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darktheumbreon

Help with Lee Creek Micro Fossil Tooth ID

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darktheumbreon

I was going through some Aurora Creek matrix, and I found that this tooth was a bit more unusual than the rest. Its root is a bit wider and its blade is shorter than the other teeth I have found. I'm thinking it could either be an angel shark tooth or a hammerhead shark tooth.Image5.thumb.jpg.eec89feee021174b696e6dd6a591f289.jpgImage4.thumb.jpg.c064f452c24618bc478473ee283469ab.jpgImage3.thumb.jpg.27b2c0a93893ccae13b01bf0a0db6018.jpgImage2.thumb.jpg.096248a8483e10319e077bf41311f022.jpgImage1.thumb.jpg.767963969033f4422367ab0b00891ebd.jpg

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darktheumbreon

I also found this one interesting

Image7.thumb.jpg.5379f23a49cf6929a2ae137f9f9a3b75.jpgImage6.thumb.jpg.ae466ee8f9a2bc371135d17912512666.jpgImage8.thumb.jpg.b0dac1dafb3d8c26e0f4a6f317f4b55b.jpg

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darktheumbreon

Here are some more, one of them reminds me of an Isistius tooth.

Image15.thumb.jpg.1eb1d8af1529d71a64b112d5205c5ce6.jpgImage14.thumb.jpg.2b8e6db6ea19ea1c0f003917d84c345a.jpg

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darktheumbreon

Image21.thumb.jpg.a6b402f306f7a7d71ba04a8a6bb01966.jpgImage20.thumb.jpg.e9d112c6591368f9c11ada058df967ad.jpgImage19.thumb.jpg.82efa1aada17e321b1eb9d5146cc3e79.jpgImage18.thumb.jpg.9cf13e74a295834526be4ea8f0dac04a.jpg

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sixgill pete

@darktheumbreon My first question, Aurora Creek? Do you mean Aurora North Carolina, the Lee Creek mine? 

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sixgill pete

The tooth in your first series of pictures  appears to be of an extremely worn and broken shark tooth; probably not identifiable beyond that. The second tooth I believe is Rhizoprionodon sp., a.k.a. sharpnose shark. The third I do believe is Isistius sp., cookie cutter. Nice tooth. The last two are beoken and worn teeth, probably only identifiable to that pointy.

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sixgill pete

Let me also add that the cookie cutter tooth is an extremely rare tooth. 

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ynot

Is Your "cookie cutter" tooth flat or oval in cross section?

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darktheumbreon

@sixgill peteYes, that is what I meant by Aurora Creek - thanks for the correction and ID.

@ynot I tried to get a picture of the cross section of the tooth in question, it is definitely flatter than a typical tooth, however to me it doesn't seem as flat as the other tooth I found that is most definitely an Isistius tooth. I also included pictures of other teeth that I found slightly similar to the cookie cutter tooth I found because I'm not sure how to ID them (the tooth in question by ynot is to the left of the nice Isistius tooth). I haven't been able to find a good picture of how the upper Isistius tooth looks like, just drawings, and I kind of wonder what those look like.

Image24.jpg

Image25.jpg

Image26.jpg

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darktheumbreon

This appears to be a Rhinocodon tooth (Whale shark), what do you guys think?

Image27.thumb.jpg.f86ce5baaff4f22a13682d06dd596d37.jpgImage34.thumb.jpg.0f90a81586d15b4b627cc9b1bb523b8c.jpgImage31.thumb.jpg.1a356ea27b4ecaf485bd38ff0be71015.jpgImage29.thumb.jpg.cd5ffd60eb87b9d2950c064b67bb399e.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

Image30.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Al Dente
46 minutes ago, darktheumbreon said:

 

This appears to be a Rhinocodon tooth (Whale shark), what do you guys think?

 

Yes.

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sixgill pete
20 minutes ago, Al Dente said:

Yes.

I agree.

 

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ynot
3 hours ago, darktheumbreon said:

a picture of the cross section of the tooth in question,

Does not look like a cookie cutter to Me. They are paper thin, like the center one in the group shot. The upper teeth look like a needle and are very rare to find (I know of none that have been shown here on TFF even when asked for.)

 

I agree on the whale shark tooth

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darktheumbreon

@ynot Here are some better pictures of that tooth in question.  It does seem slightly thicker than my nice Isistius tooth, if it's not an Isistius tooth, what do you suppose it may be? I will include similar pictures taken of my nice Isistius tooth in another post for comparison. 

Image54.jpg

Image50.jpg

Image51.jpg

Image52.jpg

Image53.jpg

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darktheumbreon

@ynotHere is similar pictures taken of my nice Isistius tooth for comparison

Image55.jpg

Image56.jpg

Image57.jpg

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darktheumbreon

Also, looking up what the upper Isistius looks like got me curious. Here is a tooth I posted earlier, but with better views of itImage49.thumb.jpg.a32928fa9efd29f1bde628d1b940d104.jpgImage48.thumb.jpg.58a250c1b6a44208fcbb3e1079d234e5.jpgImage47.thumb.jpg.43138fd50faaeaec74854270aa861af3.jpgImage46.thumb.jpg.03de5aa8454ddb45d30983699b845746.jpgImage45.thumb.jpg.4b381ad59b62c4f7cb363a278d0f2717.jpg

This vaguely resembles pictures of the upper Isistius brasiliensis tooth I found here

Isistius_brasiliensis_5.jpg

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darktheumbreon

I'd suspect its probably a tooth of a different shark, but the thought feels nice... In another note, I found this tooth and I have no clue what it belongs to, maybe its an unusual position of a certain shark?

Image41.thumb.jpg.5cf5c6d02709e1e683c262dfc9cfd6b4.jpg Image39.thumb.jpg.79d36105627aaebc5f6c7a991dff4d31.jpgImage38.thumb.jpg.08e14f0da21a4d6331d6b50020f4ffa9.jpg

Image40.jpg

Image42.jpg

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ynot

I do not see an upper isserus.

Maybe @MarcoSr or @Al Dente will have a different opinion.

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MarcoSr
7 hours ago, ynot said:

I do not see an upper isserus.

Maybe @MarcoSr or @Al Dente will have a different opinion.

 

First to get a proper id of a micro tooth you need to know the size in millimeters.  Seeing the tooth in tweezers or next to a penny only tells you that this tooth is very small.  Also it is extremely difficult to id a damaged tooth where key diagnostic features are missing or unclear.

 

Upper Isistius teeth are much smaller than lower teeth and usually are 1 mm or smaller.  See the below picture from Cappetta 2012 which has scale bars.  Note the upper and lower teeth have different scale bars.

 

5b5b15fe3449c_IsistiusCappetta32012.thumb.jpg.a15c68d398685a0992942a5f79e4ad5f.jpg

 

Upper Isistius teeth are extremely rare from the fossil record.  I've only seen one described which Cappetta mentions below:

 

5b5b15ff72fcd_IsistiusCappetta42012.jpg.41dbbc72e68d3a2248897fa4305b8a3f.jpg

 

All of this being said, based upon the crown and root features of your tooth that remain and which can be seen in your pictures, your tooth does not compare favorably to an upper Isistius tooth in my opinion.

 

Marco Sr.

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darktheumbreon

Thank you, what you both said makes a lot of sense about the Isistius tooth. Hopefully someone will be able to find an upper eventually. 

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