orthoceras, goniatite and ? ? ? ?

[Rocky Stoner]

Hi everyone.

Picked these up yesterday in my garden.

The orthoceras orthocone are familiar as is the piece of a goniatite (3rd one here so far) but am wondering what the larger piece is ?

 

It is very smooth, and has the same color, texture and symmetry as the goniatites but is much thinner in proportion. Pictured is both sides and a longitudinal view to hopefully show the symmetry and relatively thin profile.

Does it look familiar to any of you ?

Thanks.

[Darko]

Hmm,honestly I don't see anything here

[Fossildude19]

That last item looks like a piece of Goniatite to me?  

What are you calling a Goniatite, ... if not that? 

 

 

see this post:

 

 

 

EDIT: Also, you are finding the internal molds of Orthocone cephalopods.  NOT Orthoceras. 

Possibly Michelinoceras, or some other Devonian orthocone from the Mahantango Formation.  

 

[Rocky Stoner]

6 minutes ago, Fossildude19 said:

That last item looks like a piece of Goniatite to me?  

What are you calling a Goniatite, ... if not that? 

 

 

Hi Tim.

The smaller piece in the first 2 pics is what I'm calling a known goniatite as it is identical in features as the others I have.

The larger flatter one in the last 3 pics is what looks a bit different in that it is much thinner in cross section but is very symmetrical.

Thanks,

[Fossildude19]

That looks more like a cyrtoconic  or brevicone cephalopod, to me. 

 

 

 

 

[Rocky Stoner]

Thanks Tim.

Very helpful info, much appreciated.  (orthocone corrections made to the topic)

 

Back to the grind.

With regards,

[Fossildude19]

Happy to help.   

Just want to make sure we're on the same page as far as terminology is concerned.  

[Rocky Stoner]

I think I picked that name up way back in this post ....   OrthoCERID (close, but not ceras)

I'll change it in my notes.

Thanks again.

[Manticocerasman]

I don't see any goniatites in there either. as for the large flat piece it could be the inner mould of 1 chamer of a larger orthocone, but it is impossible to be sure .

 

I realy like those orthocones

 

[Jeffrey P]

I think your larger piece resembles partial goniatites that I've encountered. Most are crushed (thinner), casts of the exterior of the shell. Most of these lack ornamentation except maybe some fine ribbing. Remnants of suture patterns are rare. A more complete example may be waiting for you to find. The smaller ones resemble nautiloids.

[BobWill]

There are certainly goniatites with that whorl profile and yours could be the body chamber which would account for the size and lack of ornamentation or sutures. I don't know Devonian genera but Gonioloboceras for one has the same shape and rounded venter. Your best hope is to find similar examples in the same area but with more features to help identify them.

[Rocky Stoner]

1 hour ago, Jeffrey P said:

I think your larger piece resembles partial goniatites that I've encountered. Most are crushed (thinner), casts of the exterior of the shell. Most of these lack ornamentation except maybe some fine ribbing. Remnants of suture patterns are rare. A more complete example may be waiting for you to find. The smaller ones resemble nautiloids.

 

20 minutes ago, BobWill said:

There are certainly goniatites with that whorl profile and yours could be the body chamber which would account for the size and lack of ornamentation or sutures. I don't know Devonian genera but Gonioloboceras for one has the same shape and rounded venter. Your best hope is to find similar examples in the same area but with more features to help identify them.

Here is a pic of the 4 found so far.

Left one is the first that I found last year.

Then one I found last week or so.

Then the small segment that I posted above along with the 2 orthocones and the larger piece.

On the right is the larger flattened one from this topic.

Might be hard to see in the pics, but #3 from the left is certainly a segment of the same proportions as 1 and 2.

 

Your descriptions describe these pieces very well.

Thank you,

[BobWill]

With no sutures or ornamentation these could even be nautiloids. Carlloceras sp. would not be far off just going by the shape.

[Rocky Stoner]

Prompted a search .. wiki

Centroceratidae

Very informative (more so, once I learn the proper nomenclature ) thanks Mr. Will.