Bronzviking Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 Hi, I was going through my shark teeth and found this odd little fossil. Found it on a SW Florida Beach. It's approximately 1/2' x 1/2", thickness 3/16" and triangular shaped. I thought drum fish tooth, but most of the pictures are roundish. What do you think it is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynot Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 Worn down fish tooth. Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys." Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough." My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection My favorite thread on TFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronzviking Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 4 minutes ago, ynot said: Worn down fish tooth. Any idea what kind of fish? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynot Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 No, sorry. But drum would fit (among other fish with crushing teeth). Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys." Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough." My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection My favorite thread on TFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digit Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 It's a bit large for most of the drum fish pharyngeal teeth that I find (but most of mine come from picking through micro-matrix). This image scraped from an online gallery seems to show that some of the crushing teeth along middle of the tooth plate might be a match. Cheers. -Ken 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Dente Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 I think it is part of a burrfish or porcupine fish tooth plate. It looks like typical layers found in these teeth. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digit Posted September 28, 2018 Share Posted September 28, 2018 Ah, yes--a partial Diodontidae mouth plate would seem a good match. Didn't come to mind as a part of a more complete fossil that we commonly find here in Florida. See photo for possible comparison. Cheers. -Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronzviking Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 10 minutes ago, digit said: Ah, yes--a partial Diodontidae mouth plate would seem a good match. Didn't come to mind as a part of a more complete fossil that we commonly find here in Florida. See photo for possible comparison. Cheers. -Ken Sorry Ken but I don't think it is a part of this plate or anything else. I think it is it's own entity. Look at the second photo--it has a shiny rim around the entire piece. The sides have a lot of detail as well. Could it be a plate or scute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronzviking Posted September 28, 2018 Author Share Posted September 28, 2018 3 hours ago, Al Dente said: I think it is part of a burrfish or porcupine fish tooth plate. It looks like typical layers found in these teeth. I see what your saying about layers but my fossils lines are going up and down not horizontally. See pic 3 thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Dente Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Take a look at 11 in this photo. Your second photo looks like half of the tooth plate in #11. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronzviking Posted September 29, 2018 Author Share Posted September 29, 2018 1 hour ago, Al Dente said: Take a look at 11 in this photo. Your second photo looks like half of the tooth plate in #11. Yes #11 does look similar. What is it a photo of? Also I found this pic off the TFF of drumfish teeth which looks alike too. Take a look at the 2nd photo and let me know what you think. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digit Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 From the worn down top surface, I can see the resemblance to part of the Diodontidae plate but the really sharp bottom edge is what made me initially consider a really large drum fish tooth. The photos from that nearly 10 year old posting have me back in the drum tooth camp. Amazing what information lies buried deep within the layers of this forum. If only there were some kind of metaphor for finding interesting and valuable things while hunting and digging through layers of material.....hmmm. Cheers. -Ken 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynot Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 10 minutes ago, digit said: If only there were some kind of metaphor for finding interesting and valuable things while hunting and digging through layers of material.. Hunting fossil threads on the fossil forum to turn up rare fossils buried within the fossil pages and fossil pictures. (never thought I could use the word "fossil" so many times in one sentence.) Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys." Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough." My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection My favorite thread on TFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daves64 Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 3 hours ago, digit said: Amazing what information lies buried deep within the layers of this forum. If only there were some kind of metaphor for finding interesting and valuable things while hunting and digging through layers of material.....hmmm. Cheers. -Ken An archeological expedition through the pages of the fossil forums.. Accomplishing the impossible means only that the boss will add it to your regular duties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Dente Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 7 hours ago, Bronzviking said: Yes #11 does look similar. What is it a photo of? Also I found this pic off the TFF of drumfish teeth which looks alike too. Take a look at the 2nd photo and let me know what you think. All the fossils in the photo that I posted are Diodon ( burrfish and porcupine fish) tooth plates. I’m certain your tooth fragment is not from a drum. Look again at the top of your tooth, it is layered. Drum teeth are rounded and smooth, not layered. Here’s the top of your tooth. Diodon teeth are made up of layers of enamel plates. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronzviking Posted September 29, 2018 Author Share Posted September 29, 2018 12 hours ago, ynot said: Hunting fossil threads on the fossil forum to turn up rare fossils buried within the fossil pages and fossil pictures. (never thought I could use the word "fossil" so many times in one sentence.) That's a lot of fossils Tony! Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronzviking Posted September 29, 2018 Author Share Posted September 29, 2018 7 hours ago, Al Dente said: All the fossils in the photo that I posted are Diodon ( burrfish and porcupine fish) tooth plates. I’m certain your tooth fragment is not from a drum. Look again at the top of your tooth, it is layered. Drum teeth are rounded and smooth, not layered. Here’s the top of your tooth. Diodon teeth are made up of layers of enamel plates. Yes I see what you mean about the layering. The drum teeth do tend to be more spherical. It seems to be a split vote. What we should consider now is fish size. The Diodon average size is 3" and max 3ft. The black drum fish are much much bigger up to 67". So would a 1/2" tooth fit in a Diodons mouth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronzviking Posted September 29, 2018 Author Share Posted September 29, 2018 I found more links and pics to compare. @Al Dente Pufferfish mouth plate. The first pic looks like half of what I have! PORCUPINE FISH MOUTH PLATE https://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fthumbs.worthpoint.com%2Fzoom%2Fimages3%2F1%2F0808%2F18%2Fflorida-river-fossillized-porcupine-fish-mouth_1_f844263b9eae783c5a434771583d3a99.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.worthpoint.com%2Fworthopedia%2Fflorida-river-fossillized-porcupine-fish-mouth&docid=5gdg2wb5Fm6XSM&tbnid=jCifVfCabHeOkM%3A&w=400&h=300&source=sh%2Fx%2Fim Drum Fish Mouth Plate Look at the circled areas on the ends. They are more triangular than circular. And if the tooth is worn like you suggest it might be flatter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plantguy Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Ben had provided this interesting info before in another thread on one of the recent Diodon species. I'm just providing this as a visual and relative comparison, not providing any ID or size estimate. I thought it was fascinating at what they found in one stomach and what those teeth/plates were doing! Lucius G. Eldredge Memorial Volume. Edited by N.L. Evenhuis & J.T. Carlton. Bishop Museum Bulletin in Zoology 9: 169–175 (2015). The Diet of Diodon hystrix (Teleostei: Tetraodontiformes): Shell-crushing on Guam’s Reefs GEERAT J. VERMEIJ & EDITH ZIPSER Department of Earth & Planetary Sciences, University of California, One Shields Avenue, Davis, California 95616, USA; email: gjvermeij@ucdavis.edu http://hbs.bishopmuseum.org/pubs-online/pdf/bz9-12.pdf Regards, Chris 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Dente Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 42 minutes ago, Plantguy said: Ben had provided this interesting info before in another thread on one of the recent Diodon species. I'm just providing this as a visual and relative comparison, not providing any ID or size estimate. I thought it was fascinating at what they found in one stomach and what those teeth/plates were doing! I caught a large porcupine fish years ago. I was using a fairly heavy saltwater hook baited with shrimp. It stole my bait a couple of times and completely bent my hook. The hook was folded in half. I replaced the hook and finally caught and released him. He was difficult to reel in which surprised me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronzviking Posted September 29, 2018 Author Share Posted September 29, 2018 1 hour ago, Plantguy said: Ben had provided this interesting info before in another thread on one of the recent Diodon species. I'm just providing this as a visual and relative comparison, not providing any ID or size estimate. I thought it was fascinating at what they found in one stomach and what those teeth/plates were doing! Lucius G. Eldredge Memorial Volume. Edited by N.L. Evenhuis & J.T. Carlton. Bishop Museum Bulletin in Zoology 9: 169–175 (2015). The Diet of Diodon hystrix (Teleostei: Tetraodontiformes): Shell-crushing on Guam’s Reefs GEERAT J. VERMEIJ & EDITH ZIPSER Department of Earth & Planetary Sciences, University of California, One Shields Avenue, Davis, California 95616, USA; email: gjvermeij@ucdavis.edu http://hbs.bishopmuseum.org/pubs-online/pdf/bz9-12.pdf Regards, Chris Wow that's a pile of shells! I'm getting a toothache, Lol. Thanks for the info! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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