tatehntr Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 Hi everyone, I found this tooth yesterday at the beach in Wilmington, NC. I initially thought it was broken, but then saw that it was actually very warped with all of the serration remaining. After some googling I've found that they are known as pathologic teeth. If anyone has any information about pathologic teeth I would be super interested to learn more! Also would be interested to hear opinions on ID. Angy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darktooth Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 Very cool looking tooth! Pathological teeth are teeth that are deformed for one reason or another. Either disease or genetics.Your tooth appears to be either, Otodus angustidens or Otodus auriculatus. I like Trilo-butts and I cannot lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tatehntr Posted May 21, 2018 Author Share Posted May 21, 2018 Just now, Darktooth said: Very cool looking tooth! Pathological teeth are teeth that are deformed for one reason or another. Either disease or genetics.Your tooth appears to be either, Otodus angustidens or Otodus auriculatus. Thanks! Is there a way to tell between angustiden and auriculatus? I have been wondering that for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darktooth Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 There probably is a way but I don't have any hands-on experience with these teeth. There are members here who can shed some light on this subject. Maybe @sixgill pete or @Brett Breakin' Rocks can help. That is a really neat find BTW. I like Trilo-butts and I cannot lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcbshark Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 That’s a sweet one you’ve found there, congrats Every once in a great while it's not just a big rock down there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jersey Devil Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 I don't know anything about the area you found that in, but it is either an Otodus auriculatus or Otodus angustidens. Knowing the age and/or formation would help differentiate between the two species. Auriculatus is the ancestor of Angustidens and existed during the Eocene. Angustidens lived during the Oligocene. They look very similar. Rics have more ragged serrations, larger cusplets, and a smaller size on average, but there is a lot of variation. A good way to distinguish them is by the age of the deposit they came from. “You must take your opponent into a deep dark forest where 2+2=5, and the path leading out is only wide enough for one.” ― Mikhail Tal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darktooth Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 6 minutes ago, josephstrizhak said: I don't know anything about the area you found that in, but it is either an Otodus auriculatus or Otodus angustidens. Knowing the age and/or formation would help differentiate between the two species. Auriculatus is the ancestor of Angustidens and existed during the Eocene. Angustidens lived during the Oligocene. They look very similar. Rics have more ragged serrations, larger cusplets, and a smaller size on average, but there is a lot of variation. A good way to distinguish them is by the age of the deposit they came from. He stated that this is a beach find and when it comes to the North Carolina beaches, I believe many different time period fossils wash up on their shores. I like Trilo-butts and I cannot lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 What an epic patho The serrations are pretty regular and it just gives me a more angustidens feeling, but I feel like this is a topic @MarcoSr might be able to elaborate on. “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Breakin' Rocks Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 Hi there .. like everyone said before it really depends on the age of the formations available to the depositions being made on the beach. auriculatus is a short lived chronospecies and sometimes you can prop two teeth next to each other that look almost identical in their morphology but have come from two distinct time periods and are considered different species .. with the auriculatus usually having more pronounced serrations at the base and on the larger cusps. The root is usually more rounded and has less recurve when it is headed back into the blade ... but sometimes I really can't tell the difference. The age of the deposits available is key. I'm not familiar with that area in particular but I do know that North Carolina boasts some pretty extensive older marine deposits. I did find one mention of an identified (Otodus) Carcharodon auriculatus tooth from the Wilmington Inland Waterway Fill if that helps steer you in one direction or the other. I wonder if @sixgill pete is familiar with the area... https://www.idigbio.org/portal/records/6db81055-3201-46eb-9c8d-7ecd4125c569 Cheers, Brett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peace river rat Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 What a treasure, that much I DO know, for certain! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcoSr Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 10 hours ago, Darktooth said: Pathological teeth are teeth that are deformed for one reason or another. Either disease or genetics. Add injury to disease or genetics. Below is a modern great hammerhead (Sphyrna mokarran) lower jaw with pathological teeth caused by a sting ray barb injury to the jaw. The below picture shows a ray barb embedded in this jaw: The lower jaw teeth files just above the ray barb are crossed probably as a result of the jaw damage caused by the barb. The lower jaw also has an obvious pathology in the symphyseal teeth as a result of the sting ray barb. It looks like two rows of pathological alternate teeth (blue) with a single row of symphyseal teeth (red). Usually Sphyrna mokarran have only a medial tooth in the lower symphysis or sometimes two teeth. Three teeth like those shown below are really unusual. : Some modern pathological teeth including bull and hammerhead. 10 hours ago, WhodamanHD said: What an epic patho The serrations are pretty regular and it just gives me a more angustidens feeling, but I feel like this is a topic @MarcoSr might be able to elaborate on. I agree with what others have already said in this post that you need to know the age of the formation that this tooth is from for an accurate id. Marco Sr. "Any day that you can fossil hunt is a great day." My family fossil website Some Of My Shark, Ray, Fish And Other Micros My Extant Shark Jaw Collection Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darktooth Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 @MarcoSr Thanks for the information and pictures! I like Trilo-butts and I cannot lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hokiehunter Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 Beautiful beach tooth. One of the nicer and larger I've seen from the ocean. They are usually so beat up from dredging etc... Congrats on a very unique find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynot Posted May 21, 2018 Share Posted May 21, 2018 That is a very nice pathological tooth! Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys." Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough." My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection My favorite thread on TFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goatinformationist Posted May 22, 2018 Share Posted May 22, 2018 Utterly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeargleSchmeargl Posted May 22, 2018 Share Posted May 22, 2018 Nice patho! Theories on how this guy's teeth became like that? Theory 1: This Angie/Ric wasn't brushing his teeth right! Every single fossil you see is a miracle set in stone, and should be treated as such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixgill pete Posted May 22, 2018 Share Posted May 22, 2018 That is a fantastic pathology. The New Hanover county area; where Wilmington is located has a plethora of exposures of the Eocene Castle Hayne Formation. However there are lots of offshore Oligocene deposits of the River Bend Formation. Especially to the north off of the beaches in Pender and Onslow Counties. With that said, and from seeing the other teeth you have found, I would say your tooth is Otodus auriculatus. But, whether it is O. auriculatus or O. angustidens it is a fantastic tooth. One that anyone would be proud to display in their collection. Bulldozers and dirt Bulldozers and dirt behind the trailer, my desert Them red clay piles are heaven on earth I get my rocks off, bulldozers and dirt Patterson Hood; Drive-By Truckers May 2016 May 2012 Aug 2013, May 2016, Apr 2020 Oct 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tatehntr Posted May 23, 2018 Author Share Posted May 23, 2018 22 hours ago, sixgill pete said: That is a fantastic pathology. The New Hanover county area; where Wilmington is located has a plethora of exposures of the Eocene Castle Hayne Formation. However there are lots of offshore Oligocene deposits of the River Bend Formation. Especially to the north off of the beaches in Pender and Onslow Counties. With that said, and from seeing the other teeth you have found, I would say your tooth is Otodus auriculatus. But, whether it is O. auriculatus or O. angustidens it is a fantastic tooth. One that anyone would be proud to display in their collection. Thank you very much! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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