesting for studying Taphonomy (the study of decaying organisms over time and how they may become fossilzed). It can be considered a special place of preservation called a “Lagerstatten”.

 

http://www.nhm.ac.uk/natureplus/message/85395

 

I was wondering if the regular internal geometry from the few 'balls' I have found may shed any more light on a possible answer. I love the way they only break in 3 almost equal directions. Even if these are not fossils, I still find it enchanting the way nature can produce these fractal shapes.

 

Thanks in advance for any advice/answers you can give on these. 

 

B.jpg

C.jpg

E.jpg

F.jpg

A.jpg

D.jpg

Concretion central! Like how it looks like a black sludge monster is eating some of them. :ighappy:

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JohnBrewer
On 18/02/2018 at 7:16 PM, GeschWhat said:

They are often hollow in the center.

Wind no doubt :P

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