Peat Burns Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 These tiny fossils all have a groove along the long axis. The surface is textured, but not reminiscent of bryozoan zooecia. Are these perhaps crinoid pinnules? Mineral Wells fossil Park, Keechi Creek Shale, Mineral Wells Fm., Late Pennsylvanian (Missourian). Scale in mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Looks like something an echinoderm would build. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Perhaps echinoderm spikes? “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 6 minutes ago, WhodamanHD said: Perhaps echinoderm spikes? You'll have to be more specific. Echinoids and crinoids potentially have spikes. I'm not sure they were around this early though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Just now, Rockwood said: You'll have to be more specific. Echinoids and crinoids potentially have spikes. I'm not sure they were around this early though. Neither am I, I was thinking echinoid spikes but I was throughing it out there to see if others could confirm or deny (hence the question mark) 1 “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DPS Ammonite Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Interesting. Let us look at the ends, are they a solid calcite crystal, hollow? Note the cellular texture (bryozoa?) on the outside. Do these appear to be complete and entire on all sides besides the small north (top) and south (bottom) ends? EDIT: A wild guess; part of a lobster/shrimp appendage. @BobWill what do you think? 1 My goal is to leave no stone or fossil unturned. See my Arizona Paleontology Guide link The best single resource for Arizona paleontology anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peat Burns Posted July 5, 2018 Author Share Posted July 5, 2018 1 minute ago, DPS Ammonite said: Interesting. Let us look at the ends, are they a solid calcite crystal, hollow? Note the cellular texture on the outside. Do these appear to be complete and entire on all sides besides the small north (top) and south (bottom) ends? @BobWill what do you think? I'll have to get a pic of the ends. From what I recall, they are solid (maybe mineral filled) and "C-shaped" in cross-section due to the longitudinal groove. All are broken except the acute end on the one pictured on the right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimB88 Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 they have a strange texture fore an echinoderm spine or the spine of a crinoid. they are strange. 16 minutes ago, DPS Ammonite said: EDIT: A wild guess; part of a lobster/shrimp appendage. you may be on to something... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peat Burns Posted July 6, 2018 Author Share Posted July 6, 2018 I got to thinking more about this and I may have let my fossil-colored glasses obscure my objectivity. This came from matrix I collected from the site and sifted, and it's quite possible this could be a conifer needle contaminant. I'll try to check later tonight to see if it is organic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bullsnake Posted July 6, 2018 Share Posted July 6, 2018 @Peat Burns I have found a lot of those with that same texture in the Hickory Creek shale in my area, along with the arrow shaped pieces I posted in the attached thread. I'm leaning toward crinoid. I hope this helps. 1 Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peat Burns Posted July 6, 2018 Author Share Posted July 6, 2018 @Rockwood, @WhodamanHD, @DPS Ammonite, @JimB88, @Bullsnake Well, I checked it, and it is definitely fossil / lithified. Here are some more pics showing the groove, the texture, and the "papillae" on the side opposite the groove. I checked the two crinoid calices that I have in my collection that actually have pinnules, and they just aren't preserved well enough to show detailed surface texture, and I don't see any with grooves. I am not familiar with any echinoids that have grooved spines (there are echinoids at the site, but all the spines I found there are terete in cross-section). I did find this thread that has an echinoid spine specimen with a similar groove Thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted July 6, 2018 Share Posted July 6, 2018 The end looks decidedly noncrinoid doesn't it ? Non crystalline for that matter. Could it be still coated with matrix ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobWill Posted July 6, 2018 Share Posted July 6, 2018 If by crinoid spikes you mean spines I don't believe they would have the longitudinal groove. This looks more like the food groove on a crinoid arm and I have seen some arm segments that are long like this. I'll look for a picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peat Burns Posted July 6, 2018 Author Share Posted July 6, 2018 9 minutes ago, BobWill said: If by crinoid spikes you mean spines I don't believe they would have the longitudinal groove. This looks more like the food groove on a crinoid arm and I have seen some arm segments that are long like this. I'll look for a picture. Thanks, Bob . (Who called the crinoid "spikes"?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobWill Posted July 6, 2018 Share Posted July 6, 2018 20 hours ago, Rockwood said: You'll have to be more specific. Echinoids and crinoids potentially have spikes. I'm not sure they were around this early though. I'm sure he meant to say spines. He was referring to a post by whodaman. Here are some arm segments also from Mineral Wells Fossil Park. and here are some arms without the grooves 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miocene_Mason Posted July 6, 2018 Share Posted July 6, 2018 2 minutes ago, BobWill said: some arms without the grooves I’m not sure whether to be amused or scared... “...whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been and are being evolved.” ~ Charles Darwin Happy hunting, Mason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peat Burns Posted July 6, 2018 Author Share Posted July 6, 2018 1 minute ago, BobWill said: and here are some arms without the grooves Thanks, Bob. I definitely see some in there that look similar. 2 minutes ago, BobWill said: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynot Posted July 6, 2018 Share Posted July 6, 2018 5 minutes ago, BobWill said: here are some arms without the grooves You a funny Guy! Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys." Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough." My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection My favorite thread on TFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobWill Posted July 6, 2018 Share Posted July 6, 2018 3 minutes ago, ynot said: You a funny Guy! I did not commit Barbicide to make that photo...they donated their limbs voluntarily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abyssunder Posted July 6, 2018 Share Posted July 6, 2018 The "v" grooves remind me of crinoid brachials, not saying they are, but ...close. " We are not separate and independent entities, but like links in a chain, and we could not by any means be what we are without those who went before us and showed us the way. " Thomas Mann My Library Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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