Is it really a juvenile Mosasaur? What are your thoughts?

[Mattodon]

Welcome to my first Fossil ID Post!

I bought this fossil at a Market in Johannesburg. The seller claims it to be a juvenile Mosasaur. 

The sediment layer seems to be derived from seabed but I am no expert. Seller claims to have retrieved the specimen from Morocco.

 

Kingdom:	Animalia
Phylum:	Chordata
Class:	Reptilia
Order:	Squamata
Clade:	Platynota

[Troodon]

What you have is a fabricated jaw with real teeth, sorry. .  Very common at fossil shows

[Mattodon]

1 minute ago, Troodon said:

What you have is a fabricated jaw with real teeth, sorry. .  Very common at trade shows

Thats a bummer. What do you suppose the teeth could be? I have another tooth that looks fairly similar. Perhaps I should post a sample.

[Troodon]

The teeth are Mosasaur and from Morocco and someone can ID them for you. Not my expertise @LordTrilobite

 

Here are a few at the Tucson fossil show

[LiamL]

Just now, Mattodon said:

Thats a bummer. What do you suppose the teeth could be? I have another tooth that looks fairly similar. Perhaps I should post a sample.

Real Mosasaur teeth with a fake jaws

Still a cool thing. Hope it wasnt sold to you as authentic though.

[Mattodon]

The teeth are good enough for me. I was a child and it was suspiciously affordable. But I would never have learnt otherwise so thank you!

2 minutes ago, LiamL said:

Real Mosasaur teeth with a fake jaws

Still a cool thing. Hope it wasnt sold to you as authentic though.

 

3 minutes ago, Troodon said:

The teeth are Mosasaur and someone can ID them for you. Not my expertise

 

Here are a few at the Tucson fossil show

 

[LiamL]

Here are my real and fake ones, can you tell which is which?

[Mattodon]

8 minutes ago, LiamL said:

Here are my real and fake ones, can you tell which is which?

I am supposing the bottom one unless this is a trick question xD

[LordTrilobite]

Yup, a fake jaw with real tooth crowns.

 

The teeth seem to be a bit of a mishmash. The ones without facets/ridges on the enamel look like they could be Prognathodon sp. and the ones with ridges, I dunno.

Depending one what you want out of this, whether it be a display piece, or a real fossil, what you could do, is soak it in water. when you do that it's very likely the fake sediment and jaw will disintegrate, leaving loose real teeth. But be careful if you do this, there is a possibility that water can make the teeth more fragile, in which case, let them dry slowly and apply super glue/cyanoacrylate if anything breaks.

[Mattodon]

2 minutes ago, LordTrilobite said:

Yup, a fake jaw with real tooth crowns.

 

The teeth seem to be a bit of a mishmash. The ones without facets/ridges on the enamel look like they could be Prognathodon sp. and the ones with ridges, I dunno.

Depending one what you want out of this, whether it be a display piece, or a real fossil, what you could do, is soak it in water. when you do that it's very likely the fake sediment and jaw will disintegrate, leaving loose real teeth. But be careful if you do this, there is a possibility that water can make the teeth more fragile, in which case, let them dry slowly and apply super glue/cyanoacrylate if anything breaks.

I guess the display piece is meaningless if its a fake. If I pluck up the courage to do this I will inform you how it goes. Though I don't think my fellow Cape Town citizens will be too impressed with me using water to do so as we are in the middle of a drought haha. Thank you for the tip!

 

[LordTrilobite]

Another way to extract the teeth would be to do it mechanically. So get like a dental pick and carefully scrape away the sediment. Especially the lower part of the teeth can be more fragile. But when done carefully this is a perfectly good way to extract them. It just takes a little work and patience.

[Mattodon]

1 minute ago, LordTrilobite said:

Another way to extract the teeth would be to do it mechanically. So get like a dental pick and carefully scrape away the sediment. Especially the lower part of the teeth can be more fragile. But when done carefully this is a perfectly good way to extract them. It just takes a little work and patience.

Sounds a bit more my style. Ive been tempted to get those children's excavation kits for some fun but I think this will be much more interesting! So basically the sediment layer and the fake jaw can be picked away with the dental pick?

 

[LordTrilobite]

Yeah, if you get something like this it shouldn't be too hard to scrape away some sediment. Khouribga sediment is generally quite soft. I'd suggest trying to start away from the teeth first to get a feel for the hardness. And when you feel more comfortable you can try to remove the sediment away around the teeth and eventually dig them out completely. Then you'll have a nice set of real mosasaur teeth with out anything fake attached to it.

[Mattodon]

1 minute ago, LordTrilobite said:

Yeah, if you get something like this it shouldn't be too hard to scrape away some sediment. Khouribga sediment is generally quite soft. I'd suggest trying to start away from the teeth first to get a feel for the hardness.

I might actually have a thicker scraping pick but let me get a dental pick from the Chemist. Then I can excavate the teeth straight out. Thank you! Do you think a process post may be interesting to the community?

[Fossildude19]

2 minutes ago, Mattodon said:

I might actually have a thicker scraping pick but let me get a dental pick from the Chemist. Then I can excavate the teeth straight out. Thank you! Do you think a process post may be interesting to the community?

Any experience our members undertake is usually of interest to the Forum as a whole.  

 

Feel free to document your work here. We will learn alongside you as you prepare it.  

[abyssunder]

The teeth are real, the jaws are fake in your specimen. If you prep them out you will see they are made of different pieces of bones, some of them (if not all) having nothing to do with Mosasaur, unfortunately.

[Mattodon]

2 minutes ago, Fossildude19 said:

Any experience our members undertake is usually of interest to the Forum as a whole.  

 

Feel free to document your work here. We will learn alongside you as you prepare it.  

Thanks Fossil Dude! When you say 'here' do you mean in this post or just on the forum in general?

[Mattodon]

1 minute ago, abyssunder said:

The teeth are real, the jaws are fake in your specimen. If you prep them out you will see they are made of different pieces of bones, some of them (if not all) having nothing to do with Mosasaur, unfortunately.

I see that there are bits of bone like structure in the fabrication. Do you think it is worth salvaging?

[Fossildude19]

4 minutes ago, Mattodon said:

Thanks Fossil Dude! When you say 'here' do you mean in this post or just on the forum in general?

I was thinking you should start a new post in the Fossil Preparation sub-forum.  

[Mattodon]

1 minute ago, Fossildude19 said:

I was thinking you should start a new post in the Fossil Preparation sub-forum.  

This community is so supportive. I have a lot to learn! Thank you so much. I will check it out!

[Troodon]

20 minutes ago, Mattodon said:

Sounds a bit more my style. Ive been tempted to get those children's excavation kits for some fun but I think this will be much more interesting! So basically the sediment layer and the fake jaw can be picked away with the dental pick?

 

I like using an Xacto knife with a pointed blade just gives me the control and sharpness I need.  A pin vise also does well in these situations.  If there are bone fragments nothing is associated with those teeth or have much value.  Your call.

[Mattodon]

2 minutes ago, Troodon said:

I like using an Xacto knife with a pointed blade just gives me the control and sharpness I need.  A pin vise also does well in these situations.

I may end up trying all of these suggestions just to see which works best for whichever situation. To clean the teeth up once excavated should I use the same tools or rather leave them in water?

[Troodon]

I would avoid water as much as possible.   I typically use solvent, if necessary, and mechanical means to clean teeth.  

[Mattodon]

1 minute ago, Troodon said:

I would avoid water as much as possible.   I typically use solvent, if necessary, and mechanical means to clean teeth.  

Gotcha. I will make a thread in the Fossil Prep section. A fun new project.

[Tidgy's Dad]

Don't worry, you are not the first and will not be the last to be duped by these fake jaws with real teeth. 

There are thousands of these out there, they seem to be produced here on a production line. 

And people keep buying them, unawares. 

I feel it is part of my job and the Fossil Forums to point out to purchasers and sellers what is real and what isn't.

I recently explained to two sellers in Spain about their mosasaur material (and other stuff as well). Though I've been conned too, (not with mosasaurs, with trilobites, but the forum has taught me a lot, I will be harder to fool in the future). 

And of course it's a good idea for us to come here before we make any future purchases online. 

Slowly the word spreads.