Turtles and Dinos?

[Moozillion]

I am a complete and total novice, and I realize this question may be common knowledge to experts, but I figured it would still be a good place to ask.

I am also a member of a tortoise forum, which is where I met Tidgy's Dad, who eventually enticed me to check out this forum too!

Among the general population, it seems there is the idea that turtles (and tortoises) lived at the same time as dinosaurs and outlived them. I already know that MODERN turtles and tortoise did not coexist with dinosaurs.

My question is "What animals DID coexist with the first MODERN turtles and tortoises?"

Thanks!

Bea/ Moozillion

[bone2stone]

I believe I have never read one of your posts before.

I personally have found turtle remains in Upper and Lower Cret.

(Drawing the line at turtle being aquatic and tortoise being terrestrial)

What we consider the modern turtle has been around since before the Jurassic.

Which would place it firmly within the boundary of the primordial age of dinosaurs.

Tortoise is another point to ponder. I am no expert by any means but they surely have been around for a long time.

If you pull up time line of the Turtle/Tortoise you may find that they go back to the Triassic. Old in the extreme.

Where timeline split off into "modern" is questionable at best.

Listing animals that co-existed with them would be a list that would go on for page after page.

Is there any reason why you need this knowledge? 

There will be more folks here that will place posts on this subject. 

 

[oilshale]

The first turtles are known from the Upper Triassic of Guizhou, China - at about the same time the first dinosaurs appeared. That was about 220 million years ago. 

These two turtles are from the Cretaceous of Liaoning, China, roughly 100 million years ago. Both were contemporaries of dinosaurs.

 

 

[Fruitbat]

The Testudines lineage does indeed go back into the Triassic.  You might find some of the articles in my pdf library here on The Fossil Forum to be of interest.  Here's a LINK to the section on Testudines.

 

-Joe

[Moozillion]

HOLY MOLY!!!!

[bone2stone]

27 minutes ago, Fruitbat said:

The Testudines lineage does indeed go back into the Triassic.  You might find some of the articles in my pdf library here on The Fossil Forum to be of interest.  Here's a LINK to the section on Testudines.

 

-Joe

 

Wow what a collective of info.

[Tidgy's Dad]

Yes, there's a massive and ever increasing amount  of great stuff in Fruitbat's archives. 

Hi, Bea, turtles were swimming with the ammonites, icthyosaurs and plesiosaurs. 

True 'tortoises' family Testudinidae came much later, but their ancestors would have existed with the later dinosaurs.

They didn't really become forms similar to those today until the Eocene, i don't think, a little after the non-avian dinosaurs had gone. 

[Moozillion]

2 hours ago, bone2stone said:

I believe I have never read one of your posts before.

I personally have found turtle remains in Upper and Lower Cret.

(Drawing the line at turtle being aquatic and tortoise being terrestrial)

What we consider the modern turtle has been around since before the Jurassic.

Which would place it firmly within the boundary of the primordial age of dinosaurs.

Tortoise is another point to ponder. I am no expert by any means but they surely have been around for a long time.

If you pull up time line of the Turtle/Tortoise you may find that they go back to the Triassic. Old in the extreme.

Where timeline split off into "modern" is questionable at best.

Listing animals that co-existed with them would be a list that would go on for page after page.

Is there any reason why you need this knowledge? 

There will be more folks here that will place posts on this subject. 

 

I don't post on here much for several reasons. ONE: I'm a COMPLETE novice with nothing to contribute other than questions and admiration. TWO: Another reason I don't post much is I get TOTALLY overwhelmed with the amount of information. I find so much of it totally fascinating- better than science fiction!!!! I get immersed following different threads then have to quit because I'm a bit dazed.  What an amazing world this forum is!!!!!

 

Oh, yes: to answer your question. There is no reason for this other than my own idle curiosity! I own two (live) turtles as pets and am on the tortoise forum as I mentioned earlier. We often think of our little shelled friends as modern day dinosaurs! Then there was a comic in today''s paper. The comic is "B.C." A raptor type dinosaur is talking to the turtle and gloating how he is smarter, faster and more agile, and says he will outlive the turtle. The turtle just says, "Don't look up." That got me to thinking about turtles living along side dinosaurs (which I thought was false until corrected here!).

[Moozillion]

2 hours ago, oilshale said:

The first turtles are known from the Upper Triassic of Guizhou, China - at about the same time the first dinosaurs appeared. That was about 220 million years ago. 

These two turtles are from the Cretaceous of Liaoning, China, roughly 100 million years ago. Both were contemporaries of dinosaurs.

 

 

WOW!!!!

[jpc]

A tidbit that might fit in this discussion.  One of the  T rexes that the Black Hills Institute dug up had 7, count 'em, 7 turtle shells buried with it.  The turtles living back then would have looked like regular turtles to anyone but a turtle connoisseur.