Miocene_Mason Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 I found these two cow sharks (notorhyncus primigenus, bluntnose seven Gill) yesterday, miocene, Brownies beach. They were on both on a previous tide line within four feet of each other. The colors and size a very similar, so is it possible or likely that the lower and the symphyseal are associated? As in, from the same animal? “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 Is it possible? Perhaps. I think it would be a bit of a stretch to call them associated, unless they were found in a jaw or together with a ton of other teeth in situ. 1 Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 Million-to-one chance, at best. Float fossils should never be referred to as "associated". 2 "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FossilDAWG Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 These teeth weather out of the cliffs, often from cliff falls, then roll around on the beach until they are picked up. The odds that two teeth could be shed from the same animal at the same time, end up in the sediment side by side, weather out together, and stay side by side as the waves push them up and down the shore are virtually zero. Very nice finds by the way. Don 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fossilselachian Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 10 minutes ago, Auspex said: Million-to-one chance, at best. Float fossils should never be referred to as "associated". Agree totally! But really great finds. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted May 13, 2018 Author Share Posted May 13, 2018 @Fossildude19 @Auspex @FossilDAWG @fossilselachian Thanks for your input! I thought it was unlikely, just thought it was odd to find such similar teeth right next to each other, them being as uncommon as they are. I guess those many tales of heard of find The other half of a fossil months after finding the first are getting to me. Thanks again! “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 In your calculation of the chances, remember to factor in that the vast majority of fossil shark's teeth found are sheds, not from articulated jaws. A shark will sprinkle thousands of teeth around the ocean in its life. Two halves of a broken tooth were one whole tooth until after they weathered out. "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tidgy's Dad Posted May 13, 2018 Share Posted May 13, 2018 Agree with the above. Really nice finds, though. Life's Good! Tortoise Friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted May 13, 2018 Author Share Posted May 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Auspex said: In your calculation of the chances, remember to factor in that the vast majority of fossil shark's teeth found are sheds, not from articulated jaws. A shark will sprinkle thousands of teeth around the ocean in its life. Two halves of a broken tooth were one whole tooth until after they weathered out. Yeah, that’s true. Just a side note, I’ve always wondered if scientists could somehow excavate the a large chunk of those cliffs (which they probably couldn’t) how many skeletons they find. Vertebrae are fairly common, and from multiple species. “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted May 13, 2018 Author Share Posted May 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Tidgy's Dad said: Agree with the above. Really nice finds, though. Thanks! “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darktooth Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 @WhodamanHD Both of those teeth are in superb condition for the cliffs. It doesn't appear to be any root damage at all which is quite rare. I myself have always wanted to find a cowshark symphaseal, but they have eluded me. Consider yourself to be blessed finding two superb cowsharks in the same hunt. Congratulations, I am truly happy for you, and at the same time! 1 I like Trilo-butts and I cannot lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted May 14, 2018 Author Share Posted May 14, 2018 9 minutes ago, Darktooth said: @WhodamanHD Both of those teeth are in superb condition for the cliffs. It doesn't appear to be any root damage at all which is quite rare. I myself have always wanted to find a cowshark symphaseal, but they have eluded me. Consider yourself to be blessed finding two superb cowsharks in the same hunt. Congratulations, I am truly happy for you, and at the same time! Thanks! I was extremely happy to find it, my expression was one of complete awe. There were two other hunters ten feet to either side of me, both must’ve missed it. I was very lucky, and I am thankful for that. Keep looking, I’m sure you’ll find one! “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert Cliff Dweller Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 In 45 years I’ve only found 5 complete Symphyeals and maybe 3 in your condition that I would say complete. Congrats to a very good and rare find. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darktooth Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 4 minutes ago, WhodamanHD said: Thanks! I was extremely happy to find it, my expression was one of complete awe. There were two other hunters ten feet to either side of me, both must’ve missed it. I was very lucky, and I am thankful for that. Keep looking, I’m sure you’ll find one! Yeah I have to get back down there. Normally I would have been down already for atleast one hunt thes year but things keeo getting in the way. And like you stated in your other thread I won't be paying those high prices to get in over the summer. I have talked to the wife about going to the Potomac this summer though. Still have to figure out when. I like Trilo-butts and I cannot lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted May 14, 2018 Author Share Posted May 14, 2018 13 minutes ago, Darktooth said: Yeah I have to get back down there. Normally I would have been down already for atleast one hunt thes year but things keeo getting in the way. And like you stated in your other thread I won't be paying those high prices to get in over the summer. I have talked to the wife about going to the Potomac this summer though. Still have to figure out when. Good luck! A few shark tooth hunts a year keeps good health near! “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted May 14, 2018 Author Share Posted May 14, 2018 18 minutes ago, Calvert Cliff Dweller said: In 45 years I’ve only found 5 complete Symphyeals and maybe 3 in your condition that I would say complete. Congrats to a very good and rare find. Thanks! I’m still kinda buzzing from the initial find! I’ll take this tooth over a meg any day! “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynot Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 Nice finds! Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys." Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough." My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection My favorite thread on TFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siteseer Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 On May 13, 2018 at 12:55 PM, Fossildude19 said: Is it possible? Perhaps. I think it would be a bit of a stretch to call them associated, unless they were found in a jaw or together with a ton of other teeth in situ. Hi Tim, That symphyseal is too big to fit with the lower in the same mouth Jess 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted May 26, 2018 Author Share Posted May 26, 2018 21 minutes ago, siteseer said: Hi Tim, That symphyseal is too big to fit with the lower in the same mouth Jess I’ve never seen a cow shark jaw, is the symphyseal significantly smaller than all the others? “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 23 minutes ago, siteseer said: Hi Tim, That symphyseal is too big to fit with the lower in the same mouth Jess Thanks Jess. I appreciate the comment. When it comes to shark teeth, I am way out of my depth. I continue to learn about them through helpful comments like this. Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siteseer Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 7 hours ago, WhodamanHD said: I’ve never seen a cow shark jaw, is the symphyseal significantly smaller than all the others? From jaws I've seen, the symphyseal is noticeably shorter and of course with a smaller root than the lower anterolateral next to it. It's hard to put a number on it but it might be 15-20 % shorter (as I eyeball it) than a lower anterolateral next to it. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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